Symfony Profiler

Security

Token

There is no security token.

Firewall

main Name

Security enabled

Stateless

Configuration

Key	Value
provider	security.user.provider.concrete.app_user_provider
context	main
entry_point	App\Security\KbinAuthenticator
user_checker	App\Security\UserChecker
access_denied_handler	(none)
access_denied_url	(none)
authenticators	[`"two_factor" "remember_me" "App\Security\KbinAuthenticator" "App\Security\FacebookAuthenticator" "App\Security\GoogleAuthenticator" "App\Security\GithubAuthenticator" "App\Security\KeycloakAuthenticator"`]

Listeners

Listener	Duration	Response
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ChannelListener {#723`-map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …} -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …} -httpPort: 80 -httpsPort: 443`}	0.00 ms	(none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ContextListener {#706-tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\TokenStorage {#1017 …} -sessionKey: "_security_main" -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …} -userProviders: Symfony\Component\DependencyInjection\Argument\RewindableGenerator {#705 …} -dispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …} -registered: false -trustResolver: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authentication\AuthenticationTrustResolver {#780 …} -sessionTrackerEnabler: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage::enableUsageTracking(): void {#703 …}}	42.03 ms	(none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AuthenticatorManagerListener {#584`-authenticatorManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Authentication\AuthenticatorManager {#595 …}`}	0.00 ms	(none)
Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Http\Firewall\TwoFactorAccessListener {#582`-twoFactorFirewallConfig: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\TwoFactor\TwoFactorFirewallConfig {#842 …} -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …} -twoFactorAccessDecider: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\TwoFactorAccessDecider {#581 …}`}	0.05 ms	(none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AccessListener {#579`-tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …} -accessDecisionManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\TraceableAccessDecisionManager {#937 …} -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}`}	0.00 ms	(none)
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\LogoutListener {#786`-tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …} -options: [ "csrf_parameter" => "_csrf_token" "csrf_token_id" => "logout" "logout_path" => "app_logout" ] -httpUtils: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\HttpUtils {#841 …} -csrfTokenManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Csrf\CsrfTokenManager {#1015 …} -eventDispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}`}	0.00 ms	(none)

Authenticators

No authenticators have been recorded. Check previous profiles on your authentication endpoint.

Access Decision

affirmative Strategy


"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\AuthenticatedVoter"
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\ExpressionVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"

#	Voter class
1	"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\AuthenticatedVoter"
2	"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
3	"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
4	"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\ExpressionVoter"
5	"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
6	"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
7	"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
8	"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
9	"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
10	"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
11	"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
12	"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
13	"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
14	"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"

