GET https://kbin.spritesserver.nl/m/memes@lemmy.ml/t/2984/UBI-works-too/newest?p=1

Security

Token

There is no security token.

Firewall

main Name
Security enabled
Stateless

Configuration

Key Value
provider security.user.provider.concrete.app_user_provider
context main
entry_point App\Security\KbinAuthenticator
user_checker App\Security\UserChecker
access_denied_handler (none)
access_denied_url (none)
authenticators
[
  "two_factor"
  "remember_me"
  "App\Security\KbinAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\FacebookAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GoogleAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GithubAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\KeycloakAuthenticator"
]

Listeners

Listener Duration Response
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ChannelListener {#723
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -httpPort: 80
  -httpsPort: 443
}
0.00 ms (none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ContextListener {#706
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\TokenStorage {#1017 …}
  -sessionKey: "_security_main"
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -userProviders: Symfony\Component\DependencyInjection\Argument\RewindableGenerator {#705 …}
  -dispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
  -registered: false
  -trustResolver: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authentication\AuthenticationTrustResolver {#780 …}
  -sessionTrackerEnabler: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage::enableUsageTracking(): void {#703 …}
}
0.88 ms (none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AuthenticatorManagerListener {#584
  -authenticatorManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Authentication\AuthenticatorManager {#595 …}
}
0.00 ms (none)
Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Http\Firewall\TwoFactorAccessListener {#582
  -twoFactorFirewallConfig: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\TwoFactor\TwoFactorFirewallConfig {#842 …}
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -twoFactorAccessDecider: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\TwoFactorAccessDecider {#581 …}
}
0.04 ms (none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AccessListener {#579
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -accessDecisionManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\TraceableAccessDecisionManager {#937 …}
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
}
0.00 ms (none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\LogoutListener {#786
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -options: [
    "csrf_parameter" => "_csrf_token"
    "csrf_token_id" => "logout"
    "logout_path" => "app_logout"
  ]
  -httpUtils: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\HttpUtils {#841 …}
  -csrfTokenManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Csrf\CsrfTokenManager {#1015 …}
  -eventDispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
}
0.00 ms (none)

Authenticators

No authenticators have been recorded. Check previous profiles on your authentication endpoint.

Access Decision

affirmative Strategy
# Voter class
1
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\AuthenticatedVoter"
2
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
3
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
4
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\ExpressionVoter"
5
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
6
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
7
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
8
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
9
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
10
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
11
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
12
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
13
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
14
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"

