GET https://kbin.spritesserver.nl/index.php/u/@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml/commented

Response
200 OK
IP
216.73.216.122
Profiled on
Token
01ebe5

Security

Token

There is no security token.

Firewall

main Name
Security enabled
Stateless

Configuration

Key Value
provider security.user.provider.concrete.app_user_provider
context main
entry_point App\Security\KbinAuthenticator
user_checker App\Security\UserChecker
access_denied_handler (none)
access_denied_url (none)
authenticators 
[
  "two_factor"
  "remember_me"
  "App\Security\KbinAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\FacebookAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GoogleAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GithubAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\KeycloakAuthenticator"
]

Listeners

Listener Duration Response 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ChannelListener {#723
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -httpPort: 80
  -httpsPort: 443
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ContextListener {#706
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\TokenStorage {#1017 …}
  -sessionKey: "_security_main"
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -userProviders: Symfony\Component\DependencyInjection\Argument\RewindableGenerator {#705 …}
  -dispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
  -registered: false
  -trustResolver: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authentication\AuthenticationTrustResolver {#780 …}
  -sessionTrackerEnabler: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage::enableUsageTracking(): void {#703 …}
}
 128.09 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AuthenticatorManagerListener {#584
  -authenticatorManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Authentication\AuthenticatorManager {#595 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Http\Firewall\TwoFactorAccessListener {#582
  -twoFactorFirewallConfig: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\TwoFactor\TwoFactorFirewallConfig {#842 …}
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -twoFactorAccessDecider: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\TwoFactorAccessDecider {#581 …}
}
 0.06 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AccessListener {#579
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -accessDecisionManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\TraceableAccessDecisionManager {#937 …}
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\LogoutListener {#786
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -options: [
    "csrf_parameter" => "_csrf_token"
    "csrf_token_id" => "logout"
    "logout_path" => "app_logout"
  ]
  -httpUtils: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\HttpUtils {#841 …}
  -csrfTokenManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Csrf\CsrfTokenManager {#1015 …}
  -eventDispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none)

Authenticators

No authenticators have been recorded. Check previous profiles on your authentication endpoint.

Access Decision

affirmative Strategy
# Voter class
1 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\AuthenticatedVoter"
2 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
3 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
4 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\ExpressionVoter"
5 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
6 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
7 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
8 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
9 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
10 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
11 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
12 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
13 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
14 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"

Access decision log

# Result Attributes Object
1 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
2 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1883
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2391 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2389 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2369 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2387 …}
  +body: """
    Not for [AdSense ads](https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/6242051), like what YouTube uses. Click-Through Rate (CTR) is only used to determine how much of a cut Google gives to the ad hosts, the advertisers just bid for the spots. The advertisers can see the CTR metrics, and so they might be willing to bid more, but that’s not guaranteed.\n
    \n
    So google makes money either way, and the advertisers spend money either way. The only difference is that your favorite websites and youtubers get paid too.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1697721178 {#1908
    date: 2023-10-19 15:12:58.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml"
    "@RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world"
    "@Voyajer@lemmy.world"
    "@LinkOpensChest_wav@lemmy.one"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2392 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2395 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1384 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1383 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1405 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1382 …}
  -id: 58836
  -bodyTs: "'/adsense/answer/6242051),':7 'ad':4,31 'adsens':3 'advertis':34,41,69 'bid':36,54 'click':13 'click-through':12 'ctr':16,45 'cut':26 'determin':21 'differ':76 'either':65,72 'favorit':80 'get':84 'give':28 'googl':27,62 'guarante':60 'host':32 'like':8 'make':63 'metric':46 'might':50 'money':64,71 'much':23 'paid':85 'rate':15 'see':43 'spend':70 'spot':39 'support.google.com':6 'support.google.com/adsense/answer/6242051),':5 'use':11,19 'way':66,73 'websit':81 'will':52 'youtub':10,83"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5029096"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1697721178 {#1407
    date: 2023-10-19 15:12:58.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 58836
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
3 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1883
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2391 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2389 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2369 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2387 …}
  +body: """
    Not for [AdSense ads](https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/6242051), like what YouTube uses. Click-Through Rate (CTR) is only used to determine how much of a cut Google gives to the ad hosts, the advertisers just bid for the spots. The advertisers can see the CTR metrics, and so they might be willing to bid more, but that’s not guaranteed.\n
    \n
    So google makes money either way, and the advertisers spend money either way. The only difference is that your favorite websites and youtubers get paid too.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1697721178 {#1908
    date: 2023-10-19 15:12:58.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml"
    "@RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world"
    "@Voyajer@lemmy.world"
    "@LinkOpensChest_wav@lemmy.one"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2392 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2395 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1384 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1383 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1405 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1382 …}
  -id: 58836
  -bodyTs: "'/adsense/answer/6242051),':7 'ad':4,31 'adsens':3 'advertis':34,41,69 'bid':36,54 'click':13 'click-through':12 'ctr':16,45 'cut':26 'determin':21 'differ':76 'either':65,72 'favorit':80 'get':84 'give':28 'googl':27,62 'guarante':60 'host':32 'like':8 'make':63 'metric':46 'might':50 'money':64,71 'much':23 'paid':85 'rate':15 'see':43 'spend':70 'spot':39 'support.google.com':6 'support.google.com/adsense/answer/6242051),':5 'use':11,19 'way':66,73 'websit':81 'will':52 'youtub':10,83"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5029096"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1697721178 {#1407
    date: 2023-10-19 15:12:58.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 58836
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
4 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1883
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2391 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2389 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2369 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2387 …}
  +body: """
    Not for [AdSense ads](https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/6242051), like what YouTube uses. Click-Through Rate (CTR) is only used to determine how much of a cut Google gives to the ad hosts, the advertisers just bid for the spots. The advertisers can see the CTR metrics, and so they might be willing to bid more, but that’s not guaranteed.\n
    \n
    So google makes money either way, and the advertisers spend money either way. The only difference is that your favorite websites and youtubers get paid too.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1697721178 {#1908
    date: 2023-10-19 15:12:58.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml"
    "@RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world"
    "@Voyajer@lemmy.world"
    "@LinkOpensChest_wav@lemmy.one"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2392 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2395 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1384 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1383 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1405 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1382 …}
  -id: 58836
  -bodyTs: "'/adsense/answer/6242051),':7 'ad':4,31 'adsens':3 'advertis':34,41,69 'bid':36,54 'click':13 'click-through':12 'ctr':16,45 'cut':26 'determin':21 'differ':76 'either':65,72 'favorit':80 'get':84 'give':28 'googl':27,62 'guarante':60 'host':32 'like':8 'make':63 'metric':46 'might':50 'money':64,71 'much':23 'paid':85 'rate':15 'see':43 'spend':70 'spot':39 'support.google.com':6 'support.google.com/adsense/answer/6242051),':5 'use':11,19 'way':66,73 'websit':81 'will':52 'youtub':10,83"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5029096"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1697721178 {#1407
    date: 2023-10-19 15:12:58.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 58836
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
5 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
6 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1349 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
  +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
    \n
    This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
    \n
    Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
    \n
    ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
    \n
    - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
    - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
    - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
    - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
    \n
    …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
    \n
    In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
    \n
    As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
    \n
    Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
    \n
    And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
    \n
    As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
    \n
    Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
    - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
    - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
    - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
    - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
    - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
    \n
    Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
    - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
    \n
    Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
    - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
    - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
    - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
    - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
    \n
    Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
    \n
    DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
    \n
    Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
    \n
    As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
    - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
    - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
    \n
    Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
    - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
    - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
    - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
    - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
    - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
    - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
    - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
    - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
    - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
    - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
    - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
    \n
    And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
    """
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        They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
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        X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
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      +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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      +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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7 DENIED edit 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013
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  +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
  +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
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  +body: """
    Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
    \n
    This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
    \n
    Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
    \n
    ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
    \n
    - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
    - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
    - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
    - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
    \n
    …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
    \n
    In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
    \n
    As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
    \n
    Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
    \n
    And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
    \n
    As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
    \n
    Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
    - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
    - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
    - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
    - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
    - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
    \n
    Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
    - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
    \n
    Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
    - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
    - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
    - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
    - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
    \n
    Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
    \n
    DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
    \n
    Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
    \n
    As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
    - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
    - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
    \n
    Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
    - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
    - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
    - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
    - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
    - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
    - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
    - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
    - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
    - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
    - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
    - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
    \n
    And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
    """
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        They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
        \n
        X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
        """
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      +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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      +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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  +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
  +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
    \n
    This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
    \n
    Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
    \n
    ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
    \n
    - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
    - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
    - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
    - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
    \n
    …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
    \n
    In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
    \n
    As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
    \n
    Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
    \n
    And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
    \n
    As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
    \n
    Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
    - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
    - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
    - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
    - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
    - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
    \n
    Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
    - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
    \n
    Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
    - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
    - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
    - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
    - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
    \n
    Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
    \n
    DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
    \n
    Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
    \n
    As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
    - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
    - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
    \n
    Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
    \n
    - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
    - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
    - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
    - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
    - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
    - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
    - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
    - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
    - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
    - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
    - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
    - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
    \n
    And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
    """
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    date: 2024-02-17 22:16:50.0 +01:00
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  +children: [
    1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2051
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2056 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2027 …}
      +body: """
        They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
        \n
        X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
        """
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        date: 2023-12-02 22:46:04.0 +01:00
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        "@theshatterstone54@feddit.uk"
        "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@lukas@lemmy.haigner.me"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2059 …}
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      -id: 190742
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        date: 2023-12-02 22:46:04.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 190742
    }
    2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2020
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2027 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2027 …}
      +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
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        date: 2023-11-18 06:07:57.0 +01:00
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        "@theshatterstone54@feddit.uk"
        "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2035 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2036 …}
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      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2061 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2084 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2076 …}
      -id: 136054
      -bodyTs: "'/~cks/space/blog/unix/waylandtechnicalmeritsirrelevant)':15 'irrelev':12 'merit':7 'most':11 'said':4 'someon':2 'technic':6 'utcc.utoronto.ca':14 'utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/waylandtechnicalmeritsirrelevant)':13 'wayland':9"
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        date: 2023-11-18 06:07:57.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 136054
    }
    0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2104
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2100 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2027 …}
      +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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        date: 2023-12-03 00:28:26.0 +01:00
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        "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@lukas@lemmy.haigner.me"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2099 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2108 …}
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      -id: 190770
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701559706 {#2041
        date: 2023-12-03 00:28:26.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 190770
    }
  ]
  -id: 13812
  -titleTs: "'articl':7 'boycott':5 'respons':2 'wayland':6"
  -bodyTs: "'-1':1800 '/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227':5 '/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)':1605 '/etc/os-release':571 '/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)':8 '/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)':996 '/usr/bin/wayland':152 '1':300,731,1798 '10':410 '2':307,734,1463 '2019':1257 '2024':981 '3':723 '4.20':984 '8':1625 '99':1748 'abandon':50 'absolut':147 'activ':1897 'adjust':883 'admit':1142 'agenda':1220 'allow':136,918,929 'alot':464 'alreadi':1427,1506 'also':239,808,993,1692,1760 'altern':895,1331,1347,1693 'alway':847 'amd':1035,1058 'announc':1417 'anymor':1893 'anyth':264,648,1886,1992 'anywher':962 'ao':1568 'api':618 'app':1846 'appar':1020 'appimag':665,791,818 'applic':111,258,270,365,371,446,460,526,602,685,699,863,950,1127,1646,1824 'appreci':2020 'arbirtrari':606 'argument':1155,1742 'articl':3,11,92,518,661,812,869,1140,1223,1372,1535,1918,1965,1979 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'consid':752,1068 'control':862 'convinc':33 'cooler':1517 'correct':366,783,1163,1920,2012 'couldn':642 'cours':1317,1655,1827 'crash':102 'cross':1136 'cruft':249 'current':599,1375 'd':1334 'de':299,306 'debian':436,575 'decid':387 'decor':1204 'default':433 'defenc':413 'deni':1065 'depend':1280 'des':1380,1403 'describ':1295 'design':100,920 'desktop':625,1968 'dev':416,1441,1491 'develop':144,259,591 'differ':278 'difficulti':1264 'disabl':1752 'discuss':1267 'doc':1592 'doesn':301,312,702,845,956,1649 'driver':1027,1071 'drm':1902 'drop':766,1456 'drop-in':1455 'dwl':1451 'dwm':1445 'edit':1102,1177,1577,1680 'effici':235 'effort':73 'either':393,1416 'els':963,1887 'enforc':587 'enlighten':1410 'enough':399,427,1770 'especi':851 'even':434,1383,1413 'everi':709 'evid':2017 'evidenc':1510 'exist':708,1513 'face':681 'fact':1343,1580 'fade':1549 'fair':1983 'fallback':827 'familiar':1907,1933 'fan':27 'far':965 'featur':318,331,1402 'fedora':762 'file':1969 'fit':177,1809 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  }
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   …2
}
 