Access decision log


null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1546
  +user: App\Entity\User {#1409 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1838 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: "It’s so easy to destroy shit. Much much harder to build something that will work."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 25
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703231612 {#2429
    date: 2023-12-22 08:53:32.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2427 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2446 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2483 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2466 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1378 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1635 …}
  -id: 242619
  -bodyTs: "'build':12 'destroy':6 'easi':4 'harder':10 'much':8,9 'shit':7 'someth':13 'work':16"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://jlai.lu/comment/4275072"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703231612 {#1394
    date: 2023-12-22 08:53:32.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1546
  +user: App\Entity\User {#1409 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1838 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: "It’s so easy to destroy shit. Much much harder to build something that will work."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 25
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703231612 {#2429
    date: 2023-12-22 08:53:32.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2427 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2446 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2483 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2466 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1378 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1635 …}
  -id: 242619
  -bodyTs: "'build':12 'destroy':6 'easi':4 'harder':10 'much':8,9 'shit':7 'someth':13 'work':16"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://jlai.lu/comment/4275072"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703231612 {#1394
    date: 2023-12-22 08:53:32.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1546
  +user: App\Entity\User {#1409 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1838 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: "It’s so easy to destroy shit. Much much harder to build something that will work."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 25
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703231612 {#2429
    date: 2023-12-22 08:53:32.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2427 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2446 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2483 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2466 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1378 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1635 …}
  -id: 242619
  -bodyTs: "'build':12 'destroy':6 'easi':4 'harder':10 'much':8,9 'shit':7 'someth':13 'work':16"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://jlai.lu/comment/4275072"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703231612 {#1394
    date: 2023-12-22 08:53:32.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1733
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2462 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1716 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: "And our president’s response is to drive our country further into debt in order to pay homage to Israel and pretend that they aren’t a pack of barbarians. It’s sickening."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 11
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703256544 {#1736
    date: 2023-12-22 15:49:04.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@dubteedub@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1717 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1741 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1707 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2464 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2448 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2447 …}
  -id: 243240
  -bodyTs: "'aren':25 'barbarian':30 'countri':10 'debt':13 'drive':8 'homag':18 'israel':20 'order':15 'pack':28 'pay':17 'presid':3 'pretend':22 'respons':5 'sicken':33"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1900928"
  +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706464659 {#1724
    date: 2024-01-28 18:57:39.0 +01:00
  }
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703256544 {#1729
    date: 2023-12-22 15:49:04.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1733
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2462 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1716 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
    \n
    Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
    \n
    Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
    \n
    Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
    \n
    Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
    \n
    It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
    \n
    > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
    \n
    The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
    \n
    Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
    \n
    Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
    """
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
    \n
    Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
    \n
    Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
    \n
    Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
    \n
    Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
    \n
    It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
    \n
    > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
    \n
    The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
    \n
    Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
    \n
    Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
    """
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
    \n
    Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
    \n
    Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
    \n
    Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
    \n
    Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
    \n
    Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
    \n
    It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
    \n
    > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
    \n
    The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
    \n
    Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
    \n
    Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
    """
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
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      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
      \n
      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
      \n
      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      \n
      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
      \n
      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
      \n
      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
      \n
      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
      \n
      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
      \n
      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
      """
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    > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
    > \n
    > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
    \n
    Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
    \n
    - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
    \n
    > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
    \n
    > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
    \n
    > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
    \n
    > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
    \n
    > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
    \n
    > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
    \n
    > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
    """
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      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
      \n
      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
      \n
      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      \n
      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
      \n
      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
      \n
      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
      \n
      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
      \n
      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
      \n
      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
      """
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    > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
    > \n
    > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
    \n
    Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
    \n
    - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
    \n
    > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
    \n
    > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
    \n
    > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
    \n
    > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
    \n
    > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
    \n
    > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
    \n
    > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
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      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
      \n
      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
      \n
      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      \n
      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
      \n
      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
      \n
      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
      \n
      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
      \n
      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
      \n
      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
      """
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    > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
    > \n
    > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
    > \n
    > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
    \n
    Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
    \n
    - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
    \n
    > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
    \n
    > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
    \n
    > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
    \n
    > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
    \n
    > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
    \n
    > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
    \n
    > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
        \n
        Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
        \n
        Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        \n
        Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
        \n
        It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
        \n
        > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
        \n
        The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
        \n
        Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
        \n
        Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
        """
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      > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      > \n
      > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
      \n
      > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
      \n
      > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
      \n
      > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
      \n
      > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
      \n
      > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
      \n
      > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
      \n
      > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
      """
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    > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
    \n
    Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
    \n
    > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
    \n
    If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
    \n
    Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
    \n
    And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
    \n
    > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
    \n
    This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
    \n
    > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
    \n
    Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
    \n
    [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
    \n
    > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
    \n
    That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
    \n
    [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
    \n
    The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
    \n
    [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
    \n
    Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
    \n
    Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
    \n
    [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
    \n
    Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
    """
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        > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
        \n
        Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
        \n
        Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        \n
        Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
        \n
        It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
        \n
        > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
        \n
        The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
        \n
        Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
        \n
        Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
        """
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      > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      > \n
      > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
      \n
      > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
      \n
      > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
      \n
      > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
      \n
      > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
      \n
      > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
      \n
      > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
      \n
      > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
      """
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    > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
    \n
    Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
    \n
    > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
    \n
    If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
    \n
    Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
    \n
    And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
    \n
    > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
    \n
    This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
    \n
    > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
    \n
    Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
    \n
    [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
    \n
    > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
    \n
    That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
    \n
    [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
    \n
    The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
    \n
    [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
    \n
    Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
    \n
    Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
    \n
    [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
    \n
    Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      ---\n
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      ---\n
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      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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        > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
        \n
        Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
        \n
        Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        \n
        Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        \n
        Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
        \n
        It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
        \n
        > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
        \n
        The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
        \n
        Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
        \n
        Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
        """
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      > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      > \n
      > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      > \n
      > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
      \n
      > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
      \n
      > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
      \n
      > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
      \n
      > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
      \n
      > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
      \n
      > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
      \n
      > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
      """
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    > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
    \n
    Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
    \n
    > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
    \n
    If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
    \n
    Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
    \n
    And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
    \n
    > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
    \n
    This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
    \n
    > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
    \n
    Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
    \n
    [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
    \n
    > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
    \n
    That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
    \n
    [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
    \n
    The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
    \n
    [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
    \n
    Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
    \n
    Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
    \n
    [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
    \n
    Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
          \n
          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
          \n
          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          \n
          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
          \n
          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
          \n
          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
          \n
          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
          \n
          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
          \n
          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
          """
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        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        > \n
        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
        \n
        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
        \n
        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
        \n
        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
        \n
        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
        \n
        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
        \n
        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
        \n
        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
        """
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      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
      \n
      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
      \n
      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
      \n
      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
      \n
      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
      \n
      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
      \n
      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
      \n
      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
      \n
      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
      \n
      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
      \n
      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
      \n
      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
      \n
      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
      \n
      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
      \n
      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
      \n
      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
      \n
      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
      """
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    Do you not think that Israel has any responsibility for their targeting of civilians?\n
    \n
    Israel is purposefully using dumb bombs (nearly half of all the thousands and thousands and thousands of explosives used on civilian population). They may be claiming to target some valid Hamas target, but the use of dumb munitions that can go hundreds of meters off course shows that is just not true. They are bombing indiscriminately with the explicit goal of the greatest destruction possible, impact on civilians, and genocide.\n
    \n
    - [Exclusive: Nearly half of the Israeli munitions dropped on Gaza are imprecise ‘dumb bombs,’ US intelligence assessment finds - CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/13/politics/intelligence-assessment-dumb-bombs-israel-gaza/index.html)\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    Warning them of what exactly? And to go where exactly?\n
    \n
    Israel has admitted to regular bombing of safe zones. The UN is investigating over 50 instances of such tactics. They are certainly not giving civilians time enough to pack up their lives with their supposed warnings.\n
    \n
    - [Israel said Gazans could flee to this neighbourhood - then it was hit](https://news.sky.com/story/israel-said-gazans-could-flee-to-this-neighbourhood-then-it-was-hit-13034936)\n
    \n
    > Using on-the-ground footage, satellite imagery and mapping software, a Sky News visual investigation found that Israel’s evacuation orders have instead been chaotic and contradictory and that a neighbourhood in Deir al Balah was hit one day after the IDF said evacuees could flee there.\n
    \n
    > Our investigation comes after a separate strike in Gaza was caught on camera by a Sky News team. It too came in an area that was supposed to be safe.\n
    \n
    > In response to our investigation, **the United Nations told Sky News that it is already investigating 52 similar incidents in areas where the Israeli army told civilians it was safe to evacuate to.**\n
    \n
    This is just pure evil.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
    \n
    This is the most unserious statement. Get real.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
    \n
    Even the Biden administration believes the Hamas figures are accurate. So does the UN, Amnesty International, WHO, and every other international aid organization. If anything, the count is low since Israel wiped out every hospital in the region and Palestinians are now just doing mass graves wherever they can.\n
    \n
    __\n
    \n
    > Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization.\n
    \n
    Knowingly or unknowingly, you are supported a genocide.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
          \n
          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
          \n
          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          \n
          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
          \n
          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
          \n
          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
          \n
          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
          \n
          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
          \n
          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
          """
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        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        > \n
        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
        \n
        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
        \n
        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
        \n
        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
        \n
        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
        \n
        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
        \n
        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
        \n
        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
        """
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      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
      \n
      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
      \n
      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
      \n
      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
      \n
      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
      \n
      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
      \n
      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
      \n
      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
      \n
      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
      \n
      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
      \n
      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
      \n
      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
      \n
      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
      \n
      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
      \n
      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
      \n
      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
      \n
      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
      """
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    Do you not think that Israel has any responsibility for their targeting of civilians?\n
    \n
    Israel is purposefully using dumb bombs (nearly half of all the thousands and thousands and thousands of explosives used on civilian population). They may be claiming to target some valid Hamas target, but the use of dumb munitions that can go hundreds of meters off course shows that is just not true. They are bombing indiscriminately with the explicit goal of the greatest destruction possible, impact on civilians, and genocide.\n
    \n
    - [Exclusive: Nearly half of the Israeli munitions dropped on Gaza are imprecise ‘dumb bombs,’ US intelligence assessment finds - CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/13/politics/intelligence-assessment-dumb-bombs-israel-gaza/index.html)\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    Warning them of what exactly? And to go where exactly?\n
    \n
    Israel has admitted to regular bombing of safe zones. The UN is investigating over 50 instances of such tactics. They are certainly not giving civilians time enough to pack up their lives with their supposed warnings.\n
    \n
    - [Israel said Gazans could flee to this neighbourhood - then it was hit](https://news.sky.com/story/israel-said-gazans-could-flee-to-this-neighbourhood-then-it-was-hit-13034936)\n
    \n
    > Using on-the-ground footage, satellite imagery and mapping software, a Sky News visual investigation found that Israel’s evacuation orders have instead been chaotic and contradictory and that a neighbourhood in Deir al Balah was hit one day after the IDF said evacuees could flee there.\n
    \n
    > Our investigation comes after a separate strike in Gaza was caught on camera by a Sky News team. It too came in an area that was supposed to be safe.\n
    \n
    > In response to our investigation, **the United Nations told Sky News that it is already investigating 52 similar incidents in areas where the Israeli army told civilians it was safe to evacuate to.**\n
    \n
    This is just pure evil.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
    \n
    This is the most unserious statement. Get real.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
    \n
    Even the Biden administration believes the Hamas figures are accurate. So does the UN, Amnesty International, WHO, and every other international aid organization. If anything, the count is low since Israel wiped out every hospital in the region and Palestinians are now just doing mass graves wherever they can.\n
    \n
    __\n
    \n
    > Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization.\n
    \n
    Knowingly or unknowingly, you are supported a genocide.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
          \n
          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
          \n
          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          \n
          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
          \n
          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
          \n
          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
          \n
          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
          \n
          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
          \n
          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
          """
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        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        > \n
        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
        \n
        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
        \n
        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
        \n
        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
        \n
        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
        \n
        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
        \n
        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
        \n
        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
        """
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      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
      \n
      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
      \n
      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
      \n
      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
      \n
      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
      \n
      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
      \n
      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
      \n
      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
      \n
      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
      \n
      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
      \n
      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
      \n
      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
      \n
      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
      \n
      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
      \n
      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
      \n
      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
      \n
      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
      """
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    Do you not think that Israel has any responsibility for their targeting of civilians?\n
    \n
    Israel is purposefully using dumb bombs (nearly half of all the thousands and thousands and thousands of explosives used on civilian population). They may be claiming to target some valid Hamas target, but the use of dumb munitions that can go hundreds of meters off course shows that is just not true. They are bombing indiscriminately with the explicit goal of the greatest destruction possible, impact on civilians, and genocide.\n
    \n
    - [Exclusive: Nearly half of the Israeli munitions dropped on Gaza are imprecise ‘dumb bombs,’ US intelligence assessment finds - CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/13/politics/intelligence-assessment-dumb-bombs-israel-gaza/index.html)\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    Warning them of what exactly? And to go where exactly?\n
    \n
    Israel has admitted to regular bombing of safe zones. The UN is investigating over 50 instances of such tactics. They are certainly not giving civilians time enough to pack up their lives with their supposed warnings.\n
    \n
    - [Israel said Gazans could flee to this neighbourhood - then it was hit](https://news.sky.com/story/israel-said-gazans-could-flee-to-this-neighbourhood-then-it-was-hit-13034936)\n