Access decision log

# Result Attributes Object
1 DENIED ROLE_USER
null
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
2 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\Entry {#2388
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1943 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#266
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#247 …}
    +name: "memes@lemmy.ml"
    +title: "memes"
    +description: """
      #### Rules:\n
      \n
      1. Be civil and nice.\n
      2. Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you *have* to.
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 5926
    +entryCommentCount: 65073
    +postCount: 25
    +postCommentCount: 152
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729583092 {#276
      date: 2024-10-22 09:44:52.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#238 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#234 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#223 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#181 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#139 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#201 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#118 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#104 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#82 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#72 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#61 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1820 …}
    -id: 38
    +apId: "memes@lemmy.ml"
    +apProfileId: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/inbox"
    +apDomain: "lemmy.ml"
    +apPreferredUsername: "memes"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1728572889 {#270
      date: 2024-10-10 17:08:09.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696428223 {#272
      date: 2023-10-04 16:03:43.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#1962 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1924 …}
  +slug: "UBI-works-too"
  +title: "UBI works too"
  +url: "https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9b1e3e01-f8ac-4892-8207-1c8561313546.jpeg"
  +body: null
  +type: "image"
  +lang: "en"
  +isOc: false
  +hasEmbed: true
  +commentCount: 114
  +favouriteCount: 1058
  +score: 0
  +isAdult: false
  +sticky: false
  +lastActive: DateTime @1696903395 {#2410
    date: 2023-10-10 04:03:15.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +adaAmount: 0
  +tags: null
  +mentions: null
  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1886 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1973 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1948 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1927 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2442 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2440 …}
  +children: []
  -id: 2984
  -titleTs: "'ubi':1 'work':2"
  -bodyTs: null
  +cross: false
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +ranking: 1696582861
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.world/post/6329591"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696496461 {#1850
    date: 2023-10-05 11:01:01.0 +02:00
  }
}
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
3 DENIED edit
App\Entity\Entry {#2388
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1943 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#266
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#247 …}
    +name: "memes@lemmy.ml"
    +title: "memes"
    +description: """
      #### Rules:\n
      \n
      1. Be civil and nice.\n
      2. Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you *have* to.
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 5926
    +entryCommentCount: 65073
    +postCount: 25
    +postCommentCount: 152
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729583092 {#276
      date: 2024-10-22 09:44:52.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#238 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#234 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#223 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#181 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#139 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#201 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#118 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#104 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#82 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#72 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#61 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1820 …}
    -id: 38
    +apId: "memes@lemmy.ml"
    +apProfileId: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/inbox"
    +apDomain: "lemmy.ml"
    +apPreferredUsername: "memes"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1728572889 {#270
      date: 2024-10-10 17:08:09.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696428223 {#272
      date: 2023-10-04 16:03:43.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#1962 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1924 …}
  +slug: "UBI-works-too"
  +title: "UBI works too"
  +url: "https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9b1e3e01-f8ac-4892-8207-1c8561313546.jpeg"
  +body: null
  +type: "image"
  +lang: "en"
  +isOc: false
  +hasEmbed: true
  +commentCount: 114
  +favouriteCount: 1058
  +score: 0
  +isAdult: false
  +sticky: false
  +lastActive: DateTime @1696903395 {#2410
    date: 2023-10-10 04:03:15.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +adaAmount: 0
  +tags: null
  +mentions: null
  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1886 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1973 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1948 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1927 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2442 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2440 …}
  +children: []
  -id: 2984
  -titleTs: "'ubi':1 'work':2"
  -bodyTs: null
  +cross: false
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +ranking: 1696582861
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.world/post/6329591"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696496461 {#1850
    date: 2023-10-05 11:01:01.0 +02:00
  }
}
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
4 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\Entry {#2388
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1943 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#266
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#247 …}
    +name: "memes@lemmy.ml"
    +title: "memes"
    +description: """
      #### Rules:\n
      \n
      1. Be civil and nice.\n
      2. Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you *have* to.
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 5926
    +entryCommentCount: 65073
    +postCount: 25
    +postCommentCount: 152
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729583092 {#276
      date: 2024-10-22 09:44:52.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#238 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#234 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#223 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#181 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#139 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#201 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#118 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#104 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#82 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#72 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#61 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1820 …}
    -id: 38
    +apId: "memes@lemmy.ml"
    +apProfileId: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/inbox"
    +apDomain: "lemmy.ml"
    +apPreferredUsername: "memes"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1728572889 {#270
      date: 2024-10-10 17:08:09.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696428223 {#272
      date: 2023-10-04 16:03:43.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#1962 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1924 …}
  +slug: "UBI-works-too"
  +title: "UBI works too"
  +url: "https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9b1e3e01-f8ac-4892-8207-1c8561313546.jpeg"
  +body: null
  +type: "image"
  +lang: "en"
  +isOc: false
  +hasEmbed: true
  +commentCount: 114
  +favouriteCount: 1058
  +score: 0
  +isAdult: false
  +sticky: false
  +lastActive: DateTime @1696903395 {#2410
    date: 2023-10-10 04:03:15.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +adaAmount: 0
  +tags: null
  +mentions: null
  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1886 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1973 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1948 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1927 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2442 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2440 …}
  +children: []
  -id: 2984
  -titleTs: "'ubi':1 'work':2"