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"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
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Show voter details
9 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
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Show voter details
10 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2051
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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        +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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        +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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    They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
    \n
    X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
    """
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#2051
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
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    +body: """
      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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        +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:07:57.0 +01:00
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          "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
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        -id: 136054
        -bodyTs: "'/~cks/space/blog/unix/waylandtechnicalmeritsirrelevant)':15 'irrelev':12 'merit':7 'most':11 'said':4 'someon':2 'technic':6 'utcc.utoronto.ca':14 'utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/waylandtechnicalmeritsirrelevant)':13 'wayland':9"
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:07:57.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136054
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2104
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2100 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2027 …}
        +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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          "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@lukas@lemmy.haigner.me"
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        +"title": 190770
      }
    ]
    -id: 13812
    -titleTs: "'articl':7 'boycott':5 'respons':2 'wayland':6"
    -bodyTs: "'-1':1800 '/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227':5 '/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)':1605 '/etc/os-release':571 '/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)':8 '/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)':996 '/usr/bin/wayland':152 '1':300,731,1798 '10':410 '2':307,734,1463 '2019':1257 '2024':981 '3':723 '4.20':984 '8':1625 '99':1748 'abandon':50 'absolut':147 'activ':1897 'adjust':883 'admit':1142 'agenda':1220 'allow':136,918,929 'alot':464 'alreadi':1427,1506 'also':239,808,993,1692,1760 'altern':895,1331,1347,1693 'alway':847 'amd':1035,1058 'announc':1417 'anymor':1893 'anyth':264,648,1886,1992 'anywher':962 'ao':1568 'api':618 'app':1846 'appar':1020 'appimag':665,791,818 'applic':111,258,270,365,371,446,460,526,602,685,699,863,950,1127,1646,1824 'appreci':2020 'arbirtrari':606 'argument':1155,1742 'articl':3,11,92,518,661,812,869,1140,1223,1372,1535,1918,1965,1979 'askpass':1703 'assum':775,1097,1571,1736,1883,1938 'atom':1727 'attempt':1508 'autom':675 'automat':826 'avoid':179 'awar':450 'away':1550 'awesom':1490 'awesomewm':1483 'back':503,976,2014 'backend':473 'base':1980 'basic':1587 'becom':425,1777 'better':1766,1768,1778 'bias':1149 'biggest':1477 'bill':1811 'boom':951 'bother':645 'break':362,523,674,790,836,899,1153,1232,1276,1289,1298,1554,1607,1635,1701,1725,1744,1785,1815,1855,1865,1889,1901,1927,1941,1951 'brodi':505 'broken':98,1585 'bsd':1154 'budgi':1409 'built':58,374,842 'bunch':163 'busi':395 'bwing':74 'call':1450,1459,1466 'cannot':128 'case':1576,1863,1949,1960 'challeng':1503 'chang':266,470,570,1593 'choos':941 'cinnamon':1408 'clear':562,566 'clipboard':1699 'close':1240 'closer':1009 'code':1396 'color':885,1890 'colour':860 'come':404,975 'comment':559,1112,1689 'compar':1781 'complet':768 'complex':1391 'complic':1201 'compon':84 'compositor':115,122,213,244,279,339,857,1186,1923 'conclud':1974 'confirm':1063 'consid':752,1068 'control':862 'convinc':33 'cooler':1517 'correct':366,783,1163,1920,2012 'couldn':642 'cours':1317,1655,1827 'crash':102 'cross':1136 'cruft':249 'current':599,1375 'd':1334 'de':299,306 'debian':436,575 'decid':387 'decor':1204 'default':433 'defenc':413 'deni':1065 'depend':1280 'des':1380,1403 'describ':1295 'design':100,920 'desktop':625,1968 'dev':416,1441,1491 'develop':144,259,591 'differ':278 'difficulti':1264 'disabl':1752 'discuss':1267 'doc':1592 'doesn':301,312,702,845,956,1649 'driver':1027,1071 'drm':1902 'drop':766,1456 'drop-in':1455 'dwl':1451 'dwm':1445 'edit':1102,1177,1577,1680 'effici':235 'effort':73 'either':393,1416 'els':963,1887 'enforc':587 'enlighten':1410 'enough':399,427,1770 'especi':851 'even':434,1383,1413 'everi':709 'evid':2017 'evidenc':1510 'exist':708,1513 'face':681 'fact':1343,1580 'fade':1549 'fair':1983 'fallback':827 'familiar':1907,1933 'fan':27 'far':965 'featur':318,331,1402 'fedora':762 'file':1969 'fit':177,1809 'fix':781,1101,1260,1274 'follow':368,1265 'forese':1175 'freebsd':26,68,1188 'full':18 'function':1366 'futur':1176 'game':1745 'gamer':1759 'gammastep':897 'gave':481 'get':12,910,1008,1765 'gist.github.com':4,7 'gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)':6 'github.com':1604 'github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)':1603 'given':1388 'global':729,743,900,911 'gnome':286,543,615,651,726,733,1219,1404 'go':89 'got':1991 'graphic':472 'great':800 'guess':1161,1335,1629 'gui':1126 'guy':22 'happen':342,1670,1674 'hardwar':1004,1053,1123 'heard':710,1019,1078,1209 'hire':1439 'home':1930 'hope':1772 'hotkey':901,912 'howev':329,813 'hyprland':509,906,926 'i3':1452 'icewm':1539 'icon':1953 'ignor':1578 'implement':167,214,221,317,336,935,961,1362 'improv':1082 'in-hom':1928 'incred':757 'instert':1358 'integr':227 'intel':1052,1070,1086,1105,1122 'intend':1384 'introduc':987 'irrespons':398 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'writer':662,1141 'wrong':788,1679,1993 'x':1823 'x11':689,1283,1300,1313,1645,1726 'x11-only':1282,1299 'xcb':823 'xclip':1636,1642,1695 'xdm':1538 'xdotool':1786 'xfce':974,983,1407 'xkill':1816 'xmonad':1436 'xorg':40,188,767,844,1364,1552,1672,1783 'xorg-lik':1363 'xprop':1287 'xrandr':1345 'xwayland':831,1845 'ydotool':712,1791,1808 'yeah':1857,1943,1954 'year':190,411,439 'yes':112,153,199,691,1367,1788,1818 'yet':1014,1179 'zoom':537,553,590,601,638"
    +cross: false
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    +apId: "https://feddit.uk/post/4608014"
    +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700502248 {#1353
      date: 2023-11-20 18:44:08.0 +01:00
    }
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700219396 {#1981
      date: 2023-11-17 12:09:56.0 +01:00
    }
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     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2056 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2027 …}
  +body: """
    They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
    \n
    X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
    """
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    "@theshatterstone54@feddit.uk"
    "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@lukas@lemmy.haigner.me"
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#2051
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1349 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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        +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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        +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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    They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
    \n
    X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
    """
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#2020
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
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    +body: """
      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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          They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
          \n
          X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
          """
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        +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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  +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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15 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2020
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
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    +body: """
      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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          They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
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          X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
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        +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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  +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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16 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2020
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
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      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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          They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
          \n
          X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
          """
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701553564 {#2048
          date: 2023-12-02 22:46:04.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190742
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2020}
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        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2027 …}
        +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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          "@theshatterstone54@feddit.uk"
          "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@lukas@lemmy.haigner.me"
        ]
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        -id: 190770
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    -id: 13812
    -titleTs: "'articl':7 'boycott':5 'respons':2 'wayland':6"
    -bodyTs: "'-1':1800 '/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227':5 '/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)':1605 '/etc/os-release':571 '/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)':8 '/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)':996 '/usr/bin/wayland':152 '1':300,731,1798 '10':410 '2':307,734,1463 '2019':1257 '2024':981 '3':723 '4.20':984 '8':1625 '99':1748 'abandon':50 'absolut':147 'activ':1897 'adjust':883 'admit':1142 'agenda':1220 'allow':136,918,929 'alot':464 'alreadi':1427,1506 'also':239,808,993,1692,1760 'altern':895,1331,1347,1693 'alway':847 'amd':1035,1058 'announc':1417 'anymor':1893 'anyth':264,648,1886,1992 'anywher':962 'ao':1568 'api':618 'app':1846 'appar':1020 'appimag':665,791,818 'applic':111,258,270,365,371,446,460,526,602,685,699,863,950,1127,1646,1824 'appreci':2020 'arbirtrari':606 'argument':1155,1742 'articl':3,11,92,518,661,812,869,1140,1223,1372,1535,1918,1965,1979 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     …2
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  +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#2104
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2013
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1349 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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        +body: """
          They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
          \n
          X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
          """
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        +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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  +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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19 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2104
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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        +body: """
          They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
          \n
          X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
          """
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        +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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  +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#2104
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    +slug: "A-response-to-the-Boycott-Wayland-article"
    +title: "A response to the "Boycott Wayland" article"
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      Link to article: [gist.github.com/…/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f227…](https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277?permalink_comment_id=4749746)\n
      \n
      This OUTDATED article gets posted all the time. The full story is the guy is a massive FreeBSD fan so he is trying to convince more people to keep on using Xorg because he wants to make sure it isn’t abandoned. Reason for that being that Wayland is built with Linux in mind and would not work under FreeBSD without a lot of effort bwing put in as it uses some Linux-specific components or libraries.\n
      \n
      Let’s go through the article point by point:\n
      \n
      ##### Wayland is broken by design:\n
      \n
      - *A crash in the window manager takes down all running applications*: Yes, because the compositor IS the server, window manager AND compositor at the same time.\n
      - *You cannot do a lot of things*: What, like allowing Windows to see your keystrokes, which makes developing a keylogger absolutely trivial?\n
      - *There is not /usr/bin/wayland*: Yes, because Wayland is a set of protocols, which a bunch of projects can implement as few or as many of, as they see fit, thus avoiding the issue of “unmaintainable mess” that has plagued Xorg for years.\n
      - *It offloads work to the window manager*: Again, yes, that’s a part of its structure: do the protocols, then let the compositor implement them. That way, you have multiple implementations running simultaneously that are well integrated with their window managers and thus more efficient and performant. It also means that when a compositor suffers from too much cruft, we can just make a new one, while application developers wouldn’t really have anything to change because if their application works on Wayland, then it works on different compositors (unless it is made specifically for GNOME, or specifically for wlroots, like wlr-randr)\n
      \n
      …*so what works on DE 1, doesn’t necessarily work on DE 2*: True, because oftentimes, it doesn’t need to. Not implementing features can lead to a more lean and streamlined software solution. However, sometimes features are necessary and only implemented in some compositors. This usually happens because the universal solution is not ready. KDE are often known to do this with Plasma and KWin.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen recording applications*: Correction: The following screen recording applications were not built to support Wayland (because Wayland is new to them or they just decided not to, or they were either too busy or too irresponsible enough to realise Wayland is coming, and has been for over 10 years. In defence of the devs, they probably wanted to make sure Wayland will become stable enough, but it has been the default even on Debian for many years now, so…\n
      \n
      In terms of the applications, I’m not aware of many of them, and for this sort of application, I’m sire alot of work is required to change the graphical backend, so I understood that some smaller projects gave up, but OBS has been working on Wayland for quite a while. Is it perfect? I don’t think so, but back when Brodie Robertson was using Hyprland, he was recording his videos using OBS. This article is quite outdated.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks screen sharing applications*:\n
      \n
      As the update shows, Jitsi now does work on Wayland.\n
      \n
      Zoom only seemed to work on gnome, BUT if you open up the Link to the zoom issue and read through the comments, there is clearly a person that clearly states that they changed /etc/os-release from PureOS to debian and it worked for them, all because of some pointless limitations enforced by the Zoom developers. As the person posting the issue states “Currently, the zoom application has put an arbirtrary restriction on screensharing so it ONLY works on GNOME, when the api being used works on all wayland desktops.” Read that again. It’s a pointless restriction put there by the Zoom team because they couldn’t be bothered to test anything non-GNOME.\n
      \n
      And the last issue is a problem with the article writer’s own appimage. I don’t know about that one.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks automation software*\n
      \n
      As stated IN YOUR FACE, it is an application that works on X11 only. Yes, Wayland is not made to use such applications, but it doesn’t mean they can’t exist. Every heard of ydotool (remember that name)? Now you have.\n
      \n
      Next up, we have 3 issues about GNOME and KDE global menus (1 for GNOME, 2 for KDE). From the little I know about global menus and using these projects, as well as considering that they are both incredibly stable on Wayland and Fedora KDE will be dropping Xorg completely, I think it’s safe to assume these issues have probably been fixed. Please correct me if I’m wrong.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks AppImages that don’t ship a special QT plugin*: Great! Just ship the plugins then! Problem solved! Also, quote from the article: “However, there is a workaround: “AppImages which ship just the XCB plugin will automatically fallback to running in xwayland mode” (see below).”\n
      - *Wayland breaks Redshift*: Once again, a program built for Xorg doesn’t always work on Wayland. Especially if it works with the compositor, like a colour temperature control application, or a wallpaper setter. The article quotes that “Redshift does not support Wayland since it offers no way to adjust the color temperature” which is not true, as proven by Redshift alternatives like Gammastep.\n
      - *Wayland breaks global hotkeys*: I present to you: Hyprland (where you can get global hotkeys). Now, it is normally not allowed by design, as a security measure, but Hyprland has not allowed that to stop them from implementing a solution where you can choose keys that will be passed on to the application. Boom, problem solved. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be implemented anywhere else, as far as I know.\n
      - *Wayland does not work for XFCE*: Come back to me in late 2024 after XFCE 4.20, which will introduce Wayland support, has been released. Also, [wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap](https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap)\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Nvidia Hardware*: It keeps on getting closer but is not there yet, or so I’ve heard. Apparently, the issue is with the proprietary drivers, as noveau works well. But I use AMD, so I’m only working off rumours and opinions here.\n
      - *Wayland does not work properly on Intel hardware*: Again, I’m using AMD, so I can’t confirm or deny this, but considering the Intel drivers are open source, and I’ve heard about many, many improvements made on the Intel side of things, I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been fixed.\n
      \n
      Edit: As multiple Intel users have pointed out in the comments, there seem to be no issues on Wayland with Intel hardware.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland prevents GUI applications from running as root*: This one has been crossed out as the article writer admits there is a solution\n
      - *Wayland is biased towards Linux and breaks BSD*: Arguments seem valid, and I’m guessing, are correct. This one is likely true and will remain so for the foreseeable future.\n
      \n
      Edit: And yet, it seems that there are Wayland compositors for FreeBSD, so the above might only be true for OpenBSD and others.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland complicates server side decorations*: From what I’ve heard, this is true, mainly something to do with some GNOME agenda, as the article states. I think that one is true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks windows raising/activating themselves*: The linked issue is closed and seems to be resolved. There is a mention of a WIP protocol at the time (2019) that woukd fix this. I had difficulty following the discussion, but I think this has been fixed.\n
      - *Wayland breaks RescueTime*: Because RescueTime depends on X11-only tools like xprop.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window manager*: What you’re describing is Wayland breaking X11-only tools for doing various tasks in a window manager. They are X11 tools, so of course they don’t work on Wayland. I’m not sure if there are alternatives, but I’d guess there probably are. I know for a fact that Xrandr has alternatives like wlr-randr and kanshi for wlroots.\n
      - *Wayland requires {instert WM here} to implement Xorg-like functionality*:Yes, it does.\n
      \n
      Quote from article: "As it currently stands minor WMs and DEs do not even intend to support Wayland given the sheer complexity of writing all the code required to support the above features. "\n
      \n
      DEs: GNOME, KDE, MATE, XFCE, Cinnamon, Budgie, Enlightenment, and recently even Pantheon have either announced to start work on, have started work on, or already support Wayland.\n
      \n
      Window managers: Qtile is doing it. Xmonad wants to hire a dev to do it. Dwm has a spiritual successor called dwl. i3 has a drop-in replacement called sway. Openbox has 2 spiritual successors called labwc and waybox. Now you might notice one of the biggest WMs is missing on here: AwesomeWM, which is such a shame. The Awesome devs have said they would be okay with someone taking on that challenge (which has already been attempted, as evidenced by the existence of way-cooler), but it seems that they wouldn’t do it themselves.\n
      \n
      As for the projects mentioned in the article, (JWM, TWM, XDM, IceWM) they are too small and obscure, and will likely fade away with Xorg.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks _NET_WM_STATE_SKIP_TASKBAR protocol* I don’t know about that one, ao I’ll assume it is still the case. Edit: Ignoring the fact that the link is broken, it basically just links to a docs change where skipTaskbar is marked as unsupported on Linux. Link: [github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226](https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/33226)\n
      - *Wayland breaks NoMachine NX* The link points to a page that has this marked as “SOLVED, Released in version 8” so I’m guessing it has been solved.\n
      - *Wayland breaks Xclip*: As you said it yourself, Xclip is an X11 application, so it doesn’t work on Wayland. Of course it wouldn’t work on Wayland. With Wayland, we’re trying to prevent what happened with Xorg from happening again, or am I wrong?\n
      \n
      Edit: As pointed out by some people in the comments, there are also alternatives to xclip like wl-clipboard.\n
      \n
      - *Wayland breaks SUDO_ASKPASS*: That link seems to point to the way this issue has been resolved so I don’t see your point.\n
      - *Wayland breaks X11 atoms*: I lack knowledge on the topic so will assume this to be a valid argument\n
      - *Wayland break games*: I’m 99% sure you can disable Vsync??? But I’m not a gamer. Also, WINE on Wayland is getting better and better. Soon enough, I hope the subpar performance will become better performance (when compared to Xorg)\n
      - *Wayland breaks xdotool*: Well, yes. There is ydotool, but you’re looking for a 1-to-1 replacement and I’m not sure if ydotool fits the bill for that.\n
      - *Wayland breaks xkill*: Well, yes. Again. It is an X application, so of course it does. Though for some reason I remember it working once on wayland. Must have been an xwayland app, or maybe I’m just misremembering this.\n
      - *Wayland breaks screensavers*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks setting the window position*: That is a WIP for Plasma, not sure about any other projects, so assume true for anything else.\n
      - *Wayland breaks color management*: Not anymore. That is being actively worked on.\n
      - *Wayland breaks DRM leasing*: While not rhat familiar with the issue, my understanding of the topic is the article is correct: not all compositors support it.\n
      - *Wayland breaks in-home streaming*: Not familiar with this, so will assume true.\n
      - *Wayland breaks NetWM/EWMH*: Yeah, that seems to be the case.\n
      - *Wayland breaks window icons*: Yeah, that seems to be the case, as said in the article, when no .desktop files are used.\n
      \n
      And that concludes my response to this article based on my fairly limited knowledge on the topic. If I got anything wrong, please, please let me know. As you can see my knowledge is quite limited, and as such, any corrections (preferably backed up with evidence) would be appreciated
      """
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        +body: """
          They hated her for she spoke the truth. We (DIY people) hate to acknowledge that not everyone sees value in investing as much time and energy into perfecting their workspaces as the nerds have, and would rather have their tools Just Work™ so they can get to work on the projects they do care about. I say this as someone who still gets frustrated and argumentative when my friends say they prefer spyware-ridden OSes that remove control from the end-user because they don’t require end-user micro-management to maintain and work.\n
          \n
          X vs Wayland might as well be Grub vs rEFInd or systemd vs SysVinit to most end-users: it matters from a technical perspective, but most people just want something that will allow them to go about their business without sinking hours into getting the “correct” option to work. And it’s important to remember that we all fall on either side of this divide with some aspects of our life, even if it’s not computer-related. How often do we agonize over finding the “correct” pipe wrench when our sink is leaking, despite what the plumbing nerds would criticize you for using? Do you sink hours into picking the right books on conflict resolution when you argue with your spouse, or do you post on AITA and hope they give good advice? Do you agonize over having all the right utensils and ingredients so you can eke out the most subtle flavors from your cooking, or do you use the pan that you got at the local superstore?
          """
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        +body: "As someone once said: [“The Technical Merits of Wayland Are Mostly Irrelevant”](https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/unix/WaylandTechnicalMeritsIrrelevant)"
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      date: 2023-11-20 18:44:08.0 +01:00
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     …2
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  +body: "For the four groups enumerated in the article, this still is not important. It may affect them in ways they are unaware of, but you will not be able to change their minds using technical arguments at this point if they have not already been convinced by the wealth of information and support that is readily available."
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    "@theshatterstone54@feddit.uk"
    "@mnglw@beehaw.org"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@lukas@lemmy.haigner.me"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2099 …}
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    date: 2023-12-03 00:28:26.0 +01:00
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  +"title": 190770
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
21 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
22 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2370
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
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  +slug: "What-is-the-least-SEO-fucked-search-engine"
  +title: "What is the least SEO-fucked search engine?"
  +url: null
  +body: "What search engine is currently showing the most useful results? What other tricks do we have aside of adding “reddit” or whatever internet community to the results?"
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  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2626 …}
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  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2635 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2637 …}
  +children: [
    App\Entity\EntryComment {#1725
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      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2370 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
      +body: "I can agree with the google placement if you’re assuming the searcher has experience with search operators, most of the time if I’m not wasting time crafting my search results to exclude all the SEO spam sites and Q&A sites written with the same amount of padding as a middle school book report, DuckDuckGo will give me better results than Google."
      +lang: "en"
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      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1724 …}
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      -id: 20169
      -bodyTs: "'agre':3 'amount':48 'assum':11 'better':61 'book':55 'craft':29 'duckduckgo':57 'exclud':34 'experi':15 'give':59 'googl':6,64 'm':25 'middl':53 'oper':18 'pad':50 'placement':7 'q':41 're':10 'report':56 'result':32,62 'school':54 'search':17,31 'searcher':13 'seo':37 'site':39,43 'spam':38 'time':22,28 'wast':27 'written':44"
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  ]
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  +cross: false
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689447681 {#2608
    date: 2023-07-15 21:01:21.0 +02:00
  }
  +__isInitialized__: true
   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
23 DENIED edit 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2370
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "What-is-the-least-SEO-fucked-search-engine"
  +title: "What is the least SEO-fucked search engine?"
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  }
  +ip: null
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  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2626 …}
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  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2635 …}
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  +children: [
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      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
      +body: "I can agree with the google placement if you’re assuming the searcher has experience with search operators, most of the time if I’m not wasting time crafting my search results to exclude all the SEO spam sites and Q&A sites written with the same amount of padding as a middle school book report, DuckDuckGo will give me better results than Google."
      +lang: "en"
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      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1724 …}
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      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1720 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1717 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2360 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1727 …}
      -id: 20169
      -bodyTs: "'agre':3 'amount':48 'assum':11 'better':61 'book':55 'craft':29 'duckduckgo':57 'exclud':34 'experi':15 'give':59 'googl':6,64 'm':25 'middl':53 'oper':18 'pad':50 'placement':7 'q':41 're':10 'report':56 'result':32,62 'school':54 'search':17,31 'searcher':13 'seo':37 'site':39,43 'spam':38 'time':22,28 'wast':27 'written':44"
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689447681 {#2608
    date: 2023-07-15 21:01:21.0 +02:00
  }
  +__isInitialized__: true
   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
24 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2370
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  +children: [
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      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
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      +body: "I can agree with the google placement if you’re assuming the searcher has experience with search operators, most of the time if I’m not wasting time crafting my search results to exclude all the SEO spam sites and Q&A sites written with the same amount of padding as a middle school book report, DuckDuckGo will give me better results than Google."
      +lang: "en"
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        "@hitagi@ani.social"
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      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1724 …}
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      -id: 20169
      -bodyTs: "'agre':3 'amount':48 'assum':11 'better':61 'book':55 'craft':29 'duckduckgo':57 'exclud':34 'experi':15 'give':59 'googl':6,64 'm':25 'middl':53 'oper':18 'pad':50 'placement':7 'q':41 're':10 'report':56 'result':32,62 'school':54 'search':17,31 'searcher':13 'seo':37 'site':39,43 'spam':38 'time':22,28 'wast':27 'written':44"
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  -id: 1310
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  +cross: false
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    date: 2023-07-15 21:01:21.0 +02:00
  }
  +__isInitialized__: true
   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
25 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
26 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1725
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    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2637 …}
    +children: [
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    -id: 1310
    -titleTs: "'engin':9 'fuck':7 'least':4 'search':8 'seo':6 'seo-fuck':5"
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    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
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  +body: "I can agree with the google placement if you’re assuming the searcher has experience with search operators, most of the time if I’m not wasting time crafting my search results to exclude all the SEO spam sites and Q&A sites written with the same amount of padding as a middle school book report, DuckDuckGo will give me better results than Google."
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  -id: 20169
  -bodyTs: "'agre':3 'amount':48 'assum':11 'better':61 'book':55 'craft':29 'duckduckgo':57 'exclud':34 'experi':15 'give':59 'googl':6,64 'm':25 'middl':53 'oper':18 'pad':50 'placement':7 'q':41 're':10 'report':56 'result':32,62 'school':54 'search':17,31 'searcher':13 'seo':37 'site':39,43 'spam':38 'time':22,28 'wast':27 'written':44"