    \n
    > Using on-the-ground footage, satellite imagery and mapping software, a Sky News visual investigation found that Israel’s evacuation orders have instead been chaotic and contradictory and that a neighbourhood in Deir al Balah was hit one day after the IDF said evacuees could flee there.\n
    \n
    > Our investigation comes after a separate strike in Gaza was caught on camera by a Sky News team. It too came in an area that was supposed to be safe.\n
    \n
    > In response to our investigation, **the United Nations told Sky News that it is already investigating 52 similar incidents in areas where the Israeli army told civilians it was safe to evacuate to.**\n
    \n
    This is just pure evil.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
    \n
    This is the most unserious statement. Get real.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    > Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
    \n
    Even the Biden administration believes the Hamas figures are accurate. So does the UN, Amnesty International, WHO, and every other international aid organization. If anything, the count is low since Israel wiped out every hospital in the region and Palestinians are now just doing mass graves wherever they can.\n
    \n
    __\n
    \n
    > Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization.\n
    \n
    Knowingly or unknowingly, you are supported a genocide.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
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      ---\n
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      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
          \n
          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
          \n
          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          \n
          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
          \n
          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
          \n
          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
          \n
          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
          \n
          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
          \n
          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
          """
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        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        > \n
        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
        \n
        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
        \n
        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
        \n
        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
        \n
        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
        \n
        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
        \n
        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
        \n
        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
        """
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      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
      \n
      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
      \n
      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
      \n
      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
      \n
      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
      \n
      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
      \n
      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
      \n
      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
      \n
      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
      \n
      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
      \n
      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
      \n
      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
      \n
      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
      \n
      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
      \n
      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
      \n
      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
      \n
      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
      """
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    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
    \n
    > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
    \n
    …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
          \n
          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
          \n
          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          \n
          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
          \n
          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
          \n
          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
          \n
          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
          \n
          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
          \n
          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
          """
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        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        > \n
        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
        \n
        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
        \n
        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
        \n
        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
        \n
        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
        \n
        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
        \n
        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
        \n
        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
        """
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      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
      \n
      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
      \n
      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
      \n
      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
      \n
      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
      \n
      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
      \n
      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
      \n
      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
      \n
      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
      \n
      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
      \n
      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
      \n
      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
      \n
      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
      \n
      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
      \n
      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
      \n
      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
      \n
      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
      """
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    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
    \n
    > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
    \n
    …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
          \n
          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
          \n
          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          \n
          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          \n
          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
          \n
          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
          \n
          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
          \n
          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
          \n
          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
          \n
          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
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        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
        > \n
        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
        > \n
        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
        \n
        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
        \n
        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
        \n
        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
        \n
        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
        \n
        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
        \n
        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
        \n
        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
        \n
        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
        """
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      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
      \n
      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
      \n
      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
      \n
      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
      \n
      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
      \n
      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
      \n
      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
      \n
      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
      \n
      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
      \n
      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
      \n
      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
      \n
      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
      \n
      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
      \n
      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
      \n
      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
      \n
      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
      \n
      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
      \n
      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
      """
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    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
    \n
    aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
    \n
    > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
    \n
    …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
    """
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      ---\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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            > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
            \n
            Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
            \n
            Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
            \n
            Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
            \n
            Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
            \n
            It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
            \n
            > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
            \n
            The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
            \n
            Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
            \n
            Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
            """
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          > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          > \n
          > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
          \n
          - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
          \n
          > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
          \n
          > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
          \n
          > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
          \n
          > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
          \n
          > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
          \n
          > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
          \n
          > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
          """
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        > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
        \n
        Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
        \n
        > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
        \n
        If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
        \n
        [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
        \n
        Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
        \n
        And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
        \n
        > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
        \n
        This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
        \n
        > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
        \n
        Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
        \n
        > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
        \n
        [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
        \n
        The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
        \n
        [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
        \n
        Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
        \n
        Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
        \n
        [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
        \n
        Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
        """
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      > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
      \n
      > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
      \n
      …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
      """
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    > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
    \n
    We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
    \n
    > the actual root of the problem\n
    \n
    The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
    \n
    When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
    \n
    Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
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      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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            > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
            \n
            Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
            \n
            Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
            \n
            Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
            \n
            Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
            \n
            It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
            \n
            > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
            \n
            The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
            \n
            Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
            \n
            Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
            """
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          > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          > \n
          > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
          \n
          - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
          \n
          > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
          \n
          > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
          \n
          > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
          \n
          > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
          \n
          > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
          \n
          > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
          \n
          > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
          """
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        > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
        \n
        Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
        \n
        > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
        \n
        If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
        \n
        [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
        \n
        Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
        \n
        And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
        \n
        > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
        \n
        This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
        \n
        > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
        \n
        Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
        \n
        > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
        \n
        [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
        \n
        The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
        \n
        [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
        \n
        Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
        \n
        Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
        \n
        [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
        \n
        Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
        """
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      > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
      \n
      > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
      \n
      …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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    > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
    \n
    We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
    \n
    > the actual root of the problem\n
    \n
    The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
    \n
    When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
    \n
    Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
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      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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            > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
            \n
            Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
            \n
            Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
            \n
            Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
            \n
            Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
            \n
            Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
            \n
            It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
            \n
            > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
            \n
            The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
            \n
            Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
            \n
            Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
            """
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          > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
          > \n
          > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
          > \n
          > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
          \n
          Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
          \n
          - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
          \n
          > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
          \n
          > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
          \n
          > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
          \n
          > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
          \n
          > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
          \n
          > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
          \n
          > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
          """
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        > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
        \n
        Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
        \n
        > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
        \n
        If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
        \n
        [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
        \n
        Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
        \n
        And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
        \n
        > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
        \n
        This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
        \n
        > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
        \n
        Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
        \n
        > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
        \n
        That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
        \n
        [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
        \n
        The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
        \n
        [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
        \n
        Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
        \n
        Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
        \n
        [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
        \n
        Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
        """
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      > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
      \n
      aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
      \n
      > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
      \n
      …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
      """
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    > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
    \n
    We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
    \n
    > the actual root of the problem\n
    \n
    The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
    \n
    When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
    \n
    Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3502
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    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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              > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
              \n
              Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
              \n
              Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
              \n
              Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
              \n
              Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
              \n
              It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
              \n
              > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
              \n
              The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
              \n
              Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
              \n
              Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
              """
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            > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
            > \n
            > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
            \n
            Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
            \n
            - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
            \n
            > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
            \n
            > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
            \n
            > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
            \n
            > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
            \n
            > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
            \n
            > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
            \n
            > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
            """
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          > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
          \n
          Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
          \n
          > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
          \n
          If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
          \n
          [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
          \n
          Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
          \n
          And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
          \n
          > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
          \n
          This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
          \n
          > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
          \n
          Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
          \n
          [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
          \n
          > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
          \n
          That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
          \n
          [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
          \n
          The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
          \n
          [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
          \n
          Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
          \n
          Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
          \n
          [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
          \n
          Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
          """
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        > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
        \n
        aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
        \n
        > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
        \n
        …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
        """
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      > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
      \n
      We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
      \n
      > the actual root of the problem\n
      \n
      The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
      \n
      When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
      \n
      Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
      """
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    > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
    \n
    i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
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              > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
              \n
              Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
              \n
              Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
              \n
              Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
              \n
              Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
              \n
              It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
              \n
              > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
              \n
              The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
              \n
              Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
              \n
              Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
              """
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            > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
            > \n
            > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
            \n
            Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
            \n
            - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
            \n
            > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
            \n
            > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
            \n
            > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
            \n
            > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
            \n
            > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
            \n
            > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
            \n
            > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
            """
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          > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
          \n
          Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
          \n
          > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
          \n
          If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
          \n
          [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
          \n
          Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
          \n
          And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
          \n
          > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
          \n
          This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
          \n
          > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
          \n
          Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
          \n
          [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
          \n
          > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
          \n
          That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
          \n
          [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
          \n
          The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
          \n
          [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
          \n
          Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
          \n
          Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
          \n
          [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
          \n
          Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
          """
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        > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
        \n
        aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
        \n
        > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
        \n
        …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
        """
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      > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
      \n
      We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
      \n
      > the actual root of the problem\n
      \n
      The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
      \n
      When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
      \n
      Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
      """
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    > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
    \n
    i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      \n
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              > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
              \n
              Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
              \n
              Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
              \n
              Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
              \n
              Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
              \n
              Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
              \n
              It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
              \n
              > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
              \n
              The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
              \n
              Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
              \n
              Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
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            > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
            > \n
            > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
            > \n
            > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
            \n
            Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
            \n
            - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
            \n
            > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
            \n
            > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
            \n
            > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
            \n
            > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
            \n
            > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
            \n
            > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
            \n
            > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
            """
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          > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
          \n
          Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
          \n
          > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
          \n
          If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
          \n
          [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
          \n
          Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
          \n
          And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
          \n
          > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
          \n
          This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
          \n
          > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
          \n
          Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
          \n
          [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
          \n
          > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
          \n
          That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
          \n
          [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
          \n
          The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
          \n
          [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
          \n
          Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
          \n
          Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
          \n
          [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
          \n
          Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
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        > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
        \n
        aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
        \n
        > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
        \n
        …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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      > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
      \n
      We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
      \n
      > the actual root of the problem\n
      \n
      The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
      \n
      When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
      \n
      Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
      """
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    > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
    \n
    i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
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      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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                > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                \n
                Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                \n
                Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                \n
                Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                \n
                Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                \n
                It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                \n
                > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                \n
                The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                \n
                Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                \n
                Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                """
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              > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
              > \n
              > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
              \n
              Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
              \n
              - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
              \n
              > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
              \n
              > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
              \n
              > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
              \n
              > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
              \n
              > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
              \n
              > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
              \n
              > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
              """
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            > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
            \n
            Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
            \n
            > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
            \n
            If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
            \n
            [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
            \n
            Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
            \n
            And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
            \n
            > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
            \n
            This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
            \n
            > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
            \n
            Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
            \n
            [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
            \n
            > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
            \n
            That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
            \n
            [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
            \n
            The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
            \n
            [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
            \n
            Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
            \n
            Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
            \n
            [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
            \n
            Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
            """
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          > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
          \n
          aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
          \n
          > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
          \n
          …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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        > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
        \n
        We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
        \n
        > the actual root of the problem\n
        \n
        The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
        \n
        When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
        \n
        Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
        """
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      > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
      \n
      i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
      """
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    > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
    \n
    I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
    \n
    > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
    \n
    If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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                > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                \n
                Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                \n
                Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                \n
                Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                \n
                Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                \n
                It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                \n
                > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                \n
                The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                \n
                Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                \n
                Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                """
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              > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
              > \n
              > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
              \n
              Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
              \n
              - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
              \n
              > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
              \n
              > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
              \n
              > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
              \n
              > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
              \n
              > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
              \n
              > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
              \n
              > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
              """
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            > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
            \n
            Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
            \n
            > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
            \n
            If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
            \n
            [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
            \n
            Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
            \n
            And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
            \n
            > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
            \n
            This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
            \n
            > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
            \n
            Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
            \n
            [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
            \n
            > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
            \n
            That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
            \n
            [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
            \n
            The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
            \n
            [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
            \n
            Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
            \n
            Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
            \n
            [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
            \n
            Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
            """
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          > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
          \n
          aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
          \n
          > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
          \n
          …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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        > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
        \n
        We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
        \n
        > the actual root of the problem\n
        \n
        The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
        \n
        When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
        \n
        Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
        """
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      > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
      \n
      i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
      """
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    > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
    \n
    I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
    \n
    > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
    \n
    If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
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      ---\n
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                > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                \n
                Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                \n
                Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                \n
                Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                \n
                Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                \n
                Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                \n
                It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                \n
                > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                \n
                The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                \n
                Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                \n
                Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                """
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              > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
              > \n
              > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
              > \n
              > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
              \n
              Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
              \n
              - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
              \n
              > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
              \n
              > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
              \n
              > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
              \n
              > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
              \n
              > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
              \n
              > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
              \n
              > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
              """
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            > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
            \n
            Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
            \n
            > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
            \n
            If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
            \n
            [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
            \n
            Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
            \n
            And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
            \n
            > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
            \n
            This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
            \n
            > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
            \n
            Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
            \n
            [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
            \n
            > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
            \n
            That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
            \n
            [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
            \n
            The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
            \n
            [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
            \n
            Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
            \n
            Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
            \n
            [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
            \n
            Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
            """
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          > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
          \n
          aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
          \n
          > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
          \n
          …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
          """
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        > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
        \n
        We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
        \n
        > the actual root of the problem\n
        \n
        The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
        \n
        When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
        \n
        Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
        """
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      > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
      \n
      i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
      """
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    > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
    \n
    I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
    \n
    > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
    \n
    If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
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      ---\n
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                  > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                  \n
                  Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                  \n
                  Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                  \n
                  Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                  \n
                  Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                  \n
                  It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                  \n
                  > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                  \n
                  The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                  \n
                  Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                  \n
                  Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                  """
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                > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                > \n
                > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                \n
                Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                \n
                - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                \n
                > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                \n
                > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                \n
                > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                \n
                > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                \n
                > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                \n
                > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                \n
                > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                """
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              > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
              \n
              Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
              \n
              > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
              \n
              If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
              \n
              [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
              \n
              Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
              \n
              And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
              \n
              > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
              \n
              This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
              \n
              > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
              \n
              Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
              \n
              [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
              \n
              > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
              \n
              That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
              \n
              [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
              \n
              The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
              \n
              [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
              \n
              Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
              \n
              Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
              \n
              [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
              \n
              Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
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            > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
            \n
            aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
            \n
            > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
            \n
            …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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          > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
          \n
          We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
          \n
          > the actual root of the problem\n
          \n
          The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
          \n
          When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
          \n
          Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
          """
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        > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
        \n
        i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
        """
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      > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
      \n
      I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
      \n
      > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
      \n
      If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
      """
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    > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
    \n
    i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
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                  > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                  \n
                  Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                  \n
                  Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                  \n
                  Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                  \n
                  Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                  \n
                  It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                  \n
                  > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                  \n
                  The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                  \n
                  Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                  \n
                  Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                  """
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                > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                > \n
                > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                \n
                Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                \n
                - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                \n
                > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                \n
                > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                \n
                > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                \n
                > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                \n
                > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                \n
                > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                \n
                > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                """
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              > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
              \n
              Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
              \n
              > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
              \n
              If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
              \n
              [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
              \n
              Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
              \n
              And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
              \n
              > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
              \n
              This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
              \n
              > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
              \n
              Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
              \n
              [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
              \n
              > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
              \n
              That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
              \n
              [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
              \n
              The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
              \n
              [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
              \n
              Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
              \n
              Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
              \n
              [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
              \n
              Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
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            > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
            \n
            aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
            \n
            > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
            \n
            …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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          > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
          \n
          We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
          \n
          > the actual root of the problem\n
          \n
          The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
          \n
          When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
          \n
          Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
          """
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        > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
        \n
        i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
        """
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      > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
      \n
      I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
      \n
      > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
      \n
      If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
      """
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    > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
    \n
    i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
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                  > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                  \n
                  Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                  \n
                  Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                  \n
                  Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                  \n
                  Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                  \n
                  Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                  \n
                  It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                  \n
                  > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                  \n
                  The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                  \n
                  Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                  \n
                  Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                  """
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                > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                > \n
                > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                > \n
                > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                \n
                Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                \n
                - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                \n
                > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                \n
                > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                \n
                > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                \n
                > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                \n
                > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                \n
                > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                \n
                > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                """
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              > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
              \n
              Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
              \n
              > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
              \n
              If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
              \n
              [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
              \n
              Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
              \n
              And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
              \n
              > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
              \n
              This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
              \n
              > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
              \n
              Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
              \n
              [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
              \n
              > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
              \n
              That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
              \n
              [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
              \n
              The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
              \n
              [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
              \n
              Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
              \n
              Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
              \n
              [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
              \n
              Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
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            > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
            \n
            aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
            \n
            > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
            \n
            …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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          > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
          \n
          We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
          \n
          > the actual root of the problem\n
          \n
          The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
          \n
          When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
          \n
          Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
          """
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        > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
        \n
        i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
        """
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      > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
      \n
      I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
      \n
      > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
      \n
      If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
      """
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    > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
    \n
    i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
    """
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      ---\n
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      \n
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                    > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                    \n
                    Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                    \n
                    Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                    \n