  -bodyTs: null
  +cross: false
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +ranking: 1696582861
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.world/post/6329591"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696496461 {#1850
    date: 2023-10-05 11:01:01.0 +02:00
  }
}
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
5 DENIED ROLE_USER
null
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
6 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3992
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1943 …}
  +entry: App\Entity\Entry {#2388
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1943 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#266
      +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#247 …}
      +name: "memes@lemmy.ml"
      +title: "memes"
      +description: """
        #### Rules:\n
        \n
        1. Be civil and nice.\n
        2. Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you *have* to.
        """
      +rules: null
      +subscriptionsCount: 1
      +entryCount: 5926
      +entryCommentCount: 65073
      +postCount: 25
      +postCommentCount: 152
      +isAdult: false
      +customCss: null
      +lastActive: DateTime @1729583092 {#276
        date: 2024-10-22 09:44:52.0 +02:00
      }
      +markedForDeletionAt: null
      +tags: null
      +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#238 …}
      +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#234 …}
      +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#223 …}
      +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#181 …}
      +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#139 …}
      +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#201 …}
      +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#118 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#104 …}
      +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#82 …}
      +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#72 …}
      +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#61 …}
      +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1820 …}
      -id: 38
      +apId: "memes@lemmy.ml"
      +apProfileId: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
      +apPublicUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes"
      +apFollowersUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/c/memes/followers"
      +apInboxUrl: "https://lemmy.ml/inbox"
      +apDomain: "lemmy.ml"
      +apPreferredUsername: "memes"
      +apDiscoverable: true
      +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
      +privateKey: null
      +publicKey: null
      +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1728572889 {#270
        date: 2024-10-10 17:08:09.0 +02:00
      }
      +apDeletedAt: null
      +apTimeoutAt: null
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696428223 {#272
        date: 2023-10-04 16:03:43.0 +02:00
      }
    }
    +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#1962 …}
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1924 …}
    +slug: "UBI-works-too"
    +title: "UBI works too"
    +url: "https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9b1e3e01-f8ac-4892-8207-1c8561313546.jpeg"
    +body: null
    +type: "image"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: true
    +commentCount: 114
    +favouriteCount: 1058
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1696903395 {#2410
      date: 2023-10-10 04:03:15.0 +02:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1886 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1973 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1948 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1927 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2442 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2440 …}
    +children: []
    -id: 2984
    -titleTs: "'ubi':1 'work':2"
    -bodyTs: null
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
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Show voter details
7 DENIED edit
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
8 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
9 DENIED ROLE_USER
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
10 DENIED moderate
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    \n
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ACCESS DENIED
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"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
11 DENIED edit
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18 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
19 DENIED edit
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Show voter details
20 DENIED moderate
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24 DENIED moderate
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      Okay all you commies get ready for politics 101\n
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30 DENIED moderate
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      Okay all you commies get ready for politics 101\n
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      Seriously, not joking, this is how you change people’s minds.
      """
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  +body: """
    I am a libertarian. One thing I think people of all political stripes need to do is to start judging policy proposals by their *outcomes* and stop judging policy proposals based on their *intentions.* So you want minimum wage because a higher minimum wage will lower poverty? But is raising minimum wage the right way to achieve that goal?\n
    \n
    Here are ten studies that provide some evidence that raising minimum wage does a poor job of lowering poverty:\n
    \n
    [1](https://www.nber.org/papers/w31182), [2](https://users.ssc.wisc.edu/~gwallace/Papers/Burkhauser%20and%20Sabia%20(2007).pdf),[3](https://wol.iza.org/articles/does-increasing-the-minimum-wage-reduce-poverty-in-developing-countries/long),[4](https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w6127/w6127.pdf),[5](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.4284/sej.2010.76.3.592),[6](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0927537111000716),[7](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1468-0106.2009.00467.x),[8](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12122-002-1016-4),[9](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10875549.2020.1869660),[10](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00220388.2022.2130056)\n
    \n
    See the thing with every policy is that it creates unintended consequences. If you tax gas, gas becomes more expensive and the price of food goes up, if you add zoning regulations it makes it harder to build and house prices go up, if you raise wages through legislation (even though we all want to make high wages) that raises the costs to businesses and they have to raise prices or reduce labour at the margin. This has the effect of helping specifically minimum wage workers but for people without a job making it harder to find one. In the long term prices will go up to make minimum wage feel like less than it used to, necessitating the need for constant minimum wage increases. Do you really want to be fighting the same fight all the time over minimum wage only to have it raised when it’s far too late and most people are already making more than the minimum wage? What a waste of political will.\n
    \n
    IMO UBI is a great option, Milton Friedman was famously very pro-UBI, but also need to be sensible about what regulations and laws we are passing and use a science and evidence-based approach, not one that sounds good when you first hear it.
    """
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      Okay all you commies get ready for politics 101\n
      \n
      First don’t rely on morals to make your argument. It, unfortunately, does not change capitalist minds.\n
      \n
      Second, frame your argument in capitalist rhetoric. For example you can say, “UBI is important to stimulate the economy by enabling Low-Income-Americans to spend more on essentials.”\n
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    I am a libertarian. One thing I think people of all political stripes need to do is to start judging policy proposals by their *outcomes* and stop judging policy proposals based on their *intentions.* So you want minimum wage because a higher minimum wage will lower poverty? But is raising minimum wage the right way to achieve that goal?\n
    \n
    Here are ten studies that provide some evidence that raising minimum wage does a poor job of lowering poverty:\n
    \n
    [1](https://www.nber.org/papers/w31182), [2](https://users.ssc.wisc.edu/~gwallace/Papers/Burkhauser%20and%20Sabia%20(2007).pdf),[3](https://wol.iza.org/articles/does-increasing-the-minimum-wage-reduce-poverty-in-developing-countries/long),[4](https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w6127/w6127.pdf),[5](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.4284/sej.2010.76.3.592),[6](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0927537111000716),[7](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1468-0106.2009.00467.x),[8](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12122-002-1016-4),[9](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10875549.2020.1869660),[10](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00220388.2022.2130056)\n