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689558196 {#1611
    date: 2023-07-17 03:43:16.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 20169
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
27 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1725
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2370
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2585 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "What-is-the-least-SEO-fucked-search-engine"
    +title: "What is the least SEO-fucked search engine?"
    +url: null
    +body: "What search engine is currently showing the most useful results? What other tricks do we have aside of adding “reddit” or whatever internet community to the results?"
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 143
    +favouriteCount: 305
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1689564519 {#2621
      date: 2023-07-17 05:28:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2626 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2629 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2631 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2633 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2635 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2637 …}
    +children: [
      App\Entity\EntryComment {#1725}
    ]
    -id: 1310
    -titleTs: "'engin':9 'fuck':7 'least':4 'search':8 'seo':6 'seo-fuck':5"
    -bodyTs: "'ad':19 'asid':17 'communiti':24 'current':5 'engin':3 'internet':23 'reddit':20 'result':10,27 'search':2 'show':6 'trick':13 'use':9 'whatev':22"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1689534081
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/post/2081083"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689447681 {#2608
      date: 2023-07-15 21:01:21.0 +02:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
  +body: "I can agree with the google placement if you’re assuming the searcher has experience with search operators, most of the time if I’m not wasting time crafting my search results to exclude all the SEO spam sites and Q&A sites written with the same amount of padding as a middle school book report, DuckDuckGo will give me better results than Google."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 4
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1689558196 {#1795
    date: 2023-07-17 03:43:16.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@leninmummy@lemmy.ml"
    "@hitagi@ani.social"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1724 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1714 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1720 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1717 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2360 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1727 …}
  -id: 20169
  -bodyTs: "'agre':3 'amount':48 'assum':11 'better':61 'book':55 'craft':29 'duckduckgo':57 'exclud':34 'experi':15 'give':59 'googl':6,64 'm':25 'middl':53 'oper':18 'pad':50 'placement':7 'q':41 're':10 'report':56 'result':32,62 'school':54 'search':17,31 'searcher':13 'seo':37 'site':39,43 'spam':38 'time':22,28 'wast':27 'written':44"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/1650291"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689558196 {#1611
    date: 2023-07-17 03:43:16.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 20169
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
28 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1725
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2370
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2585 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "What-is-the-least-SEO-fucked-search-engine"
    +title: "What is the least SEO-fucked search engine?"
    +url: null
    +body: "What search engine is currently showing the most useful results? What other tricks do we have aside of adding “reddit” or whatever internet community to the results?"
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 143
    +favouriteCount: 305
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1689564519 {#2621
      date: 2023-07-17 05:28:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2626 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2629 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2631 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2633 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2635 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2637 …}
    +children: [
      App\Entity\EntryComment {#1725}
    ]
    -id: 1310
    -titleTs: "'engin':9 'fuck':7 'least':4 'search':8 'seo':6 'seo-fuck':5"
    -bodyTs: "'ad':19 'asid':17 'communiti':24 'current':5 'engin':3 'internet':23 'reddit':20 'result':10,27 'search':2 'show':6 'trick':13 'use':9 'whatev':22"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1689534081
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/post/2081083"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689447681 {#2608
      date: 2023-07-15 21:01:21.0 +02:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1729 …}
  +body: "I can agree with the google placement if you’re assuming the searcher has experience with search operators, most of the time if I’m not wasting time crafting my search results to exclude all the SEO spam sites and Q&A sites written with the same amount of padding as a middle school book report, DuckDuckGo will give me better results than Google."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 4
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1689558196 {#1795
    date: 2023-07-17 03:43:16.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@leninmummy@lemmy.ml"
    "@hitagi@ani.social"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1724 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1714 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1720 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1717 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2360 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1727 …}
  -id: 20169
  -bodyTs: "'agre':3 'amount':48 'assum':11 'better':61 'book':55 'craft':29 'duckduckgo':57 'exclud':34 'experi':15 'give':59 'googl':6,64 'm':25 'middl':53 'oper':18 'pad':50 'placement':7 'q':41 're':10 'report':56 'result':32,62 'school':54 'search':17,31 'searcher':13 'seo':37 'site':39,43 'spam':38 'time':22,28 'wast':27 'written':44"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/1650291"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689558196 {#1611
    date: 2023-07-17 03:43:16.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 20169
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
29 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
30 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2295
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2002 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Switched-from-Ubuntu-to-Debian-yesterday"
  +title: "Switched from Ubuntu to Debian yesterday"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    Why switch?\n
    -----------\n
    \n
    I played with the idea of switching for quite a while. Having switched my daily driver from Windows maybe 6-9 Months ago I made many mistakes in the meantime.\n
    \n
    Good and bad\n
    ------------\n
    \n
    This may have led to a diminshed experience with ubuntu but all in all, I was very pleased to see that Linux works as a daily driver. Still, I was unhappy with the kind of dumbed down gnome experience.\n
    \n
    Problems\n
    --------\n
    \n
    There were errors neither I nor people I asked could fix and the snap situation on ubuntu (just the fact that they’re proprietary, nothing else).\n
    \n
    Installation\n
    ------------\n
    \n
    Installing debian (and kde) was easier and harder than I expected. The download mirror I used must not have been great although its very close to my location because it took ages although my internet connections is good.\n
    \n
    Apps\n
    ----\n
    \n
    Since I switched to Linux, I toned down my app diet a lot. Installing all my apps from ubuntu was as easy as writing a short list and going through discover. Later I added flatpak which gave me a couple apps not available through discover (such as fluffychat). The last two I copied directly as appimages.\n
    \n
    Games\n
    -----\n
    \n
    I was scared that the „old kernel“ of stable debian would be a problem. As it turns out, everthing works great so far, a lot better than on ubuntu which might or might not be my fault.\n
    \n
    Instability\n
    -----------\n
    \n
    Kde does have some quirks that irritate me a bit like installing timeshift (because I tried network backups which dont work with it and the native backup solution does not seem to accept my sambashare) led to a window I could only close by rebooting.\n
    \n
    Boot time\n
    ---------\n
    \n
    What does feel a bit odd is the boot process. After my bios splash, it shows „welcome to grub“ and then switches to the debian start menu for 3 seconds or so, then shows some terminal stuff and then starts kde splash and then login. This feels a lot longer than ubuntu did. Its probably easy to change in some config but its also something that should be obvious.\n
    \n
    Summary\n
    -------\n
    \n
    So far I‘m incredibly happy although I ran into initramfs already probably because of timeshift which I threw out again. I might do a manual backup if nothing else works. My games dont freeze or stutter which is nice. All apps I had on ubuntu now work on debian and no snaps at all.\n
    \n
    **TL;DR:** If you feel adventurous, debian and kde are a pretty awesome mix and rid you of the proprietary ubuntu snap store. It also doesnt tell you that you can get security upgrades if you subscribe to ubuntu pro. Works the same if not better.
    """
  +type: "article"
  +lang: "en"
  +isOc: false
  +hasEmbed: false
  +commentCount: 117
  +favouriteCount: 184
  +score: 0
  +isAdult: false
  +sticky: false
  +lastActive: DateTime @1729557959 {#2676
    date: 2024-10-22 02:45:59.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +adaAmount: 0
  +tags: null
  +mentions: null
  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2642 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2683 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2685 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2687 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2689 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2691 …}
  +children: [
    App\Entity\EntryComment {#2296
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2295 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
      +body: """
        Please report back in a few weeks and a few months, and maybe even a year or two down the road.\n
        \n
        Generally “I’m really (happy/upset/confused/sad) with it” after only a day isn’t really good feedback for people thinking of changing, but it does provide a good baseline to measure against once you’re more familiar with it, and getting glimpses into your learning curve might be really helpful for people looking for advice on which OS to go with.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 5
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1729217832 {#2294
        date: 2024-10-18 04:17:12.0 +02:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2281 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2280 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2278 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2279 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2277 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2220 …}
      -id: 347712
      -bodyTs: "'advic':75 'back':3 'baselin':49 'chang':42 'curv':66 'day':32 'even':14 'familiar':57 'feedback':37 'general':22 'get':61 'glimps':62 'go':80 'good':36,48 'happy/upset/confused/sad':26 'help':70 'isn':33 'learn':65 'look':73 'm':24 'mayb':13 'measur':51 'might':67 'month':11 'os':78 'peopl':39,72 'pleas':1 'provid':46 're':55 'realli':25,35,69 'report':2 'road':21 'think':40 'two':18 'week':7 'year':16"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/7830031"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706469826 {#2290
        date: 2024-01-28 20:23:46.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 347712
    }
  ]
  -id: 33404
  -titleTs: "'debian':5 'switch':1 'ubuntu':3 'yesterday':6"
  -bodyTs: "'-9':23 '3':312 '6':22 'accept':269 'ad':175 'adventur':414 'age':134 'ago':25 'alreadi':365 'also':347,433 'although':124,135,360 'app':141,151,158,182,395 'appimag':197 'ask':84 'avail':184 'awesom':421 'backup':254,263,380 'bad':35 'better':224,454 'bio':296 'bit':246,288 'boot':282,292 'chang':341 'close':127,279 'config':344 'connect':138 'copi':194 'could':85,277 'coupl':181 'daili':17,61 'debian':104,208,308,403,415 'diet':152 'diminsh':42 'direct':195 'discov':172,186 'doesnt':434 'dont':256,387 'download':115 'dr':410 'driver':18,62 'dumb':71 'easi':163,339 'easier':108 'els':101,383 'error':78 'everth':217 'expect':113 'experi':43,74 'fact':95 'far':221,355 'fault':235 'feel':286,330,413 'fix':86 'flatpak':176 'fluffychat':189 'freez':388 'game':198,386 'gave':178 'get':440 'gnome':73 'go':170 'good':33,140 'great':123,219 'grub':302 'happi':359 'harder':110 'idea':7 'incred':358 'initramf':364 'instabl':236 'instal':102,103,155,248 'internet':137 'irrit':243 'kde':106,237,324,417 'kernel':205 'kind':69 'last':191 'later':173 'led':39,272 'like':247 'linux':57,146 'list':168 'locat':130 'login':328 'longer':333 'lot':154,223,332 'm':357 'made':27 'mani':28 'manual':379 'may':37 'mayb':21 'meantim':32 'menu':310 'might':229,231,376 'mirror':116 'mistak':29 'mix':422 'month':24 'must':119 'nativ':262 'neither':79 'network':253 'nice':393 'noth':100,382 'obvious':352 'odd':289 'old':204 'peopl':82 'play':4 'pleas':53 'pretti':420 'pro':448 'probabl':338,366 'problem':75,212 'process':293 'proprietari':99,428 'quirk':241 'quit':11 'ran':362 're':98 'reboot':281 'rid':424 'sambashar':271 'scare':201 'second':313 'secur':441 'see':55 'seem':267 'short':167 'show':299,317 'sinc':142 'situat':90 'snap':89,406,430 'solut':264 'someth':348 'splash':297,325 'stabl':207 'start':309,323 'still':63 'store':431 'stuff':320 'stutter':390 'subscrib':445 'summari':353 'switch':2,9,15,144,305 'tell':435 'termin':319 'threw':372 'time':283 'timeshift':249,369 'tl':409 'tone':148 'took':133 'tri':252 'turn':215 'two':192 'ubuntu':45,92,160,227,335,399,429,447 'unhappi':66 'upgrad':442 'use':118 'welcom':300 'window':20,275 'work':58,218,257,384,401,449 'would':209 'write':165"
  +cross: false
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +ranking: 1706436956
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.giftedmc.com/post/192020"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706350556 {#2665
    date: 2024-01-27 11:15:56.0 +01:00
  }
  +__isInitialized__: true
   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
31 DENIED edit 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2295
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2002 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Switched-from-Ubuntu-to-Debian-yesterday"
  +title: "Switched from Ubuntu to Debian yesterday"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    Why switch?\n
    -----------\n
    \n
    I played with the idea of switching for quite a while. Having switched my daily driver from Windows maybe 6-9 Months ago I made many mistakes in the meantime.\n
    \n
    Good and bad\n
    ------------\n
    \n
    This may have led to a diminshed experience with ubuntu but all in all, I was very pleased to see that Linux works as a daily driver. Still, I was unhappy with the kind of dumbed down gnome experience.\n
    \n
    Problems\n
    --------\n
    \n
    There were errors neither I nor people I asked could fix and the snap situation on ubuntu (just the fact that they’re proprietary, nothing else).\n
    \n
    Installation\n
    ------------\n
    \n
    Installing debian (and kde) was easier and harder than I expected. The download mirror I used must not have been great although its very close to my location because it took ages although my internet connections is good.\n
    \n
    Apps\n
    ----\n
    \n
    Since I switched to Linux, I toned down my app diet a lot. Installing all my apps from ubuntu was as easy as writing a short list and going through discover. Later I added flatpak which gave me a couple apps not available through discover (such as fluffychat). The last two I copied directly as appimages.\n
    \n
    Games\n
    -----\n
    \n
    I was scared that the „old kernel“ of stable debian would be a problem. As it turns out, everthing works great so far, a lot better than on ubuntu which might or might not be my fault.\n
    \n
    Instability\n
    -----------\n
    \n
    Kde does have some quirks that irritate me a bit like installing timeshift (because I tried network backups which dont work with it and the native backup solution does not seem to accept my sambashare) led to a window I could only close by rebooting.\n
    \n
    Boot time\n
    ---------\n
    \n
    What does feel a bit odd is the boot process. After my bios splash, it shows „welcome to grub“ and then switches to the debian start menu for 3 seconds or so, then shows some terminal stuff and then starts kde splash and then login. This feels a lot longer than ubuntu did. Its probably easy to change in some config but its also something that should be obvious.\n
    \n
    Summary\n
    -------\n
    \n
    So far I‘m incredibly happy although I ran into initramfs already probably because of timeshift which I threw out again. I might do a manual backup if nothing else works. My games dont freeze or stutter which is nice. All apps I had on ubuntu now work on debian and no snaps at all.\n
    \n
    **TL;DR:** If you feel adventurous, debian and kde are a pretty awesome mix and rid you of the proprietary ubuntu snap store. It also doesnt tell you that you can get security upgrades if you subscribe to ubuntu pro. Works the same if not better.
    """
  +type: "article"
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      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
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        Please report back in a few weeks and a few months, and maybe even a year or two down the road.\n
        \n
        Generally “I’m really (happy/upset/confused/sad) with it” after only a day isn’t really good feedback for people thinking of changing, but it does provide a good baseline to measure against once you’re more familiar with it, and getting glimpses into your learning curve might be really helpful for people looking for advice on which OS to go with.
        """
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        date: 2024-10-18 04:17:12.0 +02:00
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        date: 2024-01-28 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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  -titleTs: "'debian':5 'switch':1 'ubuntu':3 'yesterday':6"
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    date: 2024-01-27 11:15:56.0 +01:00
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32 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2295
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  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Switched-from-Ubuntu-to-Debian-yesterday"
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  +url: null
  +body: """
    Why switch?\n
    -----------\n
    \n
    I played with the idea of switching for quite a while. Having switched my daily driver from Windows maybe 6-9 Months ago I made many mistakes in the meantime.\n
    \n
    Good and bad\n
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    This may have led to a diminshed experience with ubuntu but all in all, I was very pleased to see that Linux works as a daily driver. Still, I was unhappy with the kind of dumbed down gnome experience.\n
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    -------\n
    \n
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    \n
    **TL;DR:** If you feel adventurous, debian and kde are a pretty awesome mix and rid you of the proprietary ubuntu snap store. It also doesnt tell you that you can get security upgrades if you subscribe to ubuntu pro. Works the same if not better.
    """
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        Please report back in a few weeks and a few months, and maybe even a year or two down the road.\n
        \n
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33 DENIED ROLE_USER 
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34 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2296
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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    +image: null
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    +slug: "Switched-from-Ubuntu-to-Debian-yesterday"
    +title: "Switched from Ubuntu to Debian yesterday"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Why switch?\n
      -----------\n
      \n
      I played with the idea of switching for quite a while. Having switched my daily driver from Windows maybe 6-9 Months ago I made many mistakes in the meantime.\n
      \n
      Good and bad\n
      ------------\n
      \n
      This may have led to a diminshed experience with ubuntu but all in all, I was very pleased to see that Linux works as a daily driver. Still, I was unhappy with the kind of dumbed down gnome experience.\n
      \n
      Problems\n
      --------\n
      \n
      There were errors neither I nor people I asked could fix and the snap situation on ubuntu (just the fact that they’re proprietary, nothing else).\n
      \n
      Installation\n
      ------------\n
      \n
      Installing debian (and kde) was easier and harder than I expected. The download mirror I used must not have been great although its very close to my location because it took ages although my internet connections is good.\n
      \n
      Apps\n
      ----\n
      \n
      Since I switched to Linux, I toned down my app diet a lot. Installing all my apps from ubuntu was as easy as writing a short list and going through discover. Later I added flatpak which gave me a couple apps not available through discover (such as fluffychat). The last two I copied directly as appimages.\n
      \n
      Games\n
      -----\n
      \n
      I was scared that the „old kernel“ of stable debian would be a problem. As it turns out, everthing works great so far, a lot better than on ubuntu which might or might not be my fault.\n
      \n
      Instability\n
      -----------\n
      \n
      Kde does have some quirks that irritate me a bit like installing timeshift (because I tried network backups which dont work with it and the native backup solution does not seem to accept my sambashare) led to a window I could only close by rebooting.\n
      \n
      Boot time\n
      ---------\n
      \n
      What does feel a bit odd is the boot process. After my bios splash, it shows „welcome to grub“ and then switches to the debian start menu for 3 seconds or so, then shows some terminal stuff and then starts kde splash and then login. This feels a lot longer than ubuntu did. Its probably easy to change in some config but its also something that should be obvious.\n
      \n
      Summary\n
      -------\n
      \n
      So far I‘m incredibly happy although I ran into initramfs already probably because of timeshift which I threw out again. I might do a manual backup if nothing else works. My games dont freeze or stutter which is nice. All apps I had on ubuntu now work on debian and no snaps at all.\n
      \n
      **TL;DR:** If you feel adventurous, debian and kde are a pretty awesome mix and rid you of the proprietary ubuntu snap store. It also doesnt tell you that you can get security upgrades if you subscribe to ubuntu pro. Works the same if not better.
      """
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    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1706436956
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://lemmy.giftedmc.com/post/192020"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706350556 {#2665
      date: 2024-01-27 11:15:56.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    Please report back in a few weeks and a few months, and maybe even a year or two down the road.\n
    \n
    Generally “I’m really (happy/upset/confused/sad) with it” after only a day isn’t really good feedback for people thinking of changing, but it does provide a good baseline to measure against once you’re more familiar with it, and getting glimpses into your learning curve might be really helpful for people looking for advice on which OS to go with.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 5
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1729217832 {#2294
    date: 2024-10-18 04:17:12.0 +02:00
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  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com"
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  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2281 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2280 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2278 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2279 …}
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  -bodyTs: "'advic':75 'back':3 'baselin':49 'chang':42 'curv':66 'day':32 'even':14 'familiar':57 'feedback':37 'general':22 'get':61 'glimps':62 'go':80 'good':36,48 'happy/upset/confused/sad':26 'help':70 'isn':33 'learn':65 'look':73 'm':24 'mayb':13 'measur':51 'might':67 'month':11 'os':78 'peopl':39,72 'pleas':1 'provid':46 're':55 'realli':25,35,69 'report':2 'road':21 'think':40 'two':18 'week':7 'year':16"
  +ranking: 0
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706469826 {#2290
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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Show voter details
35 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2296
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2295
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2002 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Switched-from-Ubuntu-to-Debian-yesterday"
    +title: "Switched from Ubuntu to Debian yesterday"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Why switch?\n
      -----------\n
      \n
      I played with the idea of switching for quite a while. Having switched my daily driver from Windows maybe 6-9 Months ago I made many mistakes in the meantime.\n
      \n
      Good and bad\n
      ------------\n
      \n
      This may have led to a diminshed experience with ubuntu but all in all, I was very pleased to see that Linux works as a daily driver. Still, I was unhappy with the kind of dumbed down gnome experience.\n
      \n
      Problems\n
      --------\n
      \n
      There were errors neither I nor people I asked could fix and the snap situation on ubuntu (just the fact that they’re proprietary, nothing else).\n
      \n
      Installation\n
      ------------\n
      \n
      Installing debian (and kde) was easier and harder than I expected. The download mirror I used must not have been great although its very close to my location because it took ages although my internet connections is good.\n
      \n
      Apps\n
      ----\n
      \n
      Since I switched to Linux, I toned down my app diet a lot. Installing all my apps from ubuntu was as easy as writing a short list and going through discover. Later I added flatpak which gave me a couple apps not available through discover (such as fluffychat). The last two I copied directly as appimages.\n
      \n
      Games\n
      -----\n
      \n
      I was scared that the „old kernel“ of stable debian would be a problem. As it turns out, everthing works great so far, a lot better than on ubuntu which might or might not be my fault.\n
      \n
      Instability\n
      -----------\n
      \n
      Kde does have some quirks that irritate me a bit like installing timeshift (because I tried network backups which dont work with it and the native backup solution does not seem to accept my sambashare) led to a window I could only close by rebooting.\n
      \n
      Boot time\n
      ---------\n
      \n
      What does feel a bit odd is the boot process. After my bios splash, it shows „welcome to grub“ and then switches to the debian start menu for 3 seconds or so, then shows some terminal stuff and then starts kde splash and then login. This feels a lot longer than ubuntu did. Its probably easy to change in some config but its also something that should be obvious.\n
      \n
      Summary\n
      -------\n
      \n
      So far I‘m incredibly happy although I ran into initramfs already probably because of timeshift which I threw out again. I might do a manual backup if nothing else works. My games dont freeze or stutter which is nice. All apps I had on ubuntu now work on debian and no snaps at all.\n
      \n
      **TL;DR:** If you feel adventurous, debian and kde are a pretty awesome mix and rid you of the proprietary ubuntu snap store. It also doesnt tell you that you can get security upgrades if you subscribe to ubuntu pro. Works the same if not better.
      """
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    +upVotes: 0
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706350556 {#2665
      date: 2024-01-27 11:15:56.0 +01:00
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     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    Please report back in a few weeks and a few months, and maybe even a year or two down the road.\n
    \n
    Generally “I’m really (happy/upset/confused/sad) with it” after only a day isn’t really good feedback for people thinking of changing, but it does provide a good baseline to measure against once you’re more familiar with it, and getting glimpses into your learning curve might be really helpful for people looking for advice on which OS to go with.
    """
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  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2281 …}
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
36 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2296
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2295
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2002 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Switched-from-Ubuntu-to-Debian-yesterday"
    +title: "Switched from Ubuntu to Debian yesterday"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Why switch?\n
      -----------\n
      \n
      I played with the idea of switching for quite a while. Having switched my daily driver from Windows maybe 6-9 Months ago I made many mistakes in the meantime.\n
      \n
      Good and bad\n
      ------------\n
      \n
      This may have led to a diminshed experience with ubuntu but all in all, I was very pleased to see that Linux works as a daily driver. Still, I was unhappy with the kind of dumbed down gnome experience.\n
      \n
      Problems\n
      --------\n
      \n
      There were errors neither I nor people I asked could fix and the snap situation on ubuntu (just the fact that they’re proprietary, nothing else).\n
      \n
      Installation\n
      ------------\n
      \n
      Installing debian (and kde) was easier and harder than I expected. The download mirror I used must not have been great although its very close to my location because it took ages although my internet connections is good.\n
      \n
      Apps\n
      ----\n
      \n
      Since I switched to Linux, I toned down my app diet a lot. Installing all my apps from ubuntu was as easy as writing a short list and going through discover. Later I added flatpak which gave me a couple apps not available through discover (such as fluffychat). The last two I copied directly as appimages.\n
      \n
      Games\n
      -----\n
      \n
      I was scared that the „old kernel“ of stable debian would be a problem. As it turns out, everthing works great so far, a lot better than on ubuntu which might or might not be my fault.\n
      \n
      Instability\n
      -----------\n
      \n
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      ---------\n
      \n
      What does feel a bit odd is the boot process. After my bios splash, it shows „welcome to grub“ and then switches to the debian start menu for 3 seconds or so, then shows some terminal stuff and then starts kde splash and then login. This feels a lot longer than ubuntu did. Its probably easy to change in some config but its also something that should be obvious.\n
      \n
      Summary\n
      -------\n
      \n
      So far I‘m incredibly happy although I ran into initramfs already probably because of timeshift which I threw out again. I might do a manual backup if nothing else works. My games dont freeze or stutter which is nice. All apps I had on ubuntu now work on debian and no snaps at all.\n
      \n
      **TL;DR:** If you feel adventurous, debian and kde are a pretty awesome mix and rid you of the proprietary ubuntu snap store. It also doesnt tell you that you can get security upgrades if you subscribe to ubuntu pro. Works the same if not better.
      """
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      date: 2024-10-22 02:45:59.0 +02:00
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    +ip: null
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     …2
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    Please report back in a few weeks and a few months, and maybe even a year or two down the road.\n
    \n
    Generally “I’m really (happy/upset/confused/sad) with it” after only a day isn’t really good feedback for people thinking of changing, but it does provide a good baseline to measure against once you’re more familiar with it, and getting glimpses into your learning curve might be really helpful for people looking for advice on which OS to go with.
    """
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    "@haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com"
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  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2281 …}
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38 DENIED moderate 
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        people are always going to be floating ways to save capitalism in the face of communities privileging freedom over greed.\n
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    people are always going to be floating ways to save capitalism in the face of communities privileging freedom over greed.\n
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    this completely misses the point of free software, and fails to solve the problems Mr. Perens identifies with Open Source. He claims it fails to serve the “common person” (end users) and then proposes a solution that serves… only devs.\n
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    people are always going to be floating ways to save capitalism in the face of communities privileging freedom over greed.\n
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    people are always going to be floating ways to save capitalism in the face of communities privileging freedom over greed.\n
    \n
    this completely misses the point of free software, and fails to solve the problems Mr. Perens identifies with Open Source. He claims it fails to serve the “common person” (end users) and then proposes a solution that serves… only devs.\n
    \n
    > Open Source has completely failed to serve the common person. For the most part, if they use us at all they do so through a proprietary software company’s systems, like Apple iOS or Google Android, both of which use Open Source for infrastructure but the apps are mostly proprietary… Indeed, Open Source is used today to surveil and even oppress them.\n