                    Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                    \n
                    Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                    \n
                    It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                    \n
                    > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                    \n
                    The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                    \n
                    Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                    \n
                    Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                    """
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                  > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                  > \n
                  > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                  \n
                  Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                  \n
                  - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                  \n
                  > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                  \n
                  > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                  \n
                  > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                  \n
                  > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                  \n
                  > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                  \n
                  > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                  \n
                  > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                  """
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                > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                \n
                Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                \n
                > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                \n
                If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                \n
                [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                \n
                Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                \n
                And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                \n
                > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                \n
                This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                \n
                > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                \n
                Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                \n
                [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                \n
                > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                \n
                That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                \n
                [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                \n
                The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                \n
                [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                \n
                Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                \n
                Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                \n
                [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                \n
                Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
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              > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
              \n
              aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
              \n
              > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
              \n
              …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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            > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
            \n
            We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
            \n
            > the actual root of the problem\n
            \n
            The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
            \n
            When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
            \n
            Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
            """
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          > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
          \n
          i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
          """
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        > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
        \n
        I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
        \n
        > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
        \n
        If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
        """
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      > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
      \n
      i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
      """
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    So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
    \n
    Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
    \n
    [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
    \n
    How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
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                    > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                    \n
                    Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                    \n
                    Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                    \n
                    Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                    \n
                    Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                    \n
                    It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                    \n
                    > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                    \n
                    The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                    \n
                    Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                    \n
                    Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                    """
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                  > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                  > \n
                  > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                  \n
                  Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                  \n
                  - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                  \n
                  > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                  \n
                  > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                  \n
                  > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                  \n
                  > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                  \n
                  > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                  \n
                  > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                  \n
                  > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                  """
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                > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                \n
                Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                \n
                > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                \n
                If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                \n
                [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                \n
                Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                \n
                And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                \n
                > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                \n
                This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                \n
                > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                \n
                Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                \n
                [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                \n
                > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                \n
                That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                \n
                [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                \n
                The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                \n
                [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                \n
                Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                \n
                Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                \n
                [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                \n
                Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
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              > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
              \n
              aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
              \n
              > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
              \n
              …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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            > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
            \n
            We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
            \n
            > the actual root of the problem\n
            \n
            The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
            \n
            When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
            \n
            Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
            """
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          > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
          \n
          i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
          """
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        > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
        \n
        I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
        \n
        > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
        \n
        If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
        """
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      > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
      \n
      i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
      """
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    So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
    \n
    Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
    \n
    [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
    \n
    How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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                    > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                    \n
                    Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                    \n
                    Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                    \n
                    Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                    \n
                    Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                    \n
                    Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                    \n
                    It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                    \n
                    > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                    \n
                    The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                    \n
                    Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                    \n
                    Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                    """
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                  > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                  > \n
                  > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                  > \n
                  > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                  \n
                  Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                  \n
                  - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                  \n
                  > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                  \n
                  > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                  \n
                  > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                  \n
                  > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                  \n
                  > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                  \n
                  > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                  \n
                  > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                  """
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                > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                \n
                Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                \n
                > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                \n
                If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                \n
                [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                \n
                Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                \n
                And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                \n
                > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                \n
                This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                \n
                > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                \n
                Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                \n
                [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                \n
                > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                \n
                That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                \n
                [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                \n
                The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                \n
                [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                \n
                Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                \n
                Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                \n
                [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                \n
                Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                """
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              > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
              \n
              aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
              \n
              > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
              \n
              …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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            > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
            \n
            We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
            \n
            > the actual root of the problem\n
            \n
            The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
            \n
            When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
            \n
            Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
            """
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          > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
          \n
          i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
          """
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        > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
        \n
        I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
        \n
        > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
        \n
        If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
        """
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      > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
      \n
      i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
      """
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    So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
    \n
    Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
    \n
    [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
    \n
    How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      ---\n
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      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
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      ---\n
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      ---\n
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                      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                      \n
                      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                      \n
                      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                      \n
                      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                      \n
                      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                      \n
                      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                      \n
                      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                      \n
                      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                      \n
                      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                      \n
                      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                      """
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                    > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                    > \n
                    > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                    \n
                    Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                    \n
                    - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                    \n
                    > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                    \n
                    > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                    \n
                    > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                    \n
                    > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                    \n
                    > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                    \n
                    > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                    \n
                    > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                    """
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                  > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                  \n
                  Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                  \n
                  > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                  \n
                  If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                  \n
                  [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                  \n
                  Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                  \n
                  And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                  \n
                  > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                  \n
                  This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                  \n
                  > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                  \n
                  Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                  \n
                  [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                  \n
                  > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                  \n
                  That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                  \n
                  [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                  \n
                  The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                  \n
                  [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                  \n
                  Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                  \n
                  Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                  \n
                  [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                  \n
                  Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                  """
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                > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                \n
                aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                \n
                > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                \n
                …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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              > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
              \n
              We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
              \n
              > the actual root of the problem\n
              \n
              The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
              \n
              When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
              \n
              Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
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            > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
            \n
            i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
            """
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          > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
          \n
          I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
          \n
          > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
          \n
          If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
          """
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        > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
        \n
        i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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      So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
      \n
      Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
      \n
      How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
      """
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    > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
    \n
    well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
    \n
    but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
    \n
    and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
    """
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                      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                      \n
                      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                      \n
                      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                      \n
                      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                      \n
                      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                      \n
                      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                      \n
                      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                      \n
                      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                      \n
                      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                      \n
                      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                      """
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                    > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                    > \n
                    > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                    \n
                    Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                    \n
                    - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                    \n
                    > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                    \n
                    > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                    \n
                    > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                    \n
                    > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                    \n
                    > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                    \n
                    > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                    \n
                    > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                    """
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                  > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                  \n
                  Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                  \n
                  > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                  \n
                  If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                  \n
                  [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                  \n
                  Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                  \n
                  And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                  \n
                  > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                  \n
                  This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                  \n
                  > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                  \n
                  Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                  \n
                  [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                  \n
                  > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                  \n
                  That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                  \n
                  [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                  \n
                  The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                  \n
                  [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                  \n
                  Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                  \n
                  Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                  \n
                  [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                  \n
                  Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                  """
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                > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                \n
                aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                \n
                > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                \n
                …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
                """
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              > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
              \n
              We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
              \n
              > the actual root of the problem\n
              \n
              The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
              \n
              When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
              \n
              Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
              """
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            > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
            \n
            i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
            """
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          > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
          \n
          I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
          \n
          > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
          \n
          If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
          """
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        > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
        \n
        i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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      So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
      \n
      Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
      \n
      How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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    > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
    \n
    well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
    \n
    but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
    \n
    and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
    """
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                      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                      \n
                      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                      \n
                      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                      \n
                      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                      \n
                      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                      \n
                      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                      \n
                      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                      \n
                      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                      \n
                      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                      \n
                      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                      \n
                      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                      """
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                    > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                    > \n
                    > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                    > \n
                    > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                    \n
                    Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                    \n
                    - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                    \n
                    > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                    \n
                    > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                    \n
                    > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                    \n
                    > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                    \n
                    > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                    \n
                    > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                    \n
                    > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                    """
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                  > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                  \n
                  Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                  \n
                  > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                  \n
                  If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                  \n
                  [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                  \n
                  Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                  \n
                  And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                  \n
                  > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                  \n
                  This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                  \n
                  > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                  \n
                  Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                  \n
                  [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                  \n