    \n
    See the thing with every policy is that it creates unintended consequences. If you tax gas, gas becomes more expensive and the price of food goes up, if you add zoning regulations it makes it harder to build and house prices go up, if you raise wages through legislation (even though we all want to make high wages) that raises the costs to businesses and they have to raise prices or reduce labour at the margin. This has the effect of helping specifically minimum wage workers but for people without a job making it harder to find one. In the long term prices will go up to make minimum wage feel like less than it used to, necessitating the need for constant minimum wage increases. Do you really want to be fighting the same fight all the time over minimum wage only to have it raised when it’s far too late and most people are already making more than the minimum wage? What a waste of political will.\n
    \n
    IMO UBI is a great option, Milton Friedman was famously very pro-UBI, but also need to be sensible about what regulations and laws we are passing and use a science and evidence-based approach, not one that sounds good when you first hear it.
    """
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      Okay all you commies get ready for politics 101\n
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      First don’t rely on morals to make your argument. It, unfortunately, does not change capitalist minds.\n
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    I am a libertarian. One thing I think people of all political stripes need to do is to start judging policy proposals by their *outcomes* and stop judging policy proposals based on their *intentions.* So you want minimum wage because a higher minimum wage will lower poverty? But is raising minimum wage the right way to achieve that goal?\n
    \n
    Here are ten studies that provide some evidence that raising minimum wage does a poor job of lowering poverty:\n
    \n
    [1](https://www.nber.org/papers/w31182), [2](https://users.ssc.wisc.edu/~gwallace/Papers/Burkhauser%20and%20Sabia%20(2007).pdf),[3](https://wol.iza.org/articles/does-increasing-the-minimum-wage-reduce-poverty-in-developing-countries/long),[4](https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w6127/w6127.pdf),[5](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.4284/sej.2010.76.3.592),[6](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0927537111000716),[7](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1468-0106.2009.00467.x),[8](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12122-002-1016-4),[9](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10875549.2020.1869660),[10](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00220388.2022.2130056)\n
    \n
    See the thing with every policy is that it creates unintended consequences. If you tax gas, gas becomes more expensive and the price of food goes up, if you add zoning regulations it makes it harder to build and house prices go up, if you raise wages through legislation (even though we all want to make high wages) that raises the costs to businesses and they have to raise prices or reduce labour at the margin. This has the effect of helping specifically minimum wage workers but for people without a job making it harder to find one. In the long term prices will go up to make minimum wage feel like less than it used to, necessitating the need for constant minimum wage increases. Do you really want to be fighting the same fight all the time over minimum wage only to have it raised when it’s far too late and most people are already making more than the minimum wage? What a waste of political will.\n
    \n
    IMO UBI is a great option, Milton Friedman was famously very pro-UBI, but also need to be sensible about what regulations and laws we are passing and use a science and evidence-based approach, not one that sounds good when you first hear it.
    """
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
36 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
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Show voter details
38 DENIED moderate
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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Show voter details
39 DENIED edit
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Show voter details
40 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
48 DENIED moderate
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
49 DENIED ROLE_USER
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
50 DENIED moderate
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
51 DENIED edit
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS DENIED
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
52 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\EntryComment {#4423
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
53 DENIED ROLE_USER
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
54 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
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Show voter details
56 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
57 DENIED ROLE_USER
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Show voter details
58 DENIED moderate
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    True deregulation would result in a form of psuedoregulation eventually.\n
    \n
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Show voter details
59 DENIED edit
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Show voter details
60 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
61 DENIED ROLE_USER
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62 DENIED moderate
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    Scrip is kinda low key a thing again. My SO works for wawa and there is definitely some scrip vibe. They have a company store, a points reward system, they will put you through school if you take classes that benefit the Corp, and the only way to move up is to basically bootlick management at weird company festivals.\n
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
63 DENIED edit
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        #### Rules:\n
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    Scrip is kinda low key a thing again. My SO works for wawa and there is definitely some scrip vibe. They have a company store, a points reward system, they will put you through school if you take classes that benefit the Corp, and the only way to move up is to basically bootlick management at weird company festivals.\n
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    """
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}
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Show voter details
64 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\EntryComment {#5165
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        #### Rules:\n
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    Scrip is kinda low key a thing again. My SO works for wawa and there is definitely some scrip vibe. They have a company store, a points reward system, they will put you through school if you take classes that benefit the Corp, and the only way to move up is to basically bootlick management at weird company festivals.\n
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Show voter details
65 DENIED ROLE_USER
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Show voter details
66 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
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72 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
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    This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
    \n
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Show voter details
79 DENIED edit
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        #### Rules:\n
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    This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
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    [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
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Show voter details
80 DENIED moderate
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  +body: """
    This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
    \n
    [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
    """
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
    +body: """
      This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
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    That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
    \n
    So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
    """