    \n
    All these problems are already solved by free software. the rebranding of “open source” was a compromise on the principles of free software to make the movement palatable to profit-seekers. In the end, it predictably failed to improve anything. The solution isn’t to reinvent the wheel, it’s to stop making the wheel square because the square lobby insists they’ll only use it if it’s square. The solution is copyleft, and free software being used more than it’s defanged cousin.\n
    \n
    > The common person doesn’t know about Open Source, they don’t know about the freedoms we promote which are increasingly in their interest\n
    \n
    That’s a feature, not a bug. On one hand, if people knew about free software they wouldn’t be as good consumers. On the other hand, internals should be opaque to users; just as devs don’t want to have to know how the logic gates in the CPU are routing their code to write code, end users shouldn’t have to worry about the politics of the communities that developed their code.
    """
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Show voter details
45 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
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Show voter details
46 DENIED moderate 
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Show voter details
47 DENIED edit 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
48 DENIED moderate 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
49 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
50 DENIED moderate 
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}
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
51 DENIED edit 
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  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2524 …}
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    -id: 19577
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     …2
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
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}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
52 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2118
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    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2376 …}
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     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
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}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
53 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
54 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2228
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2605 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#2644 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2646 …}
  +slug: "Linux-Boomers"
  +title: "Linux Boomers"
  +url: "https://janethemotherfucker.wordpress.com/2023/12/29/linux-boomers/"
  +body: "I’m going to start this article off by saying that you don’t have to be born in the boomer generation to be a boomer. You can be a boomer by acting like one. Hate new stuff? boomer. Run a desktop from the naughties? Boomer."
  +type: "link"
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      +image: null
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        Uncharitability to those you disagree with, style without substance, and all built upon thought-terminating cliches.\n
        \n
        This isn’t helpful or enlightening or informative, it’s entertaining but not in an interesting nor original way. It reminds me of 2010s Reddit memes where everything was about adding as many “fucks” as possible because our moms aren’t supervising our internet time anymore. It espouses a consoomer mindset of “gotta have bigger numbers and shinier visuals because all that matters is appealing to lizard-brain.”\n
        \n
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   …2
}
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
55 DENIED edit 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2228
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2605 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
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Show voter details
56 DENIED moderate 
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        Uncharitability to those you disagree with, style without substance, and all built upon thought-terminating cliches.\n
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Show voter details
57 DENIED ROLE_USER 
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58 DENIED moderate 
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    Uncharitability to those you disagree with, style without substance, and all built upon thought-terminating cliches.\n
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    This isn’t helpful or enlightening or informative, it’s entertaining but not in an interesting nor original way. It reminds me of 2010s Reddit memes where everything was about adding as many “fucks” as possible because our moms aren’t supervising our internet time anymore. It espouses a consoomer mindset of “gotta have bigger numbers and shinier visuals because all that matters is appealing to lizard-brain.”\n
    \n
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    \n
    You’ve got a point, focus on that: you can make the case that Linux fits your use case, or that certain mindsets within the Linux community are hindering progress. But please do so in a way that doesn’t just lend itself to more infighting and drama. That shit is for shallow people who have nothing to contribute and only serve as the cultural detritus that destroys communities and community-driven projects.
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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Show voter details
59 DENIED edit 
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"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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60 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2229
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2228
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2605 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#2644 …}
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2646 …}
    +slug: "Linux-Boomers"
    +title: "Linux Boomers"
    +url: "https://janethemotherfucker.wordpress.com/2023/12/29/linux-boomers/"
    +body: "I’m going to start this article off by saying that you don’t have to be born in the boomer generation to be a boomer. You can be a boomer by acting like one. Hate new stuff? boomer. Run a desktop from the naughties? Boomer."
    +type: "link"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 56
    +favouriteCount: 17
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703970910 {#2639
      date: 2023-12-30 22:15:10.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2647 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2649 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2651 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2653 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2655 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2657 …}
    +children: [
      App\Entity\EntryComment {#2229}
    ]
    -id: 25822
    -titleTs: "'boomer':2 'linux':1"
    -bodyTs: "'act':33 'articl':7 'boomer':21,26,31,39,46 'born':18 'desktop':42 'generat':22 'go':3 'hate':36 'like':34 'm':2 'naughti':45 'new':37 'one':35 'run':40 'say':10 'start':5 'stuff':38"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1704015384
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://leminal.space/post/2693742"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703928984 {#2627
      date: 2023-12-30 10:36:24.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    Uncharitability to those you disagree with, style without substance, and all built upon thought-terminating cliches.\n
    \n
    This isn’t helpful or enlightening or informative, it’s entertaining but not in an interesting nor original way. It reminds me of 2010s Reddit memes where everything was about adding as many “fucks” as possible because our moms aren’t supervising our internet time anymore. It espouses a consoomer mindset of “gotta have bigger numbers and shinier visuals because all that matters is appealing to lizard-brain.”\n
    \n
    And it’s all couched in the obvious mindset that any criticism will be met with “ok boomer” (I’ll almost be insulted if I don’t get one) because being superior is more important than being right. Y’know… like a boomer?\n
    \n
    You’ve got a point, focus on that: you can make the case that Linux fits your use case, or that certain mindsets within the Linux community are hindering progress. But please do so in a way that doesn’t just lend itself to more infighting and drama. That shit is for shallow people who have nothing to contribute and only serve as the cultural detritus that destroys communities and community-driven projects.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 33
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703932525 {#2231
    date: 2023-12-30 11:35:25.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@JaneTheMotherfucker@leminal.space"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2252 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2189 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2311 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2293 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2309 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2302 …}
  -id: 264426
  -bodyTs: "'2010s':41 'ad':48 'almost':107 'anymor':63 'appeal':82 'aren':57 'bigger':72 'boomer':104,129 'brain':86 'built':12 'case':142,148 'certain':151 'clich':17 'communiti':156,198,201 'community-driven':200 'consoom':67 'contribut':188 'couch':91 'critic':98 'cultur':194 'destroy':197 'detritus':195 'disagre':5 'doesn':168 'drama':177 'driven':202 'enlighten':23 'entertain':28 'espous':65 'everyth':45 'fit':145 'focus':135 'fuck':51 'get':114 'got':132 'gotta':70 'help':21 'hinder':158 'import':121 'infight':175 'inform':25 'insult':109 'interest':33 'internet':61 'isn':19 'know':126 'lend':171 'like':127 'linux':144,155 'lizard':85 'lizard-brain':84 'll':106 'make':140 'mani':50 'matter':80 'meme':43 'met':101 'mindset':68,95,152 'mom':56 'noth':186 'number':73 'obvious':94 'ok':103 'one':115 'origin':35 'peopl':183 'pleas':161 'point':134 'possibl':53 'progress':159 'project':203 'reddit':42 'remind':38 'right':124 'serv':191 'shallow':182 'shinier':75 'shit':179 'style':7 'substanc':9 'superior':118 'supervis':59 'termin':16 'thought':15 'thought-termin':14 'time':62 'uncharit':1 'upon':13 'use':147 've':131 'visual':76 'way':36,166 'within':153 'without':8 'y':125"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954903"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703932525 {#2232
    date: 2023-12-30 11:35:25.0 +01:00
  }
  +"title": 264426
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
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Show voter details
61 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
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Show voter details
62 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
  +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
  +url: null
  +body: """
    So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
    \n
    Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
    \n
    Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
    \n
    It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
    """
  +type: "article"
  +lang: "en"
  +isOc: false
  +hasEmbed: false
  +commentCount: 50
  +favouriteCount: 246
  +score: 0
  +isAdult: false
  +sticky: false
  +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2526
    date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +adaAmount: 0
  +tags: null
  +mentions: null
  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2536 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
  +children: [
    4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
      +body: """
        there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
        \n
        Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
        \n
        If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 12
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2092
        date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2133 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2345 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
      -id: 136149
      -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
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      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
        date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
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      +"title": 136149
    }
    3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 0
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      +lastActive: DateTime @1703930202 {#2044
        date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
      -id: 264384
      -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954593"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
        date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 264384
    }
    1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 0
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
        date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
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      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
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      -id: 190696
      -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
      +ranking: 0
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      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
        date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 190696
    }
    2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
      +body: """
        This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
        \n
        You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
        \n
        It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 5
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
        date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@erranto@lemmy.world"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
      -id: 136081
      -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
      +ranking: 0
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        date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 136081
    }
    0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 1
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
        date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@sxan@midwest.social"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2072 …}
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      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2067 …}
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      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318601"
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701545026 {#2159
        date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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      +"title": 190697
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    date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
  }
  +__isInitialized__: true
   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
63 DENIED edit 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
  +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
  +url: null
  +body: """
    So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
    \n
    Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
    \n
    Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
    \n
    It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
    """
  +type: "article"
  +lang: "en"
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    date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
  }
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  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
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  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
  +children: [
    4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
      +body: """
        there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
        \n
        Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
        \n
        If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
        """
      +lang: "en"
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        date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
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      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
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      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
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      -id: 136149
      -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
      +ranking: 0
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
        date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
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      +"title": 136149
    }
    3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
      +lang: "en"
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        date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
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      -id: 264384
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
        date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 264384
    }
    1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 0
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      +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
        date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
      }
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        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
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      -id: 190696
      -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
      +ranking: 0
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      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
        date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 190696
    }
    2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
      +body: """
        This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
        \n
        You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
        \n
        It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
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      +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
        date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
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      +mentions: [
        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@erranto@lemmy.world"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
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      -id: 136081
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        date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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      +"title": 136081
    }
    0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
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        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@sxan@midwest.social"
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  -id: 13897
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    date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
  }
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   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
64 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
  +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
  +url: null
  +body: """
    So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
    \n
    Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
    \n
    Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
    \n
    It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
    """
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  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
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  +children: [
    4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
      +body: """
        there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
        \n
        Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
        \n
        If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
        """
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        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
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      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
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      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
      -id: 136149
      -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
        date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 136149
    }
    3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 0
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703930202 {#2044
        date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
      -id: 264384
      -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954593"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
        date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 264384
    }
    1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 0
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
        date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2340 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2335 …}
      -id: 190696
      -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
        date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 190696
    }
    2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
      +body: """
        This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
        \n
        You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
        \n
        It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 5
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
        date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@erranto@lemmy.world"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
      -id: 136081
      -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
      +ranking: 0
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
        date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 136081
    }
    0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 1
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
        date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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        "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
        "@sxan@midwest.social"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2073 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2072 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2065 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2066 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2067 …}
      -id: 190697
      -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
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        date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 190697
    }
  ]
  -id: 13897
  -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
  -bodyTs: "'4':71 '6':6 '80':38 'address':14,30,45 'ago':8 'alreadi':46 'america':94 'broker':40 'compani':21,72 'constant':80 'data':39,84 'direct':93 'dmv':19 'dream':56 'everyth':62 'feel':47 'found':34 'given':11,75 'go':96 'inform':77 'internet':22 'kind':53 'know':27 'legit':43 'like':48 'matter':68,86 'moment':59 'money':102 'month':7 'move':4 'name':16 'new':44 'obvious':26 'opteri':32 'person':83 'phone':20 'privaci':49 'properti':25 'ran':31 'real':13,29 'recent':3 'rental':24 'right':63 'sad':91 'sell':81 'think':65 'toward':97 'truli':90 'wet':55"
  +cross: false
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    date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
  }
  +__isInitialized__: true
   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
65 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
66 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 50
    +favouriteCount: 246
    +score: 0
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    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2526
      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
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    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2536 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
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        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2340 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2335 …}
        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
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        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 5
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902390"
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
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    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
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    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
    \n
    Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
    \n
    If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
    """
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  -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
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    date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
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}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
67 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
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    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
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          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
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        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
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        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
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        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
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        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
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        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
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        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
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    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
    \n
    Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
    \n
    If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
    """
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
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    date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
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  +"title": 136149
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
68 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
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    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
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          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
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          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
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        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
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        -id: 136081
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
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          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
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    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
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    +cross: false
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
    \n
    Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
    \n
    If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
    """
  +lang: "en"
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    date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
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  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
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  -id: 136149
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  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
    date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
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  +"title": 136149
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
69 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
70 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
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      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2092
          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2133 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2345 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127}
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2340 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2335 …}
        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 5
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902390"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2073 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2072 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2065 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2066 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2067 …}
        -id: 190697
        -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318601"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701545026 {#2159
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190697
      }
    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
    -bodyTs: "'4':71 '6':6 '80':38 'address':14,30,45 'ago':8 'alreadi':46 'america':94 'broker':40 'compani':21,72 'constant':80 'data':39,84 'direct':93 'dmv':19 'dream':56 'everyth':62 'feel':47 'found':34 'given':11,75 'go':96 'inform':77 'internet':22 'kind':53 'know':27 'legit':43 'like':48 'matter':68,86 'moment':59 'money':102 'month':7 'move':4 'name':16 'new':44 'obvious':26 'opteri':32 'person':83 'phone':20 'privaci':49 'properti':25 'ran':31 'real':13,29 'recent':3 'rental':24 'right':63 'sad':91 'sell':81 'think':65 'toward':97 'truli':90 'wet':55"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1700323969
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://infosec.pub/post/5010894"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 0
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703930202 {#2044
    date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
  -id: 264384
  -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954593"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
    date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
  }
  +"title": 264384
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
71 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 50
    +favouriteCount: 246
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2526
      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2536 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2092
          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2133 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2345 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127}
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2340 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2335 …}
        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 5
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
        +ranking: 0
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701545026 {#2159
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190697
      }
    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
    -bodyTs: "'4':71 '6':6 '80':38 'address':14,30,45 'ago':8 'alreadi':46 'america':94 'broker':40 'compani':21,72 'constant':80 'data':39,84 'direct':93 'dmv':19 'dream':56 'everyth':62 'feel':47 'found':34 'given':11,75 'go':96 'inform':77 'internet':22 'kind':53 'know':27 'legit':43 'like':48 'matter':68,86 'moment':59 'money':102 'month':7 'move':4 'name':16 'new':44 'obvious':26 'opteri':32 'person':83 'phone':20 'privaci':49 'properti':25 'ran':31 'real':13,29 'recent':3 'rental':24 'right':63 'sad':91 'sell':81 'think':65 'toward':97 'truli':90 'wet':55"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
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    +apId: "https://infosec.pub/post/5010894"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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    date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
  }
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
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  -id: 264384
  -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
    date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
  }
  +"title": 264384
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
72 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 50
    +favouriteCount: 246
    +score: 0
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    +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2526
      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2536 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2092
          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
        }
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2133 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
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        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
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        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127}
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2340 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2335 …}
        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 5
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2073 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2072 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2065 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2066 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2067 …}
        -id: 190697
        -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
        +ranking: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318601"
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701545026 {#2159
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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        +"title": 190697
      }
    ]
    -id: 13897
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    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1700323969
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://infosec.pub/post/5010894"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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    date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
  ]
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    date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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  +"title": 264384