                  > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                  \n
                  That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                  \n
                  [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                  \n
                  The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                  \n
                  [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                  \n
                  Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                  \n
                  Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                  \n
                  [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                  \n
                  Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                  """
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                > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                \n
                aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                \n
                > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                \n
                …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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              > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
              \n
              We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
              \n
              > the actual root of the problem\n
              \n
              The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
              \n
              When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
              \n
              Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
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            > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
            \n
            i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
            """
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          > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
          \n
          I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
          \n
          > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
          \n
          If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
          """
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        > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
        \n
        i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
        """
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      So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
      \n
      Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
      \n
      [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
      \n
      How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
      """
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    > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
    \n
    well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
    \n
    but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
    \n
    and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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                        > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                        \n
                        Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                        \n
                        Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                        \n
                        Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                        \n
                        Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                        \n
                        It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                        \n
                        > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                        \n
                        The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                        \n
                        Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                        \n
                        Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                        """
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                      > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                      > \n
                      > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                      \n
                      Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                      \n
                      - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                      \n
                      > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                      \n
                      > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                      \n
                      > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                      \n
                      > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                      \n
                      > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                      \n
                      > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                      \n
                      > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                      """
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                    > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                    \n
                    Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                    \n
                    > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                    \n
                    If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                    \n
                    [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                    \n
                    Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                    \n
                    And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                    \n
                    > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                    \n
                    This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                    \n
                    > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                    \n
                    Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                    \n
                    [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                    \n
                    > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                    \n
                    That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                    \n
                    [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                    \n
                    The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                    \n
                    [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                    \n
                    Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                    \n
                    Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                    \n
                    [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                    \n
                    Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                    """
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                  > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                  \n
                  aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                  \n
                  > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                  \n
                  …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
                  """
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                > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                \n
                We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                \n
                > the actual root of the problem\n
                \n
                The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                \n
                When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                \n
                Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                """
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              > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
              \n
              i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
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            > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
            \n
            I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
            \n
            > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
            \n
            If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
            """
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          > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
          \n
          i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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        So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
        \n
        Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
        \n
        [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
        \n
        How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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      > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
      \n
      well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
      \n
      but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
      \n
      and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
      """
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    > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
    \n
    I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
    \n
    > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
    \n
    Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
    \n
    [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
    \n
    Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
    \n
    > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
    \n
    They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
    \n
    Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
    """
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                        > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                        \n
                        Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                        \n
                        Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                        \n
                        Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                        \n
                        Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                        \n
                        It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                        \n
                        > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                        \n
                        The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                        \n
                        Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                        \n
                        Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                        """
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                      > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                      > \n
                      > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                      \n
                      Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                      \n
                      - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                      \n
                      > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                      \n
                      > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                      \n
                      > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                      \n
                      > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                      \n
                      > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                      \n
                      > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                      \n
                      > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                      """
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                    > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                    \n
                    Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                    \n
                    > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                    \n
                    If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                    \n
                    [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                    \n
                    Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                    \n
                    And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                    \n
                    > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                    \n
                    This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                    \n
                    > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                    \n
                    Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                    \n
                    [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                    \n
                    > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                    \n
                    That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                    \n
                    [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                    \n
                    The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                    \n
                    [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                    \n
                    Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                    \n
                    Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                    \n
                    [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                    \n
                    Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                    """
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                  > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                  \n
                  aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                  \n
                  > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                  \n
                  …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                \n
                We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                \n
                > the actual root of the problem\n
                \n
                The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                \n
                When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                \n
                Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                """
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              > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
              \n
              i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
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            > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
            \n
            I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
            \n
            > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
            \n
            If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
            """
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          > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
          \n
          i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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        So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
        \n
        Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
        \n
        [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
        \n
        How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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      > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
      \n
      well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
      \n
      but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
      \n
      and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
      """
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    > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
    \n
    I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
    \n
    > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
    \n
    Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
    \n
    [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
    \n
    Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
    \n
    > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
    \n
    They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
    \n
    Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
    """
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                        > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                        \n
                        Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                        \n
                        Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                        \n
                        Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                        \n
                        Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                        \n
                        Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                        \n
                        It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                        \n
                        > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                        \n
                        The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                        \n
                        Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                        \n
                        Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                        """
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                      > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                      > \n
                      > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                      > \n
                      > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                      \n
                      Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                      \n
                      - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                      \n
                      > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                      \n
                      > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                      \n
                      > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                      \n
                      > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                      \n
                      > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                      \n
                      > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                      \n
                      > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                      """
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                    > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                    \n
                    Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                    \n
                    > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                    \n
                    If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                    \n
                    [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                    \n
                    Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                    \n
                    And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                    \n
                    > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                    \n
                    This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                    \n
                    > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                    \n
                    Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                    \n
                    [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                    \n
                    > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                    \n
                    That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                    \n
                    [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                    \n
                    The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                    \n
                    [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                    \n
                    Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                    \n
                    Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                    \n
                    [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                    \n
                    Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                    """
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                  > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                  \n
                  aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                  \n
                  > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                  \n
                  …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                \n
                We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                \n
                > the actual root of the problem\n
                \n
                The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                \n
                When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                \n
                Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                """
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              > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
              \n
              i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
              """
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            > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
            \n
            I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
            \n
            > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
            \n
            If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
            """
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          > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
          \n
          i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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        So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
        \n
        Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
        \n
        [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
        \n
        How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
        """
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      > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
      \n
      well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
      \n
      but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
      \n
      and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
      """
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    > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
    \n
    I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
    \n
    > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
    \n
    Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
    \n
    [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
    \n
    Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
    \n
    > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
    \n
    They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
    \n
    Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
    """
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                          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                          \n
                          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                          \n
                          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                          \n
                          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                          \n
                          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                          \n
                          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                          \n
                          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                          \n
                          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                          \n
                          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                          \n
                          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                          """
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                        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                        > \n
                        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                        \n
                        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                        \n
                        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                        \n
                        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                        \n
                        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                        \n
                        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                        \n
                        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                        \n
                        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                        \n
                        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                        \n
                        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                        """
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                      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                      \n
                      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                      \n
                      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                      \n
                      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                      \n
                      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                      \n
                      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                      \n
                      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                      \n
                      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                      \n
                      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                      \n
                      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                      \n
                      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                      \n
                      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                      \n
                      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                      \n
                      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                      \n
                      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                      \n
                      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                      \n
                      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                      \n
                      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                      \n
                      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                      \n
                      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                      \n
                      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                      """
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                    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                    \n
                    aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                    \n
                    > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                    \n
                    …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                  > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                  \n
                  We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                  \n
                  > the actual root of the problem\n
                  \n
                  The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                  \n
                  When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                  \n
                  Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                  """
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                > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                \n
                i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
                """
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              > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
              \n
              I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
              \n
              > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
              \n
              If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
              """
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            > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
            \n
            i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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          So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
          \n
          Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
          \n
          [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
          \n
          How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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        > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
        \n
        well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
        \n
        but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
        \n
        and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
        """
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      > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
      \n
      I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
      \n
      > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
      \n
      Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
      \n
      Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
      \n
      > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
      \n
      They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
      \n
      Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
      """
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    > I honestly don’t know,\n
    \n
    respectfully: if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,” and then go on to talk about how Israel might be prioritizing its own soldiers over civilian life because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,” perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians and consider them both acceptable collateral damage or actual military targets based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      ---\n
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                          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                          \n
                          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                          \n
                          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                          \n
                          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                          \n
                          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                          \n
                          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                          \n
                          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                          \n
                          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                          \n