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      This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
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    That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
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    So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
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      This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
      """
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    That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
    \n
    So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
    """
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          +body: "Pretty much every study."
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        +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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      +body: """
        This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
        """
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    +body: """
      That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
      \n
      So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
      """
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    Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
    \n
    You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
    """
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          +body: "Pretty much every study."
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        +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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      +body: """
        This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
        """
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      That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
      \n
      So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
      """
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    Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
    \n
    You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
    """
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          +body: "Pretty much every study."
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        +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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      +body: """
        This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
        """
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      That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
      \n
      So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
      """
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    Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
    \n
    You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
    """
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            +body: "Pretty much every study."
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          +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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        +body: """
          This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
          \n
          [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
          """
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        That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
        \n
        So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
        """
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      Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
      \n
      You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
      """
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            +body: "Pretty much every study."
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          +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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        +body: """
          This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
          \n
          [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
          """
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        That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
        \n
        So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
        """
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      Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
      \n
      You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
      """
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          +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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        +body: """
          This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
          \n
          [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
          """
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      +body: """
        That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
        \n
        So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
        """
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    +body: """
      Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
      \n
      You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
      """
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              +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
              +body: "Pretty much every study."
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                "@Peaty@sh.itjust.works"
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            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
            +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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              "@Peaty@sh.itjust.works"
              "@HikingVet@lemmy.sdf.org"
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          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
          +body: """
            This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
            \n
            [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
            """
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        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
        +body: """
          That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
          \n
          So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
          """
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      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
      +body: """
        Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
        \n
        You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
        """
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
    +body: "This isn’t a list of studies it is a wikipedia link and if you are going to insult people’s intelligence you should probably understand the difference between a link and a study."
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4571}
  +body: """
    Or you could click the link and actually see that it references the studies by name.\n
    \n
    If you are going to refute shit, read it.
    """
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              +body: "Pretty much every study."
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            +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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            This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
            \n
            [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
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          That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
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          So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
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        Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
        \n
        You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
        """
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    Or you could click the link and actually see that it references the studies by name.\n
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    If you are going to refute shit, read it.
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              +body: "Pretty much every study."
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            +body: "Please provide them then and make sure they are studying UNIVERSAL basic income and not targeted basic income. If they didn’t give it to everyone and instead selected applicants it isn’t studying UBI."
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            This should give you a starting point. Start reading chuckles.\n
            \n
            [en.wikipedia.org/…/Universal_basic_income_pilots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_basic_income_pilots)
            """
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          That’s not a study and you might be surprised to find out Wikipedia is a shit source.\n