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
73 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
74 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
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    +hasEmbed: false
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      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
    }
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    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
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        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
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        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954593"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329}
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
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        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
        +ranking: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902390"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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        -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
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    ]
    -id: 13897
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    +cross: false
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
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  +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
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    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
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    date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
  }
  +"title": 190696
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
75 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
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    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2536 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2092
          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2133 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2345 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703930202 {#2044
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954593"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329}
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 5
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902390"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2073 …}
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        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2065 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2066 …}
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        -id: 190697
        -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
        +ranking: 0
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701545026 {#2159
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190697
      }
    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
    -bodyTs: "'4':71 '6':6 '80':38 'address':14,30,45 'ago':8 'alreadi':46 'america':94 'broker':40 'compani':21,72 'constant':80 'data':39,84 'direct':93 'dmv':19 'dream':56 'everyth':62 'feel':47 'found':34 'given':11,75 'go':96 'inform':77 'internet':22 'kind':53 'know':27 'legit':43 'like':48 'matter':68,86 'moment':59 'money':102 'month':7 'move':4 'name':16 'new':44 'obvious':26 'opteri':32 'person':83 'phone':20 'privaci':49 'properti':25 'ran':31 'real':13,29 'recent':3 'rental':24 'right':63 'sad':91 'sell':81 'think':65 'toward':97 'truli':90 'wet':55"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1700323969
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://infosec.pub/post/5010894"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 0
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
    date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
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  -id: 190696
  -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
  +ranking: 0
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  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
    date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
  }
  +"title": 190696
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
76 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 50
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    +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2526
      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2536 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2092
          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2133 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2345 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703930202 {#2044
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
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        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329}
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 5
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
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        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
        +ranking: 0
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2065 …}
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        -id: 190697
        -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
        +ranking: 0
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    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
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    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
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    +ranking: 1700323969
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 0
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    date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
  }
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    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
  ]
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  -id: 190696
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    date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
  }
  +"title": 190696
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
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Show voter details
77 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
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 ACCESS DENIED 
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"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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Show voter details
78 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
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    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
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    +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2526
      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
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    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
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    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
        +lang: "en"
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          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
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        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
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        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2345 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
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        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
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        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
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        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
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        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085}
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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        +ip: null
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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        +"title": 190697
      }
    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
    -bodyTs: "'4':71 '6':6 '80':38 'address':14,30,45 'ago':8 'alreadi':46 'america':94 'broker':40 'compani':21,72 'constant':80 'data':39,84 'direct':93 'dmv':19 'dream':56 'everyth':62 'feel':47 'found':34 'given':11,75 'go':96 'inform':77 'internet':22 'kind':53 'know':27 'legit':43 'like':48 'matter':68,86 'moment':59 'money':102 'month':7 'move':4 'name':16 'new':44 'obvious':26 'opteri':32 'person':83 'phone':20 'privaci':49 'properti':25 'ran':31 'real':13,29 'recent':3 'rental':24 'right':63 'sad':91 'sell':81 'think':65 'toward':97 'truli':90 'wet':55"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1700323969
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://infosec.pub/post/5010894"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
  +body: """
    This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
    \n
    You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
    \n
    It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
    """
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    date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@erranto@lemmy.world"
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  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
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  -id: 136081
  -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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    date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
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"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
79 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
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      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
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    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
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          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
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        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
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        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954593"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
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        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085}
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
        ]
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
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    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1700323969
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://infosec.pub/post/5010894"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
  +body: """
    This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
    \n
    You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
    \n
    It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
    """
  +lang: "en"
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    date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@erranto@lemmy.world"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
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  -id: 136081
  -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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    date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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  +"title": 136081
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
80 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
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      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
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          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
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        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
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        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
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        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
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        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
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          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
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        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085}
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@sxan@midwest.social"
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    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
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    +cross: false
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      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
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    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
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  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
  +body: """
    This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
    \n
    You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
    \n
    It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
    """
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    "@erranto@lemmy.world"
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  -id: 136081
  -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
81 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
82 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
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    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
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    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
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        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703930202 {#2044
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
        +ranking: 0
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2340 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2335 …}
        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 5
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1700285376 {#2083
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2080 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2089 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2091 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2090 …}
        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700285376 {#2082
          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143}
    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
    -bodyTs: "'4':71 '6':6 '80':38 'address':14,30,45 'ago':8 'alreadi':46 'america':94 'broker':40 'compani':21,72 'constant':80 'data':39,84 'direct':93 'dmv':19 'dream':56 'everyth':62 'feel':47 'found':34 'given':11,75 'go':96 'inform':77 'internet':22 'kind':53 'know':27 'legit':43 'like':48 'matter':68,86 'moment':59 'money':102 'month':7 'move':4 'name':16 'new':44 'obvious':26 'opteri':32 'person':83 'phone':20 'privaci':49 'properti':25 'ran':31 'real':13,29 'recent':3 'rental':24 'right':63 'sad':91 'sell':81 'think':65 'toward':97 'truli':90 'wet':55"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1700323969
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    +apId: "https://infosec.pub/post/5010894"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1701545026 {#2338
    date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
  }
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@sxan@midwest.social"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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  -id: 190697
  -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
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    date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
  }
  +"title": 190697
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
83 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
    +type: "article"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 50
    +favouriteCount: 246
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2526
      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2534 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2536 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2538 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2540 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2542 …}
    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1709334867 {#2092
          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2140 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2133 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2131 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2138 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2345 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2330 …}
        -id: 136149
        -bodyTs: "'4':57 'access':80 'address':53 'african':278 'all-or-noth':92 'although':12 'alway':36 'amount':39 'analog':234 'anonym':46,103 'anti':171,177 'anti-authoritarian':170 'anti-surveil':176 'anyth':288 'artist':179 'authoritarian':172 'barbarian':295 'battl':96 'beyond':44 'black':283 'bound':266 'cannot':86 'certain':255,326 'class':202 'collect':239,265 'comfort':50 'complet':45 'compromis':100 'congress':280 'consid':230 'conspiraci':158 'constrain':249 'content':173 'conveni':108 'cost':29 'could':215 'creator':174 'dev':163 'devast':307 'didn':327 'digit':195 'domin':325 'either':332 'engag':259 'equival':196 'european':294 'even':47,71,181 'everyth':210 'fact':127 'get':112,329 'give':51 'guerilla':264 'happen':309 'hard':147 'hierarch':252 'histori':242 'homeland':315 'hous':117 'idea':24 'individu':75 'inform':69,83 'infring':41 'ira':282 'joe':183 'journo':168 'kid':200 'know':122 'level':133 'lie':302 'like':184 'live':31,125 'lot':143 'mani':74 'much':219,287 'must':223 'name':55 'nation':279 'natur':253 'northern':293 'noth':95 'onlin':191 'oppon':244 'ordinari':182 'organ':78,246 'panther':284 'paranoid':161 'parti':59 'peopl':106,312 'presumpt':62 'pretti':286 'privaci':43,85,97,135 'public':113 'resist':145 'revolut':276 'right':138 'roman':290 'rule':257 'scifi':19 'servic':192 'share':270 'shoulder':207 'sit':299 'societi':11,34 'softwar':162 'state':237 'state-vs-collect':236 'stood':204 'stori':20 'surveil':178 'survivalist':156 'teas':22 'tech':167 'tell':321 'texa':275 'theorist':159 'thing':5,214 'think':224,273 'thought':88 'thus':84 'total':102 'trust':10 'un':105 'un-peopl':104 'unspoken':256 'use':67,190 'util':114 'valu':271 'vietnam':277 'vs':238 'want':15,188 'war':229,240 'wasn':151 'watch':209 'way':331 'weird':199 'whistleblow':165 'win':317 'within':76 'withouth':193 'won':297 'work':148 'wors':220 'would':66,217 'write':17 'x1000':213 'zapatista':281 'zero':9 'zero-trust':8"
        +ranking: 0
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        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/5902918"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700287601 {#2094
          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703930202 {#2044
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2043 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2215 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2198 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2227 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2214 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2225 …}
        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
        +ranking: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6954593"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703930202 {#2128
          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1701544874 {#2325
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2323 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2300 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2340 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2335 …}
        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
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        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6318534"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
        }
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        +mentions: [
          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
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        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2095 …}
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        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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        +"title": 136081
      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143}
    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
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    +cross: false
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      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
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    date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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    "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@sxan@midwest.social"
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  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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  -id: 190697
  -bodyTs: "'alreadi':10 'asap':18 'comment':6 'gonna':15 'hope':3 'read':11,16 'someon':4 'stori':13 'tell':7 'thank':14 'would':5"
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    date: 2023-12-02 20:23:46.0 +01:00
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  +"title": 190697
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
84 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1352 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Feeling-like-Privacy-is-a-lost-war"
    +title: "Feeling like Privacy is a lost war."
    +url: null
    +body: """
      So, I recently moved about 6 months ago. Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property(obviously knows my real address)\n
      \n
      Ran Optery and found out that over 80 data brokers have my legit new address already.\n
      \n
      Feeling like privacy is just some kind of wet dream at the moment. I do everything right, I think but no matter what the 4 companies I have given my information too will constantly sell my personal data no matter what.\n
      \n
      It’s truly sad the direction America is going towards, all for some more money.
      """
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      date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2531 …}
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    +children: [
      4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          there is no such thing as a zero-trust society (although I now want to write that scifi story and tease that idea out). As such, the cost of living in a society will always be some amount of infringement of privacy beyond complete anonymity. Even you were comfortable giving your address and name to 4 other parties (under the presumption that only they would use that information), and even then how many individuals within those organizations have access to that information?\n
          \n
          Thus privacy cannot be thought of as an all-or-nothing battle. Privacy is a compromise between total anonymity (un-people) and convenience (you can’t get public utilities to your house if they don’t know where you live). The fact is that we have the level of privacy we do right now because of a lot of resistance and hard work. If it wasn’t for all the survivalists and conspiracy theorists and paranoid software devs and whistleblowers and tech journos and anti-authoritarian content creators and anti-surveillance artists and even ordinary joes like me who just want to use online services withouth the digital equivalent of the weird kid in class who stood over your shoulder and watched everything you did (x1000), things could and would be much worse.\n
          \n
          If you must think of it as a war, consider it to be analogous to state-vs-collective wars of history: our “opponents” are organizations that are constrained by their hierarchical nature to certain unspoken rules of engagement, and we are a guerilla collective bound only by our shared value(s). Think the Texas Revolution, Vietnam, African National Congress, Zapatistas, IRA, Black Panthers or pretty much anything the Romans did with northern European Barbarians. I won’t sit here and lie to you that the devastation that happened to these peoples and their homelands was “winning,” but I can tell you that the dominators certainly didn’t get their way either.
          """
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          date: 2024-03-02 00:14:27.0 +01:00
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        -id: 136149
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        +ranking: 0
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          date: 2023-11-18 07:06:41.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 136149
      }
      3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2127
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2126 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "Fine, in that case: *more* comfortable than the alternative. No one’s kicking down your door and forcing you to get phone or internet, you don’t have to live on-grid to survive, it’s not illegal to not own a vehicle."
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
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        -id: 264384
        -bodyTs: "'altern':9 'case':4 'comfort':6 'door':16 'fine':1 'forc':18 'get':21 'grid':33 'illeg':39 'internet':24 'kick':13 'live':30 'on-grid':31 'one':11 'phone':22 'surviv':35 'vehicl':44"
        +ranking: 0
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          date: 2023-12-30 10:56:42.0 +01:00
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        +"title": 264384
      }
      1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2329
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2333 …}
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
        +body: "> Have only given my real address and name to the DMV, Phone Company, Internet, and rental property"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 0
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          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
          "@ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org"
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        -id: 190696
        -bodyTs: "'address':6 'compani':13 'dmv':11 'given':3 'internet':14 'name':8 'phone':12 'properti':17 'real':5 'rental':16"
        +ranking: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1701544874 {#2327
          date: 2023-12-02 20:21:14.0 +01:00
        }
        +"title": 190696
      }
      2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2085
        +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2096 …2}
        +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
        +image: null
        +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2081 …}
        +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2077 …}
        +body: """
          This is a myth that’s been addressed by the project. For starters, there are no disclosures about the amount of nodes owned by the Government/NSA/CIA/etc. You’re probably thinking how the project, in 2012, received 80% of its funding from the US Gov [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).\n
          \n
          You may make the argument of “follow the money”, or you could also make the argument that this type of tech this widely distributed benefits the government too (field agents for some agencies allegedly use Tor, as do foreign defectors) and compromising the network would lead to a potential vector to compromise their interests.\n
          \n
          It’s also worth noting that Tor uses 3 hops (entry, relay, and exit nodes) and you can check the location/IP of your current route at any time to ensure geographic diversity. An actor would have to own all 3 to know what you were visiting and trace the traffic back to you.
          """
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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          "@beefpeach@infosec.pub"
          "@erranto@lemmy.world"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2098 …}
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        -id: 136081
        -bodyTs: "'/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':48 '2012':35 '3':111,142 '80':37 'actor':136 'address':8 'agenc':81 'agent':78 'alleg':82 'also':61,105 'amount':20 'argument':53,64 'back':153 'benefit':73 'check':121 'compromis':90,100 'could':60 'current':126 'defector':88 'disclosur':17 'distribut':72 'divers':134 'ensur':132 'entri':113 'exit':116 'field':77 'follow':55 'foreign':87 'fund':40 'geograph':133 'gov':44 'govern':75 'government/nsa/cia/etc':26 'hop':112 'interest':102 'know':144 'lead':94 'location/ip':123 'make':51,62 'may':50 'money':57 'myth':4 'network':92 'node':22,117 'note':107 'own':23 'potenti':97 'probabl':29 'project':11,33 're':28 'receiv':36 'relay':114 'rout':127 'sourc':45 'starter':13 'tech':69 'think':30 'time':130 'tor':84,109 'trace':150 'traffic':152 'type':67 'us':43 'use':83,110 'vector':98 'visit':148 'web.archive.org':47 'web.archive.org/web/20120312225054/http://articles.boston.com/2012-03-08/business/31136655_1_law-enforcement-free-speech-technology/2).':46 'wide':71 'worth':106 'would':93,137"
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          date: 2023-11-18 06:29:36.0 +01:00
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      }
      0 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#2143}
    ]
    -id: 13897
    -titleTs: "'feel':1 'like':2 'lost':6 'privaci':3 'war':7"
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    +cross: false
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1700237569 {#2512
      date: 2023-11-17 17:12:49.0 +01:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2062 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2135 …}
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2241}
  +body: "I was hoping someone would comment telling me they already read that story! Thanks, gonna read it asap!"
  +lang: "en"
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    "@BaumGeist@lemmy.ml"
    "@sxan@midwest.social"
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  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2136 …}
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}
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
85 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
86 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2384
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2607 …}
  +slug: "Do-you-prefer-PC-or-laptop"
  +title: "Do you prefer PC or laptop?"
  +url: "https://freeonlinesurveys.com/s/LOqEyg0v"
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  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2619 …}
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      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2384 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
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      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
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      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2386 …}
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}
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
87 DENIED edit 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2384
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2567 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2607 …}
  +slug: "Do-you-prefer-PC-or-laptop"
  +title: "Do you prefer PC or laptop?"
  +url: "https://freeonlinesurveys.com/s/LOqEyg0v"
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  +type: "link"
  +lang: "en"
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      +image: null
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        I installed a headless Debian OS, added a keyboard-focused window manager and I don’t have to futz with the trackpad nor find a place to put an attached mouse. It also is a much slower drain on the battery. Best of all worlds.\n
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        I use it for web-browsing, word-processing/spreadsheets, checking email, making memes, coding, managing my home network, controlling my headless SBC, and modding. Also occasionally for cyber CTFs or remoting into my desktop at least to do so.
        """
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   …2
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
88 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2384
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2607 …}
  +slug: "Do-you-prefer-PC-or-laptop"
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      +image: null
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      +root: null
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   …2
}
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
89 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
90 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2379
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2384
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2567 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2607 …}
    +slug: "Do-you-prefer-PC-or-laptop"
    +title: "Do you prefer PC or laptop?"
    +url: "https://freeonlinesurveys.com/s/LOqEyg0v"
    +body: "I was having a *friendly* discussion with someone this morning about PC and Laptops for work/education stuff, he suggested that I could use a chromebook for all this stuff and this would be a good idea and make things easier. I strongly disagreed with this, mainly because I hate laptops, the keyboard and touchpad make me angry and my PC does everything I need. Most things are synced to my phone for the rare times I may want to add something while out and about. So I thought I’d come here and seek other peoples opinions on laptops vs pc your needs? also if you are feeling bored and want to head on over to the survey ive linked and fill in a few questions I can more easily gather data to make into fun graphs, which if the data agrees with me, I can shove it in his face or should I be in the minority I can let him have this win."
    +type: "link"
    +lang: "en"
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    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 42
    +favouriteCount: 28
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1689738047 {#2602
      date: 2023-07-19 05:40:47.0 +02:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2609 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2611 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2613 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2615 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2617 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2619 …}
    +children: [
      App\Entity\EntryComment {#2379}
    ]
    -id: 1431
    -titleTs: "'laptop':6 'pc':4 'prefer':3"