                          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                          \n
                          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                          """
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                        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                        > \n
                        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                        \n
                        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                        \n
                        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                        \n
                        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                        \n
                        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                        \n
                        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                        \n
                        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                        \n
                        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                        \n
                        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                        \n
                        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                        """
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                      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                      \n
                      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                      \n
                      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                      \n
                      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                      \n
                      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                      \n
                      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                      \n
                      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                      \n
                      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                      \n
                      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                      \n
                      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                      \n
                      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                      \n
                      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                      \n
                      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                      \n
                      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                      \n
                      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                      \n
                      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                      \n
                      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                      \n
                      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                      \n
                      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                      \n
                      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                      \n
                      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                      """
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                    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                    \n
                    aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                    \n
                    > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                    \n
                    …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                  > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                  \n
                  We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                  \n
                  > the actual root of the problem\n
                  \n
                  The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                  \n
                  When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                  \n
                  Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                  """
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                > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                \n
                i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
                """
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              > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
              \n
              I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
              \n
              > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
              \n
              If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
              """
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            > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
            \n
            i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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          So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
          \n
          Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
          \n
          [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
          \n
          How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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        > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
        \n
        well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
        \n
        but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
        \n
        and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
        """
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      > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
      \n
      I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
      \n
      > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
      \n
      Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
      \n
      Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
      \n
      > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
      \n
      They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
      \n
      Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
      """
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    > I honestly don’t know,\n
    \n
    respectfully: if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,” and then go on to talk about how Israel might be prioritizing its own soldiers over civilian life because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,” perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians and consider them both acceptable collateral damage or actual military targets based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      ---\n
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                          > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                          \n
                          Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                          \n
                          Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                          \n
                          Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                          \n
                          Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                          \n
                          Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                          \n
                          It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                          \n
                          > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                          \n
                          The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                          \n
                          Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                          \n
                          Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                          """
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                        > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                        > \n
                        > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                        > \n
                        > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                        \n
                        Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                        \n
                        - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                        \n
                        > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                        \n
                        > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                        \n
                        > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                        \n
                        > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                        \n
                        > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                        \n
                        > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                        \n
                        > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                        """
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                      > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                      \n
                      Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                      \n
                      > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                      \n
                      If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                      \n
                      [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                      \n
                      Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                      \n
                      And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                      \n
                      > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                      \n
                      This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                      \n
                      > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                      \n
                      Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                      \n
                      [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                      \n
                      > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                      \n
                      That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                      \n
                      [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                      \n
                      The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                      \n
                      [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                      \n
                      Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                      \n
                      Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                      \n
                      [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                      \n
                      Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                      """
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                    > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                    \n
                    aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                    \n
                    > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                    \n
                    …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                  > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                  \n
                  We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                  \n
                  > the actual root of the problem\n
                  \n
                  The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                  \n
                  When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                  \n
                  Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                  """
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                > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                \n
                i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
                """
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              > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
              \n
              I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
              \n
              > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
              \n
              If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
              """
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            > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
            \n
            i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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          So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
          \n
          Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
          \n
          [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
          \n
          How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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        > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
        \n
        well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
        \n
        but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
        \n
        and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
        """
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      > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
      \n
      I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
      \n
      > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
      \n
      Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
      \n
      [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
      \n
      Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
      \n
      > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
      \n
      They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
      \n
      Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
      """
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    > I honestly don’t know,\n
    \n
    respectfully: if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,” and then go on to talk about how Israel might be prioritizing its own soldiers over civilian life because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,” perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians and consider them both acceptable collateral damage or actual military targets based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point
    """
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      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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                            > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                            \n
                            Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                            \n
                            Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                            \n
                            Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                            \n
                            Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                            \n
                            It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                            \n
                            > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                            \n
                            The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                            \n
                            Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                            \n
                            Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                            """
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                          > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                          > \n
                          > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                          \n
                          Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                          \n
                          - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                          \n
                          > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                          \n
                          > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                          \n
                          > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                          \n
                          > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                          \n
                          > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                          \n
                          > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                          \n
                          > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                          """
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                        > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                        \n
                        Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                        \n
                        > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                        \n
                        If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                        \n
                        [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                        \n
                        Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                        \n
                        And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                        \n
                        > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                        \n
                        This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                        \n
                        > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                        \n
                        Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                        \n
                        [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                        \n
                        > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                        \n
                        That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                        \n
                        [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                        \n
                        The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                        \n
                        [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                        \n
                        Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                        \n
                        Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                        \n
                        [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                        \n
                        Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                        """
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                      > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                      \n
                      aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                      \n
                      > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                      \n
                      …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                    > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                    \n
                    We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                    \n
                    > the actual root of the problem\n
                    \n
                    The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                    \n
                    When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                    \n
                    Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                    """
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                  > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                  \n
                  i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
                  """
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                > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
                \n
                I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
                \n
                > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
                \n
                If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
                """
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              > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
              \n
              i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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            So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
            \n
            Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
            \n
            [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
            \n
            How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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          > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
          \n
          well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
          \n
          but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
          \n
          and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
          """
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        > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
        \n
        I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
        \n
        > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
        \n
        Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
        \n
        Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
        \n
        > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
        \n
        They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
        \n
        Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
        """
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      > I honestly don’t know,\n
      \n
      respectfully: if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,” and then go on to talk about how Israel might be prioritizing its own soldiers over civilian life because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,” perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians and consider them both acceptable collateral damage or actual military targets based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point
      """
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    > if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,”\n
    \n
    I think we should all do that, including you.\n
    \n
    > because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,”\n
    \n
    I didn’t make that part up:\n
    \n
    [unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-revea…](https://unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-reveals-new-report/)\n
    \n
    Seriously read this, including the full report. It explains so much about this conflict.\n
    \n
    > perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians\n
    \n
    They care less about Palestinian civilians than they do about their own soldiers, but they care enough about them to invest massive amounts of resources into warning them, into getting aid to them and into getting them out of the parts of the strip that are most dangerous to them. That’s more than can be said about anyone else in this conflict. Is it perfect? Hell no, but nothing in this world is and nobody in their right mind would expect them to be perfect.\n
    \n
    > based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point\n
    \n
    We don’t even know how many have died. Seriously, we have zero clue, only made-up numbers from Hamas - who also don’t differentiate between civilian and military deaths, by the way - and rough estimates from everyone else. All we know for certain is that thousands have died. That’s it. It took Israel weeks to come up with the total death toll on their side after the October 7 massacres and that’s in a much more controlled environment, yet everyone immediately accepts whatever the “Gaza Health Ministry” under full Hamas control pumps out. I’ve lost count of how many have sent me articles from BBC, Reuters, NYT and whoever saying that they reported on the numbers and I should take them seriously and yet every single time, these articles cite the same Hamas organization or someone who cites them.\n
    \n
    Again, this is a terrible war and thousands have dying in it, but it’s not just a war of bullets and bombs, but also one of information being used a weapon, including misinformation, like completely nonsensical comparisons that I debunked earlier. So many educated, well-meaning people appear to lose all sight of reason, anything resembling critical thinking skills in this and for what? Do any of these people really think that it actually helps Palestinians?
    """
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      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
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                            > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                            \n
                            Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                            \n
                            Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                            \n
                            Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                            \n
                            Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                            \n
                            It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                            \n
                            > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                            \n
                            The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                            \n
                            Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                            \n
                            Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                            """
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                          > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                          > \n
                          > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                          \n
                          Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                          \n
                          - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                          \n
                          > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                          \n
                          > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                          \n
                          > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                          \n
                          > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                          \n
                          > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                          \n
                          > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                          \n
                          > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                          """
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                        > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                        \n
                        Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                        \n
                        > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                        \n
                        If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                        \n
                        [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                        \n
                        Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                        \n
                        And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                        \n
                        > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                        \n
                        This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                        \n
                        > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                        \n
                        Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                        \n
                        [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                        \n
                        > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                        \n
                        That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                        \n
                        [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                        \n
                        The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                        \n
                        [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                        \n
                        Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                        \n
                        Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                        \n
                        [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                        \n
                        Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
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                      > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                      \n
                      aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                      \n
                      > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                      \n
                      …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                    > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                    \n
                    We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                    \n
                    > the actual root of the problem\n
                    \n
                    The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                    \n
                    When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                    \n
                    Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
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                  > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                  \n
                  i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
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                > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
                \n
                I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
                \n
                > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
                \n
                If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
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              > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
              \n
              i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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            So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
            \n
            Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
            \n
            [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
            \n
            How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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          > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
          \n
          well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
          \n
          but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
          \n
          and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
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        > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
        \n
        I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
        \n
        > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
        \n
        Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
        \n
        Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
        \n
        > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