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          So do you have sources or are you just someone who never actually studied this subject?
          """
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        Well, chase down the studies listed.\n
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        You wanted a list of studies. This is a fucking list dipshit.
        """
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    Or you could click the link and actually see that it references the studies by name.\n
    \n
    If you are going to refute shit, read it.
    """
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102 DENIED moderate
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    Nobody making under 250k would be paying into it and unrealized gains would be included in figuring all personal income. The ultra rich are paid mostly in services like corporate jets, meals, stocks and options. Salary is pretty minimal compared to all the other perquisites that come with SVP/Director on up to the c-suite level jobs in the top 1000 US companies.\n
    \n
    If I made 350k all in and UBI takes 35k, I still take home 315k.\n
    \n
    Heck, that portion of income that goes to UBI doesn’t even have to count toward regular income taxes. It can be all pre-tax dollars.\n
    \n
    The thing is, the economy works best when everyone can participate fully. Locking huge swaths of it into personal fortunes nobody could hope to ever spend in a lifetime is wasteful and puts a huge drag on the overall economy. Sure, they can pop for houses and planes and yachts but that doesn’t really come close to the kind of economic power generated by millions of working poor buying their daily essentials.
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104 DENIED moderate
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106 DENIED moderate
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      Nobody making under 250k would be paying into it and unrealized gains would be included in figuring all personal income. The ultra rich are paid mostly in services like corporate jets, meals, stocks and options. Salary is pretty minimal compared to all the other perquisites that come with SVP/Director on up to the c-suite level jobs in the top 1000 US companies.\n
      \n
      If I made 350k all in and UBI takes 35k, I still take home 315k.\n
      \n
      Heck, that portion of income that goes to UBI doesn’t even have to count toward regular income taxes. It can be all pre-tax dollars.\n
      \n
      The thing is, the economy works best when everyone can participate fully. Locking huge swaths of it into personal fortunes nobody could hope to ever spend in a lifetime is wasteful and puts a huge drag on the overall economy. Sure, they can pop for houses and planes and yachts but that doesn’t really come close to the kind of economic power generated by millions of working poor buying their daily essentials.
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    Link your end with the start. The top earners don’t have the income to finance it.\n
    \n
    My point is not that UBI should be a tax on the rich but that regular citizens can finance it right now if they want it.\n
    \n
    You hope that UBI comes for free. It won’t. The majority has to pay it with higher taxes, voluntarily or not. So if they want it then don’t wait for politicians but implement it right now.
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Show voter details
107 DENIED edit
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      Nobody making under 250k would be paying into it and unrealized gains would be included in figuring all personal income. The ultra rich are paid mostly in services like corporate jets, meals, stocks and options. Salary is pretty minimal compared to all the other perquisites that come with SVP/Director on up to the c-suite level jobs in the top 1000 US companies.\n
      \n
      If I made 350k all in and UBI takes 35k, I still take home 315k.\n
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      Heck, that portion of income that goes to UBI doesn’t even have to count toward regular income taxes. It can be all pre-tax dollars.\n
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      The thing is, the economy works best when everyone can participate fully. Locking huge swaths of it into personal fortunes nobody could hope to ever spend in a lifetime is wasteful and puts a huge drag on the overall economy. Sure, they can pop for houses and planes and yachts but that doesn’t really come close to the kind of economic power generated by millions of working poor buying their daily essentials.
      """
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    Link your end with the start. The top earners don’t have the income to finance it.\n
    \n
    My point is not that UBI should be a tax on the rich but that regular citizens can finance it right now if they want it.\n
    \n
    You hope that UBI comes for free. It won’t. The majority has to pay it with higher taxes, voluntarily or not. So if they want it then don’t wait for politicians but implement it right now.
    """
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Show voter details
108 DENIED moderate
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      Nobody making under 250k would be paying into it and unrealized gains would be included in figuring all personal income. The ultra rich are paid mostly in services like corporate jets, meals, stocks and options. Salary is pretty minimal compared to all the other perquisites that come with SVP/Director on up to the c-suite level jobs in the top 1000 US companies.\n
      \n
      If I made 350k all in and UBI takes 35k, I still take home 315k.\n
      \n
      Heck, that portion of income that goes to UBI doesn’t even have to count toward regular income taxes. It can be all pre-tax dollars.\n
      \n
      The thing is, the economy works best when everyone can participate fully. Locking huge swaths of it into personal fortunes nobody could hope to ever spend in a lifetime is wasteful and puts a huge drag on the overall economy. Sure, they can pop for houses and planes and yachts but that doesn’t really come close to the kind of economic power generated by millions of working poor buying their daily essentials.
      """
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    Link your end with the start. The top earners don’t have the income to finance it.\n
    \n
    My point is not that UBI should be a tax on the rich but that regular citizens can finance it right now if they want it.\n
    \n
    You hope that UBI comes for free. It won’t. The majority has to pay it with higher taxes, voluntarily or not. So if they want it then don’t wait for politicians but implement it right now.
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    Income tax in Canada, where I live, is already 15-33%.\n
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    It’s already horribly mis-spent. If it went up, I’m pretty sure the country would riot.
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Show voter details
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Show voter details
113 DENIED ROLE_USER
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Show voter details
114 DENIED moderate
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      Income tax in Canada, where I live, is already 15-33%.\n
      \n
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    That’s why politicians won’t implement UBI. But you can do, as a private person. Other countries pay much more taxes.\n
    \n
    [en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax#/media/File%3A…](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax#/media/File%3APayroll_and_income_tax_by_country.png)
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Show voter details
115 DENIED edit
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    Zakat? It’s only 2.5% (can be up to 20% depending on what school of thought you follow) and it’s not distributed to everyone. There’s only a subset of people who are eligible in receiving zakat so it’s not UBI.\n
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Show voter details
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    Zakat? It’s only 2.5% (can be up to 20% depending on what school of thought you follow) and it’s not distributed to everyone. There’s only a subset of people who are eligible in receiving zakat so it’s not UBI.\n
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Show voter details
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Show voter details
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Show voter details
130 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
131 DENIED edit
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Show voter details
132 DENIED moderate
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    OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
    \n