    -bodyTs: "'add':80 'agre':142 'also':104 'angri':57 'bore':109 'chromebook':25 'come':91 'could':22 'd':90 'data':132,141 'disagre':43 'discuss':6 'easier':40 'easili':130 'everyth':62 'face':151 'feel':108 'fill':122 'friend':5 'fun':136 'gather':131 'good':35 'graph':137 'hate':49 'head':113 'idea':36 'ive':119 'keyboard':52 'laptop':14,50,99 'let':161 'link':120 'main':46 'make':38,55,134 'may':77 'minor':158 'morn':10 'need':64,103 'opinion':97 'pc':12,60,101 'peopl':96 'phone':71 'question':126 'rare':74 'seek':94 'shove':147 'someon':8 'someth':81 'strong':42 'stuff':17,29 'suggest':19 'survey':118 'sync':68 'thing':39,66 'thought':88 'time':75 'touchpad':54 'use':23 'vs':100 'want':78,111 'win':165 'work/education':16 'would':32"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1689784968
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/835599"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689698568 {#2588
      date: 2023-07-18 18:42:48.0 +02:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    I can’t use a laptop for work (graphics intensive, need a powerhouse) but I would if I could. I love being able to use it literally anywhere I go—at my desk, in bed, on the toilet, on vacation, on the bus, at a cafe, etc—and…\n
    \n
    I installed a headless Debian OS, added a keyboard-focused window manager and I don’t have to futz with the trackpad nor find a place to put an attached mouse. It also is a much slower drain on the battery. Best of all worlds.\n
    \n
    I use it for web-browsing, word-processing/spreadsheets, checking email, making memes, coding, managing my home network, controlling my headless SBC, and modding. Also occasionally for cyber CTFs or remoting into my desktop at least to do so.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 3
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1689727031 {#2459
    date: 2023-07-19 02:37:11.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Spinellicat@lemmy.dbzer0.com"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2386 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2381 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1910 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1909 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1926 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1874 …}
  -id: 22185
  -bodyTs: "'/spreadsheets':105 'abl':23 'ad':55 'also':82,121 'anywher':28 'attach':79 'batteri':90 'bed':35 'best':91 'brows':101 'bus':43 'cafe':46 'check':106 'code':110 'control':115 'could':19 'ctfs':125 'cyber':124 'debian':53 'desk':33 'desktop':130 'drain':87 'email':107 'etc':47 'find':73 'focus':59 'futz':68 'go':30 'graphic':9 'headless':52,117 'home':113 'instal':50 'intens':10 'keyboard':58 'keyboard-focus':57 'laptop':6 'least':132 'liter':27 'love':21 'make':108 'manag':61,111 'meme':109 'mod':120 'mous':80 'much':85 'need':11 'network':114 'occasion':122 'os':54 'place':75 'powerhous':13 'process':104 'put':77 'remot':127 'sbc':118 'slower':86 'toilet':38 'trackpad':71 'use':4,25,96 'vacat':40 'web':100 'web-brows':99 'window':60 'word':103 'word-process':102 'work':8 'world':94 'would':16"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/1725319"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689727031 {#2378
    date: 2023-07-19 02:37:11.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 22185
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
91 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2379
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2384
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2567 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2607 …}
    +slug: "Do-you-prefer-PC-or-laptop"
    +title: "Do you prefer PC or laptop?"
    +url: "https://freeonlinesurveys.com/s/LOqEyg0v"
    +body: "I was having a *friendly* discussion with someone this morning about PC and Laptops for work/education stuff, he suggested that I could use a chromebook for all this stuff and this would be a good idea and make things easier. I strongly disagreed with this, mainly because I hate laptops, the keyboard and touchpad make me angry and my PC does everything I need. Most things are synced to my phone for the rare times I may want to add something while out and about. So I thought I’d come here and seek other peoples opinions on laptops vs pc your needs? also if you are feeling bored and want to head on over to the survey ive linked and fill in a few questions I can more easily gather data to make into fun graphs, which if the data agrees with me, I can shove it in his face or should I be in the minority I can let him have this win."
    +type: "link"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 42
    +favouriteCount: 28
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1689738047 {#2602
      date: 2023-07-19 05:40:47.0 +02:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2609 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2611 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2613 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2615 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2617 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2619 …}
    +children: [
      App\Entity\EntryComment {#2379}
    ]
    -id: 1431
    -titleTs: "'laptop':6 'pc':4 'prefer':3"
    -bodyTs: "'add':80 'agre':142 'also':104 'angri':57 'bore':109 'chromebook':25 'come':91 'could':22 'd':90 'data':132,141 'disagre':43 'discuss':6 'easier':40 'easili':130 'everyth':62 'face':151 'feel':108 'fill':122 'friend':5 'fun':136 'gather':131 'good':35 'graph':137 'hate':49 'head':113 'idea':36 'ive':119 'keyboard':52 'laptop':14,50,99 'let':161 'link':120 'main':46 'make':38,55,134 'may':77 'minor':158 'morn':10 'need':64,103 'opinion':97 'pc':12,60,101 'peopl':96 'phone':71 'question':126 'rare':74 'seek':94 'shove':147 'someon':8 'someth':81 'strong':42 'stuff':17,29 'suggest':19 'survey':118 'sync':68 'thing':39,66 'thought':88 'time':75 'touchpad':54 'use':23 'vs':100 'want':78,111 'win':165 'work/education':16 'would':32"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1689784968
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/835599"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689698568 {#2588
      date: 2023-07-18 18:42:48.0 +02:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    I can’t use a laptop for work (graphics intensive, need a powerhouse) but I would if I could. I love being able to use it literally anywhere I go—at my desk, in bed, on the toilet, on vacation, on the bus, at a cafe, etc—and…\n
    \n
    I installed a headless Debian OS, added a keyboard-focused window manager and I don’t have to futz with the trackpad nor find a place to put an attached mouse. It also is a much slower drain on the battery. Best of all worlds.\n
    \n
    I use it for web-browsing, word-processing/spreadsheets, checking email, making memes, coding, managing my home network, controlling my headless SBC, and modding. Also occasionally for cyber CTFs or remoting into my desktop at least to do so.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 3
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1689727031 {#2459
    date: 2023-07-19 02:37:11.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Spinellicat@lemmy.dbzer0.com"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2386 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2381 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1910 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1909 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1926 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1874 …}
  -id: 22185
  -bodyTs: "'/spreadsheets':105 'abl':23 'ad':55 'also':82,121 'anywher':28 'attach':79 'batteri':90 'bed':35 'best':91 'brows':101 'bus':43 'cafe':46 'check':106 'code':110 'control':115 'could':19 'ctfs':125 'cyber':124 'debian':53 'desk':33 'desktop':130 'drain':87 'email':107 'etc':47 'find':73 'focus':59 'futz':68 'go':30 'graphic':9 'headless':52,117 'home':113 'instal':50 'intens':10 'keyboard':58 'keyboard-focus':57 'laptop':6 'least':132 'liter':27 'love':21 'make':108 'manag':61,111 'meme':109 'mod':120 'mous':80 'much':85 'need':11 'network':114 'occasion':122 'os':54 'place':75 'powerhous':13 'process':104 'put':77 'remot':127 'sbc':118 'slower':86 'toilet':38 'trackpad':71 'use':4,25,96 'vacat':40 'web':100 'web-brows':99 'window':60 'word':103 'word-process':102 'work':8 'world':94 'would':16"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/1725319"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689727031 {#2378
    date: 2023-07-19 02:37:11.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 22185
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
92 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2379
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2384
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2567 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2607 …}
    +slug: "Do-you-prefer-PC-or-laptop"
    +title: "Do you prefer PC or laptop?"
    +url: "https://freeonlinesurveys.com/s/LOqEyg0v"
    +body: "I was having a *friendly* discussion with someone this morning about PC and Laptops for work/education stuff, he suggested that I could use a chromebook for all this stuff and this would be a good idea and make things easier. I strongly disagreed with this, mainly because I hate laptops, the keyboard and touchpad make me angry and my PC does everything I need. Most things are synced to my phone for the rare times I may want to add something while out and about. So I thought I’d come here and seek other peoples opinions on laptops vs pc your needs? also if you are feeling bored and want to head on over to the survey ive linked and fill in a few questions I can more easily gather data to make into fun graphs, which if the data agrees with me, I can shove it in his face or should I be in the minority I can let him have this win."
    +type: "link"
    +lang: "en"
    +isOc: false
    +hasEmbed: false
    +commentCount: 42
    +favouriteCount: 28
    +score: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +sticky: false
    +lastActive: DateTime @1689738047 {#2602
      date: 2023-07-19 05:40:47.0 +02:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +adaAmount: 0
    +tags: null
    +mentions: null
    +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2609 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2611 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2613 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2615 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2617 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2619 …}
    +children: [
      App\Entity\EntryComment {#2379}
    ]
    -id: 1431
    -titleTs: "'laptop':6 'pc':4 'prefer':3"
    -bodyTs: "'add':80 'agre':142 'also':104 'angri':57 'bore':109 'chromebook':25 'come':91 'could':22 'd':90 'data':132,141 'disagre':43 'discuss':6 'easier':40 'easili':130 'everyth':62 'face':151 'feel':108 'fill':122 'friend':5 'fun':136 'gather':131 'good':35 'graph':137 'hate':49 'head':113 'idea':36 'ive':119 'keyboard':52 'laptop':14,50,99 'let':161 'link':120 'main':46 'make':38,55,134 'may':77 'minor':158 'morn':10 'need':64,103 'opinion':97 'pc':12,60,101 'peopl':96 'phone':71 'question':126 'rare':74 'seek':94 'shove':147 'someon':8 'someth':81 'strong':42 'stuff':17,29 'suggest':19 'survey':118 'sync':68 'thing':39,66 'thought':88 'time':75 'touchpad':54 'use':23 'vs':100 'want':78,111 'win':165 'work/education':16 'would':32"
    +cross: false
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +ranking: 1689784968
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/835599"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689698568 {#2588
      date: 2023-07-18 18:42:48.0 +02:00
    }
    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#2363 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    I can’t use a laptop for work (graphics intensive, need a powerhouse) but I would if I could. I love being able to use it literally anywhere I go—at my desk, in bed, on the toilet, on vacation, on the bus, at a cafe, etc—and…\n
    \n
    I installed a headless Debian OS, added a keyboard-focused window manager and I don’t have to futz with the trackpad nor find a place to put an attached mouse. It also is a much slower drain on the battery. Best of all worlds.\n
    \n
    I use it for web-browsing, word-processing/spreadsheets, checking email, making memes, coding, managing my home network, controlling my headless SBC, and modding. Also occasionally for cyber CTFs or remoting into my desktop at least to do so.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 3
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1689727031 {#2459
    date: 2023-07-19 02:37:11.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Spinellicat@lemmy.dbzer0.com"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2386 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2381 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1910 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1909 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1926 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1874 …}
  -id: 22185
  -bodyTs: "'/spreadsheets':105 'abl':23 'ad':55 'also':82,121 'anywher':28 'attach':79 'batteri':90 'bed':35 'best':91 'brows':101 'bus':43 'cafe':46 'check':106 'code':110 'control':115 'could':19 'ctfs':125 'cyber':124 'debian':53 'desk':33 'desktop':130 'drain':87 'email':107 'etc':47 'find':73 'focus':59 'futz':68 'go':30 'graphic':9 'headless':52,117 'home':113 'instal':50 'intens':10 'keyboard':58 'keyboard-focus':57 'laptop':6 'least':132 'liter':27 'love':21 'make':108 'manag':61,111 'meme':109 'mod':120 'mous':80 'much':85 'need':11 'network':114 'occasion':122 'os':54 'place':75 'powerhous':13 'process':104 'put':77 'remot':127 'sbc':118 'slower':86 'toilet':38 'trackpad':71 'use':4,25,96 'vacat':40 'web':100 'web-brows':99 'window':60 'word':103 'word-process':102 'work':8 'world':94 'would':16"
  +ranking: 0
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  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/1725319"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689727031 {#2378
    date: 2023-07-19 02:37:11.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 22185
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
93 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
94 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2332
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2585 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Why-is-Linux-so-frustrating-for-some-people"
  +title: "Why is Linux so frustrating for some people?"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    Don’t get me wrong. I love Linux and FOSS. I have been using and installing distros on my own since I was 12. Now that I’m working in tech-related positions, after the Reddit migration happened, etc. I recovered my interest in all the Linux environment. I use Ubuntu as my main operating system in my Desktop, but I always end up feeling very limited. There’s always software I can’t use properly (and not just Windows stuff), some stuff badly configured with weird error messages… last time I was not able to even use the apt command. Sometimes I lack time and energy for troubleshooting and sometimes I just fail at it.\n
    \n
    I usually end up in need of redoing a fresh install until it breaks up again. Maybe Linux is not good for beginners working full time? Maybe we should do something like that Cisco course that teaches you the basic commands?
    """
  +type: "article"
  +lang: "en"
  +isOc: false
  +hasEmbed: false
  +commentCount: 8
  +favouriteCount: 4
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  +lastActive: DateTime @1729265518 {#2659
    date: 2024-10-18 17:31:58.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +adaAmount: 0
  +tags: null
  +mentions: null
  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2624 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2666 …}
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        My first experience with linux was Ubuntu. Sue me, it was listed under most “most user friendly distro” listicles when I wasn’t smart enough to realize those were mostly marketing.\n
        \n
        It worked fine for my purposes, though it took getting used to, but it would wake itself up from sleep after a few minutes. I would have to shut it off at night so that I wouldn’t wake up in a panic as an eerie light emanated through the room from my closed laptop. I did my best searching for the problem, but could never find a solution that worked; in retrospect, I probably just didn’t have the language to adequately describe the problem.\n
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        \n
        I remember going off on some friends online when they tried to convince me Linux and the terminal were superior. I ranted about how this stupid sleep issue was indicative of larger, more annoying problems that drove potential users away. I raged about how hostile to users this esoteric nerds-only UX is. I cried about Windows could be better for everyone if the most computer-adept people would stop jumping ship for mediocre OSes.\n
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        \n
        A few years later and everyone’s home all the time for some reason, and I get the wild idea that I’m going to be a(n ethical) hacker for whatever reason. I then proceeded to install Kali on a VM and the rest is history.\n
        \n
        The point being that some people labor under the misguided belief that technology should conform to the users, and because we were mostly raised on Windows or Mac, we develop the misconception that those interfaces are “intuitive” (solely because we learned them during the best time in our life to pick up new skills). Then you try to move to linux for whatever reason and everything works differently and the process is jarring and noticeably requires the user conforming to the technology–i.e. changing bad habits learned from other OSes to fit the new one. The lucky few of us go on to learn many other OSes and start to see beyond the specifics to the abstract ideas similar to all of them, then it doesn’t matter if you have to work with iOS or TempleOS, you understand the basics of how it all fits together.\n
        \n
        TL;DR Category theorists must be the least frustrated people alive
        """
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    Don’t get me wrong. I love Linux and FOSS. I have been using and installing distros on my own since I was 12. Now that I’m working in tech-related positions, after the Reddit migration happened, etc. I recovered my interest in all the Linux environment. I use Ubuntu as my main operating system in my Desktop, but I always end up feeling very limited. There’s always software I can’t use properly (and not just Windows stuff), some stuff badly configured with weird error messages… last time I was not able to even use the apt command. Sometimes I lack time and energy for troubleshooting and sometimes I just fail at it.\n
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        My first experience with linux was Ubuntu. Sue me, it was listed under most “most user friendly distro” listicles when I wasn’t smart enough to realize those were mostly marketing.\n
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        It worked fine for my purposes, though it took getting used to, but it would wake itself up from sleep after a few minutes. I would have to shut it off at night so that I wouldn’t wake up in a panic as an eerie light emanated through the room from my closed laptop. I did my best searching for the problem, but could never find a solution that worked; in retrospect, I probably just didn’t have the language to adequately describe the problem.\n
        \n
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        \n
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        \n
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        \n
        A few years later and everyone’s home all the time for some reason, and I get the wild idea that I’m going to be a(n ethical) hacker for whatever reason. I then proceeded to install Kali on a VM and the rest is history.\n
        \n
        The point being that some people labor under the misguided belief that technology should conform to the users, and because we were mostly raised on Windows or Mac, we develop the misconception that those interfaces are “intuitive” (solely because we learned them during the best time in our life to pick up new skills). Then you try to move to linux for whatever reason and everything works differently and the process is jarring and noticeably requires the user conforming to the technology–i.e. changing bad habits learned from other OSes to fit the new one. The lucky few of us go on to learn many other OSes and start to see beyond the specifics to the abstract ideas similar to all of them, then it doesn’t matter if you have to work with iOS or TempleOS, you understand the basics of how it all fits together.\n
        \n
        TL;DR Category theorists must be the least frustrated people alive
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    Don’t get me wrong. I love Linux and FOSS. I have been using and installing distros on my own since I was 12. Now that I’m working in tech-related positions, after the Reddit migration happened, etc. I recovered my interest in all the Linux environment. I use Ubuntu as my main operating system in my Desktop, but I always end up feeling very limited. There’s always software I can’t use properly (and not just Windows stuff), some stuff badly configured with weird error messages… last time I was not able to even use the apt command. Sometimes I lack time and energy for troubleshooting and sometimes I just fail at it.\n
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        My first experience with linux was Ubuntu. Sue me, it was listed under most “most user friendly distro” listicles when I wasn’t smart enough to realize those were mostly marketing.\n
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        It worked fine for my purposes, though it took getting used to, but it would wake itself up from sleep after a few minutes. I would have to shut it off at night so that I wouldn’t wake up in a panic as an eerie light emanated through the room from my closed laptop. I did my best searching for the problem, but could never find a solution that worked; in retrospect, I probably just didn’t have the language to adequately describe the problem.\n
        \n
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        \n
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        \n
        TL;DR Category theorists must be the least frustrated people alive
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  -titleTs: "'frustrat':5 'linux':3 'peopl':8"
  -bodyTs: "'12':24 'abl':96 'alway':63,71 'apt':101 'bad':85 'basic':157 'beginn':140 'break':131 'cisco':151 'command':102,158 'configur':86 'cours':152 'desktop':60 'distro':17 'end':64,120 'energi':108 'environ':49 'error':89 'etc':40 'even':98 'fail':115 'feel':66 'foss':10 'fresh':127 'full':142 'get':3 'good':138 'happen':39 'instal':16,128 'interest':44 'lack':105 'last':91 'like':149 'limit':68 'linux':8,48,135 'love':7 'm':28 'main':55 'mayb':134,144 'messag':90 'migrat':38 'need':123 'oper':56 'posit':34 'proper':77 'recov':42 'reddit':37 'redo':125 'relat':33 'sinc':21 'softwar':72 'someth':148 'sometim':103,112 'stuff':82,84 'system':57 'teach':154 'tech':32 'tech-rel':31 'time':92,106,143 'troubleshoot':110 'ubuntu':52 'use':14,51,76,99 'usual':119 'weird':88 'window':81 'work':29,141 'wrong':5"
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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97 DENIED ROLE_USER 
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98 DENIED moderate 
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      Don’t get me wrong. I love Linux and FOSS. I have been using and installing distros on my own since I was 12. Now that I’m working in tech-related positions, after the Reddit migration happened, etc. I recovered my interest in all the Linux environment. I use Ubuntu as my main operating system in my Desktop, but I always end up feeling very limited. There’s always software I can’t use properly (and not just Windows stuff), some stuff badly configured with weird error messages… last time I was not able to even use the apt command. Sometimes I lack time and energy for troubleshooting and sometimes I just fail at it.\n
      \n
      I usually end up in need of redoing a fresh install until it breaks up again. Maybe Linux is not good for beginners working full time? Maybe we should do something like that Cisco course that teaches you the basic commands?
      """
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
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    My first experience with linux was Ubuntu. Sue me, it was listed under most “most user friendly distro” listicles when I wasn’t smart enough to realize those were mostly marketing.\n
    \n
    It worked fine for my purposes, though it took getting used to, but it would wake itself up from sleep after a few minutes. I would have to shut it off at night so that I wouldn’t wake up in a panic as an eerie light emanated through the room from my closed laptop. I did my best searching for the problem, but could never find a solution that worked; in retrospect, I probably just didn’t have the language to adequately describe the problem.\n
    \n
    Nothing about the GUI was well-documented to the degree that CLI apps were. If I needed to make any changes, there would be like one grainy video on youtube that showed what apps to open and buttons to click and failed to solve my problem, but a dozen Stack Exchange articles telling me exactly what to do via the terminal.\n
    \n
    I remember going off on some friends online when they tried to convince me Linux and the terminal were superior. I ranted about how this stupid sleep issue was indicative of larger, more annoying problems that drove potential users away. I raged about how hostile to users this esoteric nerds-only UX is. I cried about Windows could be better for everyone if the most computer-adept people would stop jumping ship for mediocre OSes.\n
    \n
    I met another friend who used Arch (btw) within a year from that hissy fit, and she fixed my laptop within minutes. Using a CLI app nonetheless. I grumbled angrily to myself.\n
    \n
    A few years later and everyone’s home all the time for some reason, and I get the wild idea that I’m going to be a(n ethical) hacker for whatever reason. I then proceeded to install Kali on a VM and the rest is history.\n
    \n
    The point being that some people labor under the misguided belief that technology should conform to the users, and because we were mostly raised on Windows or Mac, we develop the misconception that those interfaces are “intuitive” (solely because we learned them during the best time in our life to pick up new skills). Then you try to move to linux for whatever reason and everything works differently and the process is jarring and noticeably requires the user conforming to the technology–i.e. changing bad habits learned from other OSes to fit the new one. The lucky few of us go on to learn many other OSes and start to see beyond the specifics to the abstract ideas similar to all of them, then it doesn’t matter if you have to work with iOS or TempleOS, you understand the basics of how it all fits together.\n
    \n
    TL;DR Category theorists must be the least frustrated people alive
    """
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689572511 {#2351
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}
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
99 DENIED edit 
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    +title: "Why is Linux so frustrating for some people?"
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    +body: """
      Don’t get me wrong. I love Linux and FOSS. I have been using and installing distros on my own since I was 12. Now that I’m working in tech-related positions, after the Reddit migration happened, etc. I recovered my interest in all the Linux environment. I use Ubuntu as my main operating system in my Desktop, but I always end up feeling very limited. There’s always software I can’t use properly (and not just Windows stuff), some stuff badly configured with weird error messages… last time I was not able to even use the apt command. Sometimes I lack time and energy for troubleshooting and sometimes I just fail at it.\n
      \n
      I usually end up in need of redoing a fresh install until it breaks up again. Maybe Linux is not good for beginners working full time? Maybe we should do something like that Cisco course that teaches you the basic commands?
      """
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  +image: null
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    My first experience with linux was Ubuntu. Sue me, it was listed under most “most user friendly distro” listicles when I wasn’t smart enough to realize those were mostly marketing.\n
    \n
    It worked fine for my purposes, though it took getting used to, but it would wake itself up from sleep after a few minutes. I would have to shut it off at night so that I wouldn’t wake up in a panic as an eerie light emanated through the room from my closed laptop. I did my best searching for the problem, but could never find a solution that worked; in retrospect, I probably just didn’t have the language to adequately describe the problem.\n
    \n
    Nothing about the GUI was well-documented to the degree that CLI apps were. If I needed to make any changes, there would be like one grainy video on youtube that showed what apps to open and buttons to click and failed to solve my problem, but a dozen Stack Exchange articles telling me exactly what to do via the terminal.\n
    \n
    I remember going off on some friends online when they tried to convince me Linux and the terminal were superior. I ranted about how this stupid sleep issue was indicative of larger, more annoying problems that drove potential users away. I raged about how hostile to users this esoteric nerds-only UX is. I cried about Windows could be better for everyone if the most computer-adept people would stop jumping ship for mediocre OSes.\n
    \n
    I met another friend who used Arch (btw) within a year from that hissy fit, and she fixed my laptop within minutes. Using a CLI app nonetheless. I grumbled angrily to myself.\n
    \n
    A few years later and everyone’s home all the time for some reason, and I get the wild idea that I’m going to be a(n ethical) hacker for whatever reason. I then proceeded to install Kali on a VM and the rest is history.\n
    \n
    The point being that some people labor under the misguided belief that technology should conform to the users, and because we were mostly raised on Windows or Mac, we develop the misconception that those interfaces are “intuitive” (solely because we learned them during the best time in our life to pick up new skills). Then you try to move to linux for whatever reason and everything works differently and the process is jarring and noticeably requires the user conforming to the technology–i.e. changing bad habits learned from other OSes to fit the new one. The lucky few of us go on to learn many other OSes and start to see beyond the specifics to the abstract ideas similar to all of them, then it doesn’t matter if you have to work with iOS or TempleOS, you understand the basics of how it all fits together.\n
    \n
    TL;DR Category theorists must be the least frustrated people alive
    """
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689572511 {#2351
    date: 2023-07-17 07:41:51.0 +02:00
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  +"title": 156939
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100 DENIED moderate 
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  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "Why-is-Linux-so-frustrating-for-some-people"
    +title: "Why is Linux so frustrating for some people?"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      Don’t get me wrong. I love Linux and FOSS. I have been using and installing distros on my own since I was 12. Now that I’m working in tech-related positions, after the Reddit migration happened, etc. I recovered my interest in all the Linux environment. I use Ubuntu as my main operating system in my Desktop, but I always end up feeling very limited. There’s always software I can’t use properly (and not just Windows stuff), some stuff badly configured with weird error messages… last time I was not able to even use the apt command. Sometimes I lack time and energy for troubleshooting and sometimes I just fail at it.\n
      \n
      I usually end up in need of redoing a fresh install until it breaks up again. Maybe Linux is not good for beginners working full time? Maybe we should do something like that Cisco course that teaches you the basic commands?
      """
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    My first experience with linux was Ubuntu. Sue me, it was listed under most “most user friendly distro” listicles when I wasn’t smart enough to realize those were mostly marketing.\n
    \n
    It worked fine for my purposes, though it took getting used to, but it would wake itself up from sleep after a few minutes. I would have to shut it off at night so that I wouldn’t wake up in a panic as an eerie light emanated through the room from my closed laptop. I did my best searching for the problem, but could never find a solution that worked; in retrospect, I probably just didn’t have the language to adequately describe the problem.\n
    \n
    Nothing about the GUI was well-documented to the degree that CLI apps were. If I needed to make any changes, there would be like one grainy video on youtube that showed what apps to open and buttons to click and failed to solve my problem, but a dozen Stack Exchange articles telling me exactly what to do via the terminal.\n
    \n
    I remember going off on some friends online when they tried to convince me Linux and the terminal were superior. I ranted about how this stupid sleep issue was indicative of larger, more annoying problems that drove potential users away. I raged about how hostile to users this esoteric nerds-only UX is. I cried about Windows could be better for everyone if the most computer-adept people would stop jumping ship for mediocre OSes.\n
    \n
    I met another friend who used Arch (btw) within a year from that hissy fit, and she fixed my laptop within minutes. Using a CLI app nonetheless. I grumbled angrily to myself.\n
    \n
    A few years later and everyone’s home all the time for some reason, and I get the wild idea that I’m going to be a(n ethical) hacker for whatever reason. I then proceeded to install Kali on a VM and the rest is history.\n
    \n
    The point being that some people labor under the misguided belief that technology should conform to the users, and because we were mostly raised on Windows or Mac, we develop the misconception that those interfaces are “intuitive” (solely because we learned them during the best time in our life to pick up new skills). Then you try to move to linux for whatever reason and everything works differently and the process is jarring and noticeably requires the user conforming to the technology–i.e. changing bad habits learned from other OSes to fit the new one. The lucky few of us go on to learn many other OSes and start to see beyond the specifics to the abstract ideas similar to all of them, then it doesn’t matter if you have to work with iOS or TempleOS, you understand the basics of how it all fits together.\n
    \n
    TL;DR Category theorists must be the least frustrated people alive
    """
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689572511 {#2351
    date: 2023-07-17 07:41:51.0 +02:00
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  +"title": 156939
}
 