    If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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Show voter details
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      OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
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      If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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    People live off one dollar per day.\n
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    You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
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Show voter details
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      OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
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      If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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    People live off one dollar per day.\n
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    You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
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Show voter details
136 DENIED moderate
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      OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
      \n
      If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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    People live off one dollar per day.\n
    \n
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    You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
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Show voter details
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138 DENIED moderate
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        OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
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        If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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      People live off one dollar per day.\n
      \n
      The most expensive part is medical insurance. That has to come down to international standards. 300 dollars a month should be enough.\n
      \n
      You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
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      """
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    > That leaves 4000 dollars for rent\n
    \n
    I think you can work out the next flaw in the plan for yourself.
    """
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Show voter details
139 DENIED edit
App\Entity\EntryComment {#5374
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        OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
        \n
        If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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        date: 2023-10-06 16:26:58.0 +02:00
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      People live off one dollar per day.\n
      \n
      The most expensive part is medical insurance. That has to come down to international standards. 300 dollars a month should be enough.\n
      \n
      You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
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      That leaves 4000 dollars for rent, clothing, phone and other expenses.
      """
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    > That leaves 4000 dollars for rent\n
    \n
    I think you can work out the next flaw in the plan for yourself.
    """
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Show voter details
140 DENIED moderate
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        #### Rules:\n
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        OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
        \n
        If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4644}
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      People live off one dollar per day.\n
      \n
      The most expensive part is medical insurance. That has to come down to international standards. 300 dollars a month should be enough.\n
      \n
      You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
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      date: 2023-10-06 16:38:31.0 +02:00
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4644}
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    > That leaves 4000 dollars for rent\n
    \n
    I think you can work out the next flaw in the plan for yourself.
    """
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
141 DENIED ROLE_USER
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Show voter details
142 DENIED moderate
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          OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
          \n
          If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
          """
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        People live off one dollar per day.\n
        \n
        The most expensive part is medical insurance. That has to come down to international standards. 300 dollars a month should be enough.\n
        \n
        You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
        \n
        That leaves 4000 dollars for rent, clothing, phone and other expenses.
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      > That leaves 4000 dollars for rent\n
      \n
      I think you can work out the next flaw in the plan for yourself.
      """
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    You call it flaw, I call it obstacle.\n
    \n
    If you look outside the US, you can get housing for a price that leaves enough of the 4000 for other expenses.\n
    \n
    The easiest option is to connect some barren land to a city center with public transport in a climate zone that doesn’t need much insulation. But that just as a proof of concept. More clever options can be realized.
    """
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
143 DENIED edit
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          OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
          \n
          If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
          """
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          date: 2023-10-06 16:26:58.0 +02:00
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        People live off one dollar per day.\n
        \n
        The most expensive part is medical insurance. That has to come down to international standards. 300 dollars a month should be enough.\n
        \n
        You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
        \n
        That leaves 4000 dollars for rent, clothing, phone and other expenses.
        """
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4644}
    +body: """
      > That leaves 4000 dollars for rent\n
      \n
      I think you can work out the next flaw in the plan for yourself.
      """
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      date: 2023-10-06 17:04:04.0 +02:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4644}
  +body: """
    You call it flaw, I call it obstacle.\n
    \n
    If you look outside the US, you can get housing for a price that leaves enough of the 4000 for other expenses.\n
    \n
    The easiest option is to connect some barren land to a city center with public transport in a climate zone that doesn’t need much insulation. But that just as a proof of concept. More clever options can be realized.
    """
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}
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
144 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\EntryComment {#5444
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        #### Rules:\n
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      date: 2023-10-05 11:01:01.0 +02:00
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    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#5327
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          +body: "Who would pledge 10% of their income to distribute as basic income? There is no need to wait until politicians implement it. We can start immediately."
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        +body: """
          OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
          \n
          If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
          """
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          date: 2023-10-06 16:26:58.0 +02:00
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      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4644}
      +body: """
        People live off one dollar per day.\n
        \n
        The most expensive part is medical insurance. That has to come down to international standards. 300 dollars a month should be enough.\n
        \n
        You need food from a central kitchen, about 1 dollar per day.\n
        \n
        That leaves 4000 dollars for rent, clothing, phone and other expenses.
        """
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        date: 2023-10-06 16:38:31.0 +02:00