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101 DENIED ROLE_USER 
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102 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1362
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2529 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "What-can-you-do-on-Linux-that-you-can-t-do"
  +title: "What can you do on Linux that you can't do on Windows?"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    edit: hey guys, 60+ comments, can’t reply from now on, but know that I am grateful for your comments, keep the convo going. Thank you to the y’all people who gave unbiased answers and thanks also to those who told me about `Waydroid` and `Docker`\n
    \n
    edit: Well, now that’s sobering, apparently I can do most of these things on Windows with ease too. I won’t be switching back to Windows anytime soon, but it appears that my friend was right. I am getting FOMO Fear of missing out right now.\n
    \n
    I do need these apps right now, but there are some apps on Windows for which we don’t have a great replacement\n
    \n
    1. Adobe\n
    2. MS word (yeah, I don’t like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it’s not as good as MS suite, of c, but it’s really bad.\n
    3. Games ( a big one although steam is helping bridge the gap)\n
    4. Many torrented apps, most of these are Windows specific and thus I won’t have any luck installing them on Linux.\n
    5. Apparently windows is allowing their users to use some Android apps?\n
    \n
    Torrented apps would be my biggest concern, I mean, these are Windows specific, how can I run them on Linux? Seriously, I want to know how. Can wine run most of the apps without error? I am thinking of torrenting some educational software made for Windows.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    Let me list the customizations I have done with my xfce desktop and you tell me if I can do that on Windows.\n
    \n
    I told my friend that I can’t leave linux because of all the customization I have done and he said, you just don’t like to accept that Windows can do that too. Yeah, because I think it can’t do some of it (and I like Linux better)\n
    \n
    But yeah, let’s give the devil it’s due, can I do these things on Windows?\n
    \n
    1. I have applications which launch from terminal eg: `vlc` would open vlc (no questions asked, no other stuff needed, just type vlc)\n
    2. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can’t do this on Windows.\n
    3. I can basically automate most of my tasks and it has a good integration with my apps.\n
    4. I can create desktop launchers.\n
    5. Not update my system, I love to update because my updates aren’t usually 4 freaking GB and the largest update I have seen has been 200-300 mbs, probably less but yeah, I was free to not update my PC if I so choose. Can you do this on Windows? And also, Linux updates fail less often, I mean, it might break your system, but the thing won’t stop in the middle and say “Bye Bye, updates failed” and now you have to waste 4GB again to download the update. PS: You should always keep your apps upto date mostly for security reasons, but Linux won’t force it on you and ruin your workflow.\n
    6. Create custom panel plugin.\n
    \n
    ![](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/3e8c1c45-8e3e-4f35-b1f8-7cc2b3915a9e.png)\n
    \n
    7. My understanding is that the Windows terminal sucks? I don’t know why, it just looks bad.\n
    \n
    I am sure as hell there are more but this is at the top of my mind rn, can I do this on Windows. Also, give me something that you personally do on Linux but can’t do it on Windows.
    """
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      +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
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      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2019 …}
      +body: """
        Surprisingly profound for just another windows v linux slapfight. I recently watched Cory Doctorow’s DEFCON talk on enshittification, and something he brought up is how once-good, now-shitty social media platforms held their users hostage by being the only platform with all their “friends” (or at least that specific group of people)—the alternatives being to organize dozens of people to migrate to a new service or losing all those friends.\n
        \n
        *Real* friends *aren’t* platform exclusive
        """
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        "@dlove67@feddit.nl"
        "@Samihazah@programming.dev"
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  +title: "What can you do on Linux that you can't do on Windows?"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    edit: hey guys, 60+ comments, can’t reply from now on, but know that I am grateful for your comments, keep the convo going. Thank you to the y’all people who gave unbiased answers and thanks also to those who told me about `Waydroid` and `Docker`\n
    \n
    edit: Well, now that’s sobering, apparently I can do most of these things on Windows with ease too. I won’t be switching back to Windows anytime soon, but it appears that my friend was right. I am getting FOMO Fear of missing out right now.\n
    \n
    I do need these apps right now, but there are some apps on Windows for which we don’t have a great replacement\n
    \n
    1. Adobe\n
    2. MS word (yeah, I don’t like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it’s not as good as MS suite, of c, but it’s really bad.\n
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    5. Apparently windows is allowing their users to use some Android apps?\n
    \n
    Torrented apps would be my biggest concern, I mean, these are Windows specific, how can I run them on Linux? Seriously, I want to know how. Can wine run most of the apps without error? I am thinking of torrenting some educational software made for Windows.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    Let me list the customizations I have done with my xfce desktop and you tell me if I can do that on Windows.\n
    \n
    I told my friend that I can’t leave linux because of all the customization I have done and he said, you just don’t like to accept that Windows can do that too. Yeah, because I think it can’t do some of it (and I like Linux better)\n
    \n
    But yeah, let’s give the devil it’s due, can I do these things on Windows?\n
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    2. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can’t do this on Windows.\n
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    5. Not update my system, I love to update because my updates aren’t usually 4 freaking GB and the largest update I have seen has been 200-300 mbs, probably less but yeah, I was free to not update my PC if I so choose. Can you do this on Windows? And also, Linux updates fail less often, I mean, it might break your system, but the thing won’t stop in the middle and say “Bye Bye, updates failed” and now you have to waste 4GB again to download the update. PS: You should always keep your apps upto date mostly for security reasons, but Linux won’t force it on you and ruin your workflow.\n
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    7. My understanding is that the Windows terminal sucks? I don’t know why, it just looks bad.\n
    \n
    I am sure as hell there are more but this is at the top of my mind rn, can I do this on Windows. Also, give me something that you personally do on Linux but can’t do it on Windows.
    """
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        Surprisingly profound for just another windows v linux slapfight. I recently watched Cory Doctorow’s DEFCON talk on enshittification, and something he brought up is how once-good, now-shitty social media platforms held their users hostage by being the only platform with all their “friends” (or at least that specific group of people)—the alternatives being to organize dozens of people to migrate to a new service or losing all those friends.\n
        \n
        *Real* friends *aren’t* platform exclusive
        """
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104 DENIED moderate 
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  +body: """
    edit: hey guys, 60+ comments, can’t reply from now on, but know that I am grateful for your comments, keep the convo going. Thank you to the y’all people who gave unbiased answers and thanks also to those who told me about `Waydroid` and `Docker`\n
    \n
    edit: Well, now that’s sobering, apparently I can do most of these things on Windows with ease too. I won’t be switching back to Windows anytime soon, but it appears that my friend was right. I am getting FOMO Fear of missing out right now.\n
    \n
    I do need these apps right now, but there are some apps on Windows for which we don’t have a great replacement\n
    \n
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    2. MS word (yeah, I don’t like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it’s not as good as MS suite, of c, but it’s really bad.\n
    3. Games ( a big one although steam is helping bridge the gap)\n
    4. Many torrented apps, most of these are Windows specific and thus I won’t have any luck installing them on Linux.\n
    5. Apparently windows is allowing their users to use some Android apps?\n
    \n
    Torrented apps would be my biggest concern, I mean, these are Windows specific, how can I run them on Linux? Seriously, I want to know how. Can wine run most of the apps without error? I am thinking of torrenting some educational software made for Windows.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    Let me list the customizations I have done with my xfce desktop and you tell me if I can do that on Windows.\n
    \n
    I told my friend that I can’t leave linux because of all the customization I have done and he said, you just don’t like to accept that Windows can do that too. Yeah, because I think it can’t do some of it (and I like Linux better)\n
    \n
    But yeah, let’s give the devil it’s due, can I do these things on Windows?\n
    \n
    1. I have applications which launch from terminal eg: `vlc` would open vlc (no questions asked, no other stuff needed, just type vlc)\n
    2. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can’t do this on Windows.\n
    3. I can basically automate most of my tasks and it has a good integration with my apps.\n
    4. I can create desktop launchers.\n
    5. Not update my system, I love to update because my updates aren’t usually 4 freaking GB and the largest update I have seen has been 200-300 mbs, probably less but yeah, I was free to not update my PC if I so choose. Can you do this on Windows? And also, Linux updates fail less often, I mean, it might break your system, but the thing won’t stop in the middle and say “Bye Bye, updates failed” and now you have to waste 4GB again to download the update. PS: You should always keep your apps upto date mostly for security reasons, but Linux won’t force it on you and ruin your workflow.\n
    6. Create custom panel plugin.\n
    \n
    ![](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/3e8c1c45-8e3e-4f35-b1f8-7cc2b3915a9e.png)\n
    \n
    7. My understanding is that the Windows terminal sucks? I don’t know why, it just looks bad.\n
    \n
    I am sure as hell there are more but this is at the top of my mind rn, can I do this on Windows. Also, give me something that you personally do on Linux but can’t do it on Windows.
    """
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        Surprisingly profound for just another windows v linux slapfight. I recently watched Cory Doctorow’s DEFCON talk on enshittification, and something he brought up is how once-good, now-shitty social media platforms held their users hostage by being the only platform with all their “friends” (or at least that specific group of people)—the alternatives being to organize dozens of people to migrate to a new service or losing all those friends.\n
        \n
        *Real* friends *aren’t* platform exclusive
        """
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1695094921 {#2550
    date: 2023-09-19 05:42:01.0 +02:00
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}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
105 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
106 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1361
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1362
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2529 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "What-can-you-do-on-Linux-that-you-can-t-do"
    +title: "What can you do on Linux that you can't do on Windows?"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      edit: hey guys, 60+ comments, can’t reply from now on, but know that I am grateful for your comments, keep the convo going. Thank you to the y’all people who gave unbiased answers and thanks also to those who told me about `Waydroid` and `Docker`\n
      \n
      edit: Well, now that’s sobering, apparently I can do most of these things on Windows with ease too. I won’t be switching back to Windows anytime soon, but it appears that my friend was right. I am getting FOMO Fear of missing out right now.\n
      \n
      I do need these apps right now, but there are some apps on Windows for which we don’t have a great replacement\n
      \n
      1. Adobe\n
      2. MS word (yeah, I don’t like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it’s not as good as MS suite, of c, but it’s really bad.\n
      3. Games ( a big one although steam is helping bridge the gap)\n
      4. Many torrented apps, most of these are Windows specific and thus I won’t have any luck installing them on Linux.\n
      5. Apparently windows is allowing their users to use some Android apps?\n
      \n
      Torrented apps would be my biggest concern, I mean, these are Windows specific, how can I run them on Linux? Seriously, I want to know how. Can wine run most of the apps without error? I am thinking of torrenting some educational software made for Windows.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      Let me list the customizations I have done with my xfce desktop and you tell me if I can do that on Windows.\n
      \n
      I told my friend that I can’t leave linux because of all the customization I have done and he said, you just don’t like to accept that Windows can do that too. Yeah, because I think it can’t do some of it (and I like Linux better)\n
      \n
      But yeah, let’s give the devil it’s due, can I do these things on Windows?\n
      \n
      1. I have applications which launch from terminal eg: `vlc` would open vlc (no questions asked, no other stuff needed, just type vlc)\n
      2. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can’t do this on Windows.\n
      3. I can basically automate most of my tasks and it has a good integration with my apps.\n
      4. I can create desktop launchers.\n
      5. Not update my system, I love to update because my updates aren’t usually 4 freaking GB and the largest update I have seen has been 200-300 mbs, probably less but yeah, I was free to not update my PC if I so choose. Can you do this on Windows? And also, Linux updates fail less often, I mean, it might break your system, but the thing won’t stop in the middle and say “Bye Bye, updates failed” and now you have to waste 4GB again to download the update. PS: You should always keep your apps upto date mostly for security reasons, but Linux won’t force it on you and ruin your workflow.\n
      6. Create custom panel plugin.\n
      \n
      ![](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/3e8c1c45-8e3e-4f35-b1f8-7cc2b3915a9e.png)\n
      \n
      7. My understanding is that the Windows terminal sucks? I don’t know why, it just looks bad.\n
      \n
      I am sure as hell there are more but this is at the top of my mind rn, can I do this on Windows. Also, give me something that you personally do on Linux but can’t do it on Windows.
      """
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    -id: 9136
    -titleTs: "'linux':6 'window':13"
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    +cross: false
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    +visibility: "visible             "
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1695094921 {#2550
      date: 2023-09-19 05:42:01.0 +02:00
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    +__isInitialized__: true
     …2
  }
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1403 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2019 …}
  +body: """
    Surprisingly profound for just another windows v linux slapfight. I recently watched Cory Doctorow’s DEFCON talk on enshittification, and something he brought up is how once-good, now-shitty social media platforms held their users hostage by being the only platform with all their “friends” (or at least that specific group of people)—the alternatives being to organize dozens of people to migrate to a new service or losing all those friends.\n
    \n
    *Real* friends *aren’t* platform exclusive
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1695137534 {#1404
    date: 2023-09-19 17:32:14.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Subject6051@lemmy.ml"
    "@dlove67@feddit.nl"
    "@Samihazah@programming.dev"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2023 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2032 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2024 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2018 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2011 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2021 …}
  -id: 85010
  -bodyTs: "'altern':58 'anoth':5 'aren':78 'brought':23 'cori':13 'defcon':16 'doctorow':14 'dozen':62 'enshittif':19 'exclus':81 'friend':48,75,77 'good':29 'group':54 'held':36 'hostag':39 'least':51 'linux':8 'lose':72 'media':34 'migrat':66 'new':69 'now-shitti':30 'once-good':27 'organ':61 'peopl':56,64 'platform':35,44,80 'profound':2 'real':76 'recent':11 'servic':70 'shitti':32 'slapfight':9 'social':33 'someth':21 'specif':53 'surpris':1 'talk':17 'user':38 'v':7 'watch':12 'window':6"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/4001133"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1695137534 {#1363
    date: 2023-09-19 17:32:14.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 85010
}
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
107 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1361
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1362
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2529 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "What-can-you-do-on-Linux-that-you-can-t-do"
    +title: "What can you do on Linux that you can't do on Windows?"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      edit: hey guys, 60+ comments, can’t reply from now on, but know that I am grateful for your comments, keep the convo going. Thank you to the y’all people who gave unbiased answers and thanks also to those who told me about `Waydroid` and `Docker`\n
      \n
      edit: Well, now that’s sobering, apparently I can do most of these things on Windows with ease too. I won’t be switching back to Windows anytime soon, but it appears that my friend was right. I am getting FOMO Fear of missing out right now.\n
      \n
      I do need these apps right now, but there are some apps on Windows for which we don’t have a great replacement\n
      \n
      1. Adobe\n
      2. MS word (yeah, I don’t like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it’s not as good as MS suite, of c, but it’s really bad.\n
      3. Games ( a big one although steam is helping bridge the gap)\n
      4. Many torrented apps, most of these are Windows specific and thus I won’t have any luck installing them on Linux.\n
      5. Apparently windows is allowing their users to use some Android apps?\n
      \n
      Torrented apps would be my biggest concern, I mean, these are Windows specific, how can I run them on Linux? Seriously, I want to know how. Can wine run most of the apps without error? I am thinking of torrenting some educational software made for Windows.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      Let me list the customizations I have done with my xfce desktop and you tell me if I can do that on Windows.\n
      \n
      I told my friend that I can’t leave linux because of all the customization I have done and he said, you just don’t like to accept that Windows can do that too. Yeah, because I think it can’t do some of it (and I like Linux better)\n
      \n
      But yeah, let’s give the devil it’s due, can I do these things on Windows?\n
      \n
      1. I have applications which launch from terminal eg: `vlc` would open vlc (no questions asked, no other stuff needed, just type vlc)\n
      2. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can’t do this on Windows.\n
      3. I can basically automate most of my tasks and it has a good integration with my apps.\n
      4. I can create desktop launchers.\n
      5. Not update my system, I love to update because my updates aren’t usually 4 freaking GB and the largest update I have seen has been 200-300 mbs, probably less but yeah, I was free to not update my PC if I so choose. Can you do this on Windows? And also, Linux updates fail less often, I mean, it might break your system, but the thing won’t stop in the middle and say “Bye Bye, updates failed” and now you have to waste 4GB again to download the update. PS: You should always keep your apps upto date mostly for security reasons, but Linux won’t force it on you and ruin your workflow.\n
      6. Create custom panel plugin.\n
      \n
      ![](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/3e8c1c45-8e3e-4f35-b1f8-7cc2b3915a9e.png)\n
      \n
      7. My understanding is that the Windows terminal sucks? I don’t know why, it just looks bad.\n
      \n
      I am sure as hell there are more but this is at the top of my mind rn, can I do this on Windows. Also, give me something that you personally do on Linux but can’t do it on Windows.
      """
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    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1695094921 {#2550
      date: 2023-09-19 05:42:01.0 +02:00
    }
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     …2
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1403 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2019 …}
  +body: """
    Surprisingly profound for just another windows v linux slapfight. I recently watched Cory Doctorow’s DEFCON talk on enshittification, and something he brought up is how once-good, now-shitty social media platforms held their users hostage by being the only platform with all their “friends” (or at least that specific group of people)—the alternatives being to organize dozens of people to migrate to a new service or losing all those friends.\n
    \n
    *Real* friends *aren’t* platform exclusive
    """
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    "@Subject6051@lemmy.ml"
    "@dlove67@feddit.nl"
    "@Samihazah@programming.dev"
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  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2018 …}
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  +"title": 85010
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
108 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1361
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1362
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2529 …}
    +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
    +image: null
    +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
    +slug: "What-can-you-do-on-Linux-that-you-can-t-do"
    +title: "What can you do on Linux that you can't do on Windows?"
    +url: null
    +body: """
      edit: hey guys, 60+ comments, can’t reply from now on, but know that I am grateful for your comments, keep the convo going. Thank you to the y’all people who gave unbiased answers and thanks also to those who told me about `Waydroid` and `Docker`\n
      \n
      edit: Well, now that’s sobering, apparently I can do most of these things on Windows with ease too. I won’t be switching back to Windows anytime soon, but it appears that my friend was right. I am getting FOMO Fear of missing out right now.\n
      \n
      I do need these apps right now, but there are some apps on Windows for which we don’t have a great replacement\n
      \n
      1. Adobe\n
      2. MS word (yeah, I don’t like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it’s not as good as MS suite, of c, but it’s really bad.\n
      3. Games ( a big one although steam is helping bridge the gap)\n
      4. Many torrented apps, most of these are Windows specific and thus I won’t have any luck installing them on Linux.\n
      5. Apparently windows is allowing their users to use some Android apps?\n
      \n
      Torrented apps would be my biggest concern, I mean, these are Windows specific, how can I run them on Linux? Seriously, I want to know how. Can wine run most of the apps without error? I am thinking of torrenting some educational software made for Windows.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      Let me list the customizations I have done with my xfce desktop and you tell me if I can do that on Windows.\n
      \n
      I told my friend that I can’t leave linux because of all the customization I have done and he said, you just don’t like to accept that Windows can do that too. Yeah, because I think it can’t do some of it (and I like Linux better)\n
      \n
      But yeah, let’s give the devil it’s due, can I do these things on Windows?\n
      \n
      1. I have applications which launch from terminal eg: `vlc` would open vlc (no questions asked, no other stuff needed, just type vlc)\n
      2. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can’t do this on Windows.\n
      3. I can basically automate most of my tasks and it has a good integration with my apps.\n
      4. I can create desktop launchers.\n
      5. Not update my system, I love to update because my updates aren’t usually 4 freaking GB and the largest update I have seen has been 200-300 mbs, probably less but yeah, I was free to not update my PC if I so choose. Can you do this on Windows? And also, Linux updates fail less often, I mean, it might break your system, but the thing won’t stop in the middle and say “Bye Bye, updates failed” and now you have to waste 4GB again to download the update. PS: You should always keep your apps upto date mostly for security reasons, but Linux won’t force it on you and ruin your workflow.\n
      6. Create custom panel plugin.\n
      \n
      ![](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/3e8c1c45-8e3e-4f35-b1f8-7cc2b3915a9e.png)\n
      \n
      7. My understanding is that the Windows terminal sucks? I don’t know why, it just looks bad.\n
      \n
      I am sure as hell there are more but this is at the top of my mind rn, can I do this on Windows. Also, give me something that you personally do on Linux but can’t do it on Windows.
      """
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      date: 2023-09-19 05:42:01.0 +02:00
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     …2
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  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1403 …}
  +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#2019 …}
  +body: """
    Surprisingly profound for just another windows v linux slapfight. I recently watched Cory Doctorow’s DEFCON talk on enshittification, and something he brought up is how once-good, now-shitty social media platforms held their users hostage by being the only platform with all their “friends” (or at least that specific group of people)—the alternatives being to organize dozens of people to migrate to a new service or losing all those friends.\n
    \n
    *Real* friends *aren’t* platform exclusive
    """
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  +mentions: [
    "@Subject6051@lemmy.ml"
    "@dlove67@feddit.nl"
    "@Samihazah@programming.dev"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2023 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2032 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2024 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2018 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2011 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2021 …}
  -id: 85010
  -bodyTs: "'altern':58 'anoth':5 'aren':78 'brought':23 'cori':13 'defcon':16 'doctorow':14 'dozen':62 'enshittif':19 'exclus':81 'friend':48,75,77 'good':29 'group':54 'held':36 'hostag':39 'least':51 'linux':8 'lose':72 'media':34 'migrat':66 'new':69 'now-shitti':30 'once-good':27 'organ':61 'peopl':56,64 'platform':35,44,80 'profound':2 'real':76 'recent':11 'servic':70 'shitti':32 'slapfight':9 'social':33 'someth':21 'specif':53 'surpris':1 'talk':17 'user':38 'v':7 'watch':12 'window':6"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/4001133"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1695137534 {#1363
    date: 2023-09-19 17:32:14.0 +02:00
  }
  +"title": 85010
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
109 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
110 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\Entry {#1430
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#1674 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1661 …}
  +slug: "Slow-Nala-completions-Janky-hack-m8"
  +title: "Slow Nala completions - Janky hack m8"
  +url: "https://github.com/volitank/nala"
  +body: """
    I’ve been using nala on my debian-based computers instead of apt, mostly for the parallel downloads, but also because the UI is nicer. I have one issue, and that’s the slow completions; it’s not wasting painful amounts of time, but it still takes a second or two each time I hit tab. I don’t know if this is the same for all shells, but I’m using zsh.\n
    \n
    I tried a workaround, but it seems prone to breaking something. So far it’s working fine for my purposes, so I thought I’d share anyway:\n
    \n
    1. I backed up `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala` to my home directory\n
    2. I copied `/usr/share/zsh/functions/Completion/Debian/_apt` to `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala`\n
    3. I used vim to `%s/apt/nala/g` (replace every instance of ‘apt’ to ‘nala’) in the new `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala`\n
    \n
    Already that’s sped up the completions to seemingly as fast as any other command. And already I can see some jank peaking through: zsh now thinks nala has access to apt commands that it definitely doesn’t (e.g. `nala build-dep`, `nala changelog` and `nala full-upgrade`), and it has lost autocompletions for `nala fetch` and `nala history`.\n
    \n
    Once I understand completions files syntax better, I’ll fix it to only use the commands listed in nala’s manpage and submit a pr to the git repo. In the meantime, if anyone has suggestions for how to correct the existing completions file or more ways to make the `_apt` completions fit nala, it’d be much appreciated.
    """
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"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
111 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\Entry {#1430
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#1674 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1661 …}
  +slug: "Slow-Nala-completions-Janky-hack-m8"
  +title: "Slow Nala completions - Janky hack m8"
  +url: "https://github.com/volitank/nala"
  +body: """
    I’ve been using nala on my debian-based computers instead of apt, mostly for the parallel downloads, but also because the UI is nicer. I have one issue, and that’s the slow completions; it’s not wasting painful amounts of time, but it still takes a second or two each time I hit tab. I don’t know if this is the same for all shells, but I’m using zsh.\n
    \n
    I tried a workaround, but it seems prone to breaking something. So far it’s working fine for my purposes, so I thought I’d share anyway:\n
    \n
    1. I backed up `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala` to my home directory\n
    2. I copied `/usr/share/zsh/functions/Completion/Debian/_apt` to `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala`\n
    3. I used vim to `%s/apt/nala/g` (replace every instance of ‘apt’ to ‘nala’) in the new `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala`\n
    \n
    Already that’s sped up the completions to seemingly as fast as any other command. And already I can see some jank peaking through: zsh now thinks nala has access to apt commands that it definitely doesn’t (e.g. `nala build-dep`, `nala changelog` and `nala full-upgrade`), and it has lost autocompletions for `nala fetch` and `nala history`.\n
    \n
    Once I understand completions files syntax better, I’ll fix it to only use the commands listed in nala’s manpage and submit a pr to the git repo. In the meantime, if anyone has suggestions for how to correct the existing completions file or more ways to make the `_apt` completions fit nala, it’d be much appreciated.
    """
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
112 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\Entry {#1430
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#1674 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1661 …}
  +slug: "Slow-Nala-completions-Janky-hack-m8"
  +title: "Slow Nala completions - Janky hack m8"
  +url: "https://github.com/volitank/nala"
  +body: """
    I’ve been using nala on my debian-based computers instead of apt, mostly for the parallel downloads, but also because the UI is nicer. I have one issue, and that’s the slow completions; it’s not wasting painful amounts of time, but it still takes a second or two each time I hit tab. I don’t know if this is the same for all shells, but I’m using zsh.\n
    \n
    I tried a workaround, but it seems prone to breaking something. So far it’s working fine for my purposes, so I thought I’d share anyway:\n
    \n
    1. I backed up `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala` to my home directory\n
    2. I copied `/usr/share/zsh/functions/Completion/Debian/_apt` to `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala`\n
    3. I used vim to `%s/apt/nala/g` (replace every instance of ‘apt’ to ‘nala’) in the new `/usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions/_nala`\n
    \n
    Already that’s sped up the completions to seemingly as fast as any other command. And already I can see some jank peaking through: zsh now thinks nala has access to apt commands that it definitely doesn’t (e.g. `nala build-dep`, `nala changelog` and `nala full-upgrade`), and it has lost autocompletions for `nala fetch` and `nala history`.\n
    \n
    Once I understand completions files syntax better, I’ll fix it to only use the commands listed in nala’s manpage and submit a pr to the git repo. In the meantime, if anyone has suggestions for how to correct the existing completions file or more ways to make the `_apt` completions fit nala, it’d be much appreciated.
    """
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}
 
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Show voter details
113 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
114 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\Entry {#1557
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Who-does-flatpak-snap-benefit"
  +title: "Who does flatpak/snap benefit?"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    As a user, the best way to handle applications is a central repository where interoperability is guaranteed. Something like what Debian does with the base repos. I just run an install and it’s all taken care of for me. What’s more, I don’t deal with unnecessary bloat from dozens of different versions of the same library according to the needs of each separate dev/team.\n
    \n
    So the self-contained packages must be primarily of benefit to the devs, right? Except I was just reading through how flatpak handles dependencies: runtimes, base apps, and bundling. Runtimes and base apps supply dependencies to the whole system, so they only ever get installed once… but the documentation explicitly mentions that there are only few of both meaning that most devs will either have to do what repo devs do—ensure their app works with the standard libraries—or opt for bundling.\n
    \n
    Devs being human—and humans being animals—this means the overall average tendency will be to bundle, because that’s easier for them. Which means that I, the end user, now have more bloat, which incentivizes me to retreat to the disk-saving havens of repos, which incentivizes the devs to release on a repo anyway…\n
    \n
    So again… who does this benefit? Or am I just completely misunderstanding the costs and benefits?
    """
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  -id: 16065
  -titleTs: "'benefit':4 'flatpak/snap':3"
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS DENIED 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
115 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\Entry {#1557
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Who-does-flatpak-snap-benefit"
  +title: "Who does flatpak/snap benefit?"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    As a user, the best way to handle applications is a central repository where interoperability is guaranteed. Something like what Debian does with the base repos. I just run an install and it’s all taken care of for me. What’s more, I don’t deal with unnecessary bloat from dozens of different versions of the same library according to the needs of each separate dev/team.\n
    \n
    So the self-contained packages must be primarily of benefit to the devs, right? Except I was just reading through how flatpak handles dependencies: runtimes, base apps, and bundling. Runtimes and base apps supply dependencies to the whole system, so they only ever get installed once… but the documentation explicitly mentions that there are only few of both meaning that most devs will either have to do what repo devs do—ensure their app works with the standard libraries—or opt for bundling.\n
    \n
    Devs being human—and humans being animals—this means the overall average tendency will be to bundle, because that’s easier for them. Which means that I, the end user, now have more bloat, which incentivizes me to retreat to the disk-saving havens of repos, which incentivizes the devs to release on a repo anyway…\n
    \n
    So again… who does this benefit? Or am I just completely misunderstanding the costs and benefits?
    """
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  -titleTs: "'benefit':4 'flatpak/snap':3"
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
116 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\Entry {#1557
  +user: App\Entity\User {#261 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1653 …}
  +image: null
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#1621 …}
  +slug: "Who-does-flatpak-snap-benefit"
  +title: "Who does flatpak/snap benefit?"
  +url: null
  +body: """
    As a user, the best way to handle applications is a central repository where interoperability is guaranteed. Something like what Debian does with the base repos. I just run an install and it’s all taken care of for me. What’s more, I don’t deal with unnecessary bloat from dozens of different versions of the same library according to the needs of each separate dev/team.\n
    \n
    So the self-contained packages must be primarily of benefit to the devs, right? Except I was just reading through how flatpak handles dependencies: runtimes, base apps, and bundling. Runtimes and base apps supply dependencies to the whole system, so they only ever get installed once… but the documentation explicitly mentions that there are only few of both meaning that most devs will either have to do what repo devs do—ensure their app works with the standard libraries—or opt for bundling.\n
    \n
    Devs being human—and humans being animals—this means the overall average tendency will be to bundle, because that’s easier for them. Which means that I, the end user, now have more bloat, which incentivizes me to retreat to the disk-saving havens of repos, which incentivizes the devs to release on a repo anyway…\n
    \n
    So again… who does this benefit? Or am I just completely misunderstanding the costs and benefits?
    """
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  -titleTs: "'benefit':4 'flatpak/snap':3"
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    date: 2023-09-16 19:45:14.0 +02:00
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}
 
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Show voter details
117 DENIED ROLE_ADMIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
118 DENIED ROLE_MODERATOR 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
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