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    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4644}
    +body: """
      > That leaves 4000 dollars for rent\n
      \n
      I think you can work out the next flaw in the plan for yourself.
      """
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      "@trailing9@lemmy.ml"
      "@Blackmist@feddit.uk"
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      date: 2023-10-06 17:04:04.0 +02:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#4644}
  +body: """
    You call it flaw, I call it obstacle.\n
    \n
    If you look outside the US, you can get housing for a price that leaves enough of the 4000 for other expenses.\n
    \n
    The easiest option is to connect some barren land to a city center with public transport in a climate zone that doesn’t need much insulation. But that just as a proof of concept. More clever options can be realized.
    """
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    "@trailing9@lemmy.ml"
    "@Blackmist@feddit.uk"
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}
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
145 DENIED ROLE_USER
null
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
ACCESS DENIED
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
146 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\EntryComment {#5342
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      +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#247 …}
      +name: "memes@lemmy.ml"
      +title: "memes"
      +description: """
        #### Rules:\n
        \n
        1. Be civil and nice.\n
        2. Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you *have* to.
        """
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        OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
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    With no other income at all?\n
    \n
    The point of UBI is that you *could* just live off that if you were frugal.\n
    \n
    Everybody gets it of course, but you’d lose 10% of your current wages too. Everyone under $80k would be better off, everyone over that would be worse off.\n
    \n
    The thing with UBI is that you’d lose all other state benefits too. Pretty much anything means tested would go and be replaced with one payment that everyone gets.
    """
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151 DENIED edit
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        OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
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        If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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    With no other income at all?\n
    \n
    The point of UBI is that you *could* just live off that if you were frugal.\n
    \n
    Everybody gets it of course, but you’d lose 10% of your current wages too. Everyone under $80k would be better off, everyone over that would be worse off.\n
    \n
    The thing with UBI is that you’d lose all other state benefits too. Pretty much anything means tested would go and be replaced with one payment that everyone gets.
    """
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Show voter details
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        OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
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        If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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    With no other income at all?\n
    \n
    The point of UBI is that you *could* just live off that if you were frugal.\n
    \n
    Everybody gets it of course, but you’d lose 10% of your current wages too. Everyone under $80k would be better off, everyone over that would be worse off.\n
    \n
    The thing with UBI is that you’d lose all other state benefits too. Pretty much anything means tested would go and be replaced with one payment that everyone gets.
    """
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Show voter details
154 DENIED moderate
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        OK, total personal income for the US is 21 trillion so you’ve raised $2.1t. 260 million adults. That’s about $8000 each. Can you live off that? I’m not sure I could and I own my home outright.\n
        \n
        If it’s not enough to live off, it’s not UBI.
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Show voter details
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Show voter details
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
164 DENIED moderate
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Show voter details
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
166 DENIED moderate
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
167 DENIED edit
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        #### Rules:\n
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Show voter details
168 DENIED moderate
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
170 DENIED moderate
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
171 DENIED edit
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
172 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\EntryComment {#4864
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Show voter details
173 DENIED ROLE_USER
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
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ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
174 DENIED moderate
App\Entity\EntryComment {#4937
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        Norway doesn’t have a minimum wage because the unions don’t want one. They believe having a set minimum wage sets a low anchor for negotiating, and that they can negotiate higher wages without one.\n
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    You can’t really compare US and Norwegian unions apples to apples. They don’t work the same way. In Norway they’re way more mainstream, work closer with the government, and they don’t employ people. There are no “union shops”, and no vote to join a union. You just join one while employed directly with your employer.\n
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    The risk of union workers getting fired and replaced with scabs is far less in Norway, because there is much stronger worker protection. These protections apply to everyone, not just the unionized workers, but they were achieved due to unions, years ago.\n
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    I don’t think you necessarily can draw any conclusions about strategy for Norwegian unions based on experience with US unions, or vice versa. They’re just different beasts.\n
    \n
    Note: Apologies if some of this is mildly incorrect, I have not been directly involved with union work in either country, and so I only have a high-level view of it all. Someone more experienced should be able to give more detailed information about union strategy in either country.
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    You can’t really compare US and Norwegian unions apples to apples. They don’t work the same way. In Norway they’re way more mainstream, work closer with the government, and they don’t employ people. There are no “union shops”, and no vote to join a union. You just join one while employed directly with your employer.\n
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    \n
    Note: Apologies if some of this is mildly incorrect, I have not been directly involved with union work in either country, and so I only have a high-level view of it all. Someone more experienced should be able to give more detailed information about union strategy in either country.
    """
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        Norway doesn’t have a minimum wage because the unions don’t want one. They believe having a set minimum wage sets a low anchor for negotiating, and that they can negotiate higher wages without one.\n
        \n
        Select industries do have a minimum wage for their specific field, though. And there’s a legal minimum you must pay teens working in summer internships, because they’re not unionized and often get lowballed.
        """
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    You can’t really compare US and Norwegian unions apples to apples. They don’t work the same way. In Norway they’re way more mainstream, work closer with the government, and they don’t employ people. There are no “union shops”, and no vote to join a union. You just join one while employed directly with your employer.\n
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    Note: Apologies if some of this is mildly incorrect, I have not been directly involved with union work in either country, and so I only have a high-level view of it all. Someone more experienced should be able to give more detailed information about union strategy in either country.
    """
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189 DENIED edit
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