        \n
        They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
        \n
        Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
        """
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      > I honestly don’t know,\n
      \n
      respectfully: if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,” and then go on to talk about how Israel might be prioritizing its own soldiers over civilian life because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,” perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians and consider them both acceptable collateral damage or actual military targets based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point
      """
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    > if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,”\n
    \n
    I think we should all do that, including you.\n
    \n
    > because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,”\n
    \n
    I didn’t make that part up:\n
    \n
    [unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-revea…](https://unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-reveals-new-report/)\n
    \n
    Seriously read this, including the full report. It explains so much about this conflict.\n
    \n
    > perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians\n
    \n
    They care less about Palestinian civilians than they do about their own soldiers, but they care enough about them to invest massive amounts of resources into warning them, into getting aid to them and into getting them out of the parts of the strip that are most dangerous to them. That’s more than can be said about anyone else in this conflict. Is it perfect? Hell no, but nothing in this world is and nobody in their right mind would expect them to be perfect.\n
    \n
    > based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point\n
    \n
    We don’t even know how many have died. Seriously, we have zero clue, only made-up numbers from Hamas - who also don’t differentiate between civilian and military deaths, by the way - and rough estimates from everyone else. All we know for certain is that thousands have died. That’s it. It took Israel weeks to come up with the total death toll on their side after the October 7 massacres and that’s in a much more controlled environment, yet everyone immediately accepts whatever the “Gaza Health Ministry” under full Hamas control pumps out. I’ve lost count of how many have sent me articles from BBC, Reuters, NYT and whoever saying that they reported on the numbers and I should take them seriously and yet every single time, these articles cite the same Hamas organization or someone who cites them.\n
    \n
    Again, this is a terrible war and thousands have dying in it, but it’s not just a war of bullets and bombs, but also one of information being used a weapon, including misinformation, like completely nonsensical comparisons that I debunked earlier. So many educated, well-meaning people appear to lose all sight of reason, anything resembling critical thinking skills in this and for what? Do any of these people really think that it actually helps Palestinians?
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
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      ---\n
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      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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                            > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
                            \n
                            Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
                            \n
                            Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                            \n
                            Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                            \n
                            Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                            \n
                            Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
                            \n
                            It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
                            \n
                            > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
                            \n
                            The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
                            \n
                            Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
                            \n
                            Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
                            """
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                          > Ethiopian Civil War (ongoing): Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
                          > \n
                          > Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
                          > \n
                          > Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
                          \n
                          Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths, the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure, and the amount of bombings of a small populated area. The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars and I am assuming total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources). The War on Ukraine by Russia also has over the entire course of the conflict only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                          \n
                          - [Israel Gaza: What Gaza’s death toll says about the war - BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664)\n
                          \n
                          > On average, **nearly 300 people have been killed each day since the start of the conflict**, excluding the seven-day ceasefire, data from Gaza’s Hamas-run health ministry indicates. The World Health Organization’s regional emergency director Richard Brennan says he considers these casualty figures trustworthy.\n
                          \n
                          > The pace of killing in this war has been “exceptionally high”, says Prof Michael Spagat, who specialises in examining death tolls in conflicts around the world, such as the 2003 Iraq war, Colombia’s civil conflict, wars in the Democratic Republic of Congo as well as previous wars between Israel and Gaza. Within the series of Gaza wars stretching back to 2008, **the current one is unprecedented both for the number of people killed and for the indiscriminateness of the killing,**" he adds.\n
                          \n
                          > Each conflict is unique in the way it is fought, but the experts the BBC has spoken to agree that the rate of killing in Gaza is significantly bigger than in others fought recently. **"What we’re seeing in terms of civilian deaths has already far outpaced rates of harm from any given conflict we have documented,**" said Emily Tripp, director of Airwars, an organisation which has monitored civilian deaths in wars and conflicts since 2014.\n
                          \n
                          > The former Pentagon intelligence analyst Marc Garlasco said: “**To find a similar density of high explosives used in a small populated area, we might have to go back to the Vietnam war for a comparable example** - like the 1972 Christmas bombing, when some 20,000 tons of bombs were dropped on Hanoi during Operation Linebacker II.” An estimated 1,600 Vietnamese civilians were killed in the Christmas bombings.\n
                          \n
                          > By contrast, **US-led coalition air and artillery strikes killed fewer than 20 civilians per day, on average, during the four-month offensive to drive IS out of the Syrian city of Raqqa in 2017**, according to Amnesty International.\n
                          \n
                          > And an Associated Press investigation suggested that between 9,000 and 11,000 civilians were killed in the nine-month battle between US-backed Iraqi forces and IS for the Iraqi city of Mosul which ended in 2017. **This amounts to an estimated fewer-than-40 civilian deaths per day, on average.** Mosul had an estimated population of less than two million people when IS captured the city in 2014.\n
                          \n
                          > During the almost two years of the Ukraine war, the United Nations estimates that at least 10,000 civilians have been killed.
                          """
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                        > Those conflicts all took place over years. The Israel war on Gaza is blowing through the roof the rate of civilian deaths\n
                        \n
                        Yes, because this is a high-intensity conflict. Small area, lots of fighting and, unlike in most other conflicts, one side is doing everything to get the civilian death toll on “their side” as high as possible by hiding their military infrastructure behind civilians, stealing supplies and preventing people from leaving. Hamas didn’t even build any bomb shelters for ordinary people even though they knew Israel would answer their massacres with bombings.\n
                        \n
                        > the level of indiscriminate targeting of civilians and infrastructure\n
                        \n
                        If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                        \n
                        [www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67327079)\n
                        \n
                        Doesn’t make any sense. If they were actually out to murder civilians, they’d certainly not be doing this and they’d also not need more than one bomb to kill a single Palestinian.\n
                        \n
                        And yeah, of course infrastructure gets targeted in a war, because how else would you cripple the enemy’s ability to sustain a fight, but that’s not indiscriminate, because you can’t indiscriminately target things. Either you target things, then it’s not indiscriminate, or you are just lobbing bombs indiscriminately, but then you are not targeting things. Sorry to be all pedantic, but please at least try to use the most generic buzz words in this conflict in a reasonably logically consistent manner.\n
                        \n
                        > The conflicts you mention are largely Civil Wars\n
                        \n
                        This isn’t? If you support the whole “From the River to the Sea” nonsense, and it looks like you do, then this is one divided country in the midst of a civil war.\n
                        \n
                        > total deaths of the conflict (as you do not share any sources).\n
                        \n
                        Mostly just this list from Wikipedia:\n
                        \n
                        [en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflict…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts)\n
                        \n
                        > only had 10,000 civilian deaths according to the United Nations.\n
                        \n
                        That’s only verified deaths. There were 10,000 fresh graves discovered in Mariupol alone:\n
                        \n
                        [apnews.com/…/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-…](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9)\n
                        \n
                        The highest estimate for just that one city is 100,000 dead:\n
                        \n
                        [tsn.ua/…/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-ci…](https://tsn.ua/en/ato/how-many-civilians-died-in-mariupol-a-city-council-deputy-revealed-a-terrible-figure-2390089.html)\n
                        \n
                        Probably/hopefully too high, but the truth is that nobody knows, except that the number of verified deaths are only a small fraction of the total in Ukraine. There are so many places in Ukraine that were simply wiped out - with no warnings for civilians, nor escape routes, unlike in Gaza.\n
                        \n
                        Speaking of nobody knows, the fog of war in the Israeli-Hamas war is just as thick. The only numbers people are repeating all over, including most self-proclaimed experts and politicians, are those released by Hamas, who have every interest in the world to paint a picture as horrific as possible in order to put international pressure on Israel to end a war Hamas started so that Hamas can regroup and do the same thing all over again, as they have repeatedly announced.\n
                        \n
                        [memri.org/…/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-re…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)\n
                        \n
                        Knowingly or unknowingly, you and so many other people are carrying water for this terror organization. What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. The shorter this war is, the fewer people on both sides will suffer. For as flawed as Israel is, especially with the current government in charge, they are still the least flawed nation/group in the entire Middle East. Very low bar, I know, but that’s as good as it gets. Have you ever thought how your country, no matter where you are from, would have reacted to an event like October 7? Even some bastion of democracy and freedom like Denmark would have probably done the same if not worse as Israel in response. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep a watchful eye on this (hard not to, given the number of journalists per square meter over there) and influence Israel into fighting this war as humanely as possible, but again, let’s not get hysterical.
                        """
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                      > If they are targeting civilians, then why are they warning them?\n
                      \n
                      aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering *Israeli* civilians including a civilian they basically hunted down? the argument that Israel can’t possibly be targeting Palestinian civilians because they “warn” those civilians seems to stand clearly at odds with even the simplest things such as “how they treat their own, surrendering citizens–much less the citizens of a state they don’t want to exist”\n
                      \n
                      > What we should do is support Israel in the eradication of Hamas while also getting as much help to the civilians caught in the crossfire as possible and put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages and surrender.\n
                      \n
                      …or we could actually solve the issue here by demanding Israel stop indiscriminately murdering civilians (the actual root of the problem and a thing that even Joe Biden kind of thinks they’re doing now) in a misguided attempt to eradicate a terrorist group when the “shock and awe” strategy has never worked in contemporary warfare and has only guaranteed further resentment and conflict against the state doing the shock and awe!
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                    > aren’t we like, three days removed from the IDF killing obviously surrendering Israeli civilians\n
                    \n
                    We are a week removed from the IDF going forward and openly admitting to their soldiers having made a mistake and acting against both standard protocol and direct orders. As inexcusable as the conduct of the soldiers responsible for this is, the transparent and honest manner in which this incident was communicated to the public is exemplary. You are right that this does raise uncomfortable questions over how normal this kind of conduct of IDF soldiers is though.\n
                    \n
                    > the actual root of the problem\n
                    \n
                    The actual root of the problem is that the UN came up with a flawed two-state plan for Palestine in 1947, one that Israel agreed with and the Arab nations didn’t, prompting them to fight a war over it. Which they lost, against a tiny isolated nation under a weapons embargo that literally had to salvage tanks from scrap yards as the attacking Arabs were using the latest gear. Then they tried a few times more, losing again every time and in between, various Palestinian groups have tried again and again to do their worst. Each time, they lose, each time, Palestinians lose territory and power as Israel gets stronger with each military victory, because that’s how wars have always worked. Arab nations also occupied Palestinian territory for decades, oppressing Palestinians there worse than Israel ever did, but that tends to get glossed over these days.\n
                    \n
                    When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                    \n
                    Do you even know that Israel was working on finalizing a deal for the Palestinians to get access to gas fields on the coast of Gaza, which would have given them energy independence and a huge influx in cash? Talks were ongoing until literally the day of the terrorist attack, but now it’ll never happen.
                    """
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                  > When Israel does actually make concessions, like when they pulled all settlers out of Gaza, invited tens of thousands of Palestinians to work for several times the wages they would get in Palestinian territories, they get thanked with more violence in return, showing the Israeli public that extending the hand does nothing to calm this conflict down, so with each terrorist attack, they shift further to the right politically, electing politicians who promise strength and keeping Palestinians at bay instead of compromising. That’s how you get injustices like indefinite detention of Palestinians. Cause and effect.\n
                  \n
                  i mean this is just cringe apologia for Israel, respectfully. “benevolently” stopping your settler colonialism in one part of the Palestinian state you don’t want to exist and almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state after you do is not actual benevolence or a “concession” in any meaningful sense of the word–that should be the baseline expected of Israel. you’re also completely ignoring, in saying this, the much more impactful apartheid under which Palestinians live and the encroachment of settlers in the West Bank that Israel aids, abets, and funds, and has for decades. in pretty much any other circumstance what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a *casus belli* for war. the implication underlying everything you’re saying here is that the root of the conflict is all Palestinian, but that’s demonstrably incorrect and actively revisionist to a point where i don’t think you’d get most *Zionists* to agree to it.
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                > almost immediately transitioning into an ongoing permanent blockade of said part of that state\n
                \n
                I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
                \n
                > what Israel is doing to Palestine would be widely accepted as a casus belli for war\n
                \n
                If that’s a casus belli, then so is October 7. Now what?
                """
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              > I wonder what happened in between those two things. Have you ever looked up what the blockade was actually blocking?\n
              \n
              i think it is a moral imperative (or at least, unambiguously morally justifiable in all cases) to wage armed struggle against a country doing apartheid like Israel, so it’s basically irrelevant for my purposes that Israel’s justification for the blockade is “these people waged armed struggle against me”–the oxygen of that armed struggle as it currently exists *is* the apartheid. if anything it just demonstrates that Israel’s government so devalues Palestinian life (as is also being demonstrated by their cavalier attitude toward murdering civilians) that it’d rather continue the oppression that’s led many Palestinians to jihadism in the first place than ever reconsider whether that approach will lead to stability in the region and long-term peace
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            So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of *children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers*), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now? The mere fact that they are using children, old and handicapped people as suicide bombers, including in this current conflict, shows that if there’s one side not valuing Palestinian life at all, it’s Palestinian leadership.\n
            \n
            Oh, and it’s also statements like these:\n
            \n
            [memri.org/…/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-b…](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-we-need-blood-women-children-and-elderly-gaza-%E2%80%93-so-it-awakens)\n
            \n
            How on Earth do you deal with this kind of political leadership? It’s not just Hamas, that’s how all sorts of groups and Palestinian governments have fought for many decades. How do you achieve “long-term piece” in this kind of situation? Like I said, any kind of concession gets answered with violence and any past peace deal, including the last one that would have resulted in 95% of the West Bank in Palestinian hands, gets rejected by one side and one side only. The current settler problem wouldn’t even exist had Arafat not walked away from the Camp David summit after saying no to every proposal. He lived out his days as a billionaire though, so I guess we know why he did it. I guess he feared for this power and wealth, just like Hamas’ leadership with their billions. Gotta keep that conflict going so that aid comes in that they can then steal from the people right out in the open while delusional idealists - no offense - meander on about high-level concepts like apartheid and oppression, blind to the actual reality.
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          > So unguided rockets vaguely aimed at cities, suicide bombers (including the use of children and mentally impaired people as suicide bombers), random stabbings, random shootings are “armed struggle” now?\n
          \n
          well yes, definitionally, that’s how armed struggle is manifesting in Palestine currently. there’s nothing you or i can do about that.\n
          \n
          but that’s a little besides the point, which is that i think you at most *selectively* take issue with morally depraved military actions. almost everything you’re charging Hamas with has an established and equally immoral analogue in Israel’s strategy toward Palestine to this point. it’s conspicuous to me, for example, that you do not seem to comparably weigh Israel damaging or destroying 70% of Gaza City with Hamas’s unguided rocket attacks–especially given that both have led to large numbers of civilian deaths? like, do you think that 70% of Gaza City harbored Hamas militants, or, alternatively that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire? that seems like the only way for this to not boil down to vibes of who’s “good” and “bad”\n
          \n
          and mind you, i have no issue with saying that Hamas is a depraved terrorist group who should never be in power and that it’s very, *very* bad for the region that they are now the primary credible opposition to Israel in Palestine. if i had my way, they would be unilaterally eradicated in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution. but i don’t have a magic wand, and Hamas does not exist in a vacuum. the Israeli state is directly complicit in making them that primary credible opposition, both through its military strategy *and* through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group. even Israeli outlets [admit to](https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082) [this sort of arrangement](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) under Netanyahu.
          """
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        > that it was militarily necessary to do that sort of damage even though it was inevitable large numbers of civilians would be caught in the crossfire?\n
        \n
        I honestly don’t know, but I can guess why they are doing it that way. I read one report that in one suburb of Gaza City, almost half of all buildings were rigged with explosives by Hamas. In another place, there were traps using speakers that played children’s cries, in yet another location, Hamas used an old man as a suicide bomber. How do you fight in such an environment? Israel is choosing a cautious approach using air power and tanks, which limits the risk to their own soldiers - and successfully so, given the low death toll on their side we’ve seen. I totally get that they are prioritizing that over protecting civilians that have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews. Should they instead choose a riskier approach that might endanger their own people? I think every nation would prioritize their soldiers over civilians from the opposing side. It’s still awful, there’s no way around it, but seriously, what choice do they have? It’s just terrible options and those in charge in Israel have to pick the least terrible one.\n
        \n
        > in favor of Fatah who at least seem willing to work toward a peaceful resolution\n
        \n
        Fatah has a “martyr’s fund” worth hundreds of millions that they use to pay out to the families of those who die in the fight against Israel, including members of Hamas. They paid millions to the families of terrorists who died during the October 7 attack.\n
        \n
        [en.wikipedia.org/…/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_…](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund)\n
        \n
        Abbas literally has a PhD in Holocaust denial. Fatah are really no good options either and on top of that, they have zero credibility among Palestinians due to how ineffective and corrupt their government is.\n
        \n
        > and through selectively looking the other way when money and weapons are funneled through back-channels to the group\n
        \n
        They also did it, because they thought they could pacify the group, make them interested in governing and enriching themselves instead of waging war. It seemed to have worked for a long time, as evidenced by billions siphoned off into in off-shore accounts, but hindsight is 20/20. The thing is though, there was significant international pressure against Israel to allow these funds into Gaza, including from foreign governments and humanitarian groups, many of which are now using the fact that the Israeli government permitted the transfer of these funds against it or are even frequently distorting it into “Israel funded Hamas” or “Israel created Hamas”.\n
        \n
        Like I said, there are only terrible options. This seemed like the least terrible one at the time and since there are no magic wands, there are rarely ideal solutions.
        """
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      > I honestly don’t know,\n
      \n
      respectfully: if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,” and then go on to talk about how Israel might be prioritizing its own soldiers over civilian life because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,” perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians and consider them both acceptable collateral damage or actual military targets based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point
      """
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    > if you yourself have to begin an answer to these questions with “I honestly don’t know,”\n
    \n
    I think we should all do that, including you.\n
    \n
    > because even the civilians “have been taught from the crib to kill all Jews,”\n
    \n
    I didn’t make that part up:\n
    \n
    [unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-revea…](https://unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-reveals-new-report/)\n
    \n
    Seriously read this, including the full report. It explains so much about this conflict.\n
    \n
    > perhaps you can understand how some of us would conclude that Israel might not care very much about Palestinian civilians\n
    \n
    They care less about Palestinian civilians than they do about their own soldiers, but they care enough about them to invest massive amounts of resources into warning them, into getting aid to them and into getting them out of the parts of the strip that are most dangerous to them. That’s more than can be said about anyone else in this conflict. Is it perfect? Hell no, but nothing in this world is and nobody in their right mind would expect them to be perfect.\n
    \n
    > based on the sheer number of them they’ve killed to this point\n
    \n
    We don’t even know how many have died. Seriously, we have zero clue, only made-up numbers from Hamas - who also don’t differentiate between civilian and military deaths, by the way - and rough estimates from everyone else. All we know for certain is that thousands have died. That’s it. It took Israel weeks to come up with the total death toll on their side after the October 7 massacres and that’s in a much more controlled environment, yet everyone immediately accepts whatever the “Gaza Health Ministry” under full Hamas control pumps out. I’ve lost count of how many have sent me articles from BBC, Reuters, NYT and whoever saying that they reported on the numbers and I should take them seriously and yet every single time, these articles cite the same Hamas organization or someone who cites them.\n
    \n
    Again, this is a terrible war and thousands have dying in it, but it’s not just a war of bullets and bombs, but also one of information being used a weapon, including misinformation, like completely nonsensical comparisons that I debunked earlier. So many educated, well-meaning people appear to lose all sight of reason, anything resembling critical thinking skills in this and for what? Do any of these people really think that it actually helps Palestinians?
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3015
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
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      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
      \n
      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
      \n
      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      \n
      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
      \n
      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
      \n
      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
      \n
      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
      \n
      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
      \n
      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
      """
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    > You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
    \n
    Again, you have no sources heres so nit sure where you are getting your figures from.\n
    \n
    When someone is starving, you realize the literal definition is that they are DYING FROM HUNGER. This is not hyperbole.\n
    \n
    Speaking of dying from hunger, the [UN Secretary General](https://twitter.com/antonioguterres/status/1738575438136680790?t=sQzlzKqjBH3cdVJXlxW1Pg&s=19) just stated that “Four out of five of the hungriest people anywhere in the world are in Gaza.”\n
    \n
    > This latest food security analysis for Gaza, which includes data from the World Food Programme (WFP), other UN agencies and non-governmental organizations, confirmed that the entire population of Gaza – roughly 2.2 million people – are in crisis or worse levels of acute food insecurity. The IPC report further highlighted that 26 percent of Gazans (576,600 people) have exhausted their food supplies and coping capacities and face catastrophic hunger (IPC Phase 5) and starvation.\n
    \n
    [wfp.org/…/gaza-grapples-catastrophic-hunger-new-r…](https://www.wfp.org/news/gaza-grapples-catastrophic-hunger-new-report-predicts-famine-if-conflict-continues)
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
      \n
      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
      \n
      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      \n
      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
      \n
      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
      \n
      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
      \n
      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
      \n
      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
      \n
      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
      """
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    > You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
    \n
    Again, you have no sources heres so nit sure where you are getting your figures from.\n
    \n
    When someone is starving, you realize the literal definition is that they are DYING FROM HUNGER. This is not hyperbole.\n
    \n
    Speaking of dying from hunger, the [UN Secretary General](https://twitter.com/antonioguterres/status/1738575438136680790?t=sQzlzKqjBH3cdVJXlxW1Pg&s=19) just stated that “Four out of five of the hungriest people anywhere in the world are in Gaza.”\n
    \n
    > This latest food security analysis for Gaza, which includes data from the World Food Programme (WFP), other UN agencies and non-governmental organizations, confirmed that the entire population of Gaza – roughly 2.2 million people – are in crisis or worse levels of acute food insecurity. The IPC report further highlighted that 26 percent of Gazans (576,600 people) have exhausted their food supplies and coping capacities and face catastrophic hunger (IPC Phase 5) and starvation.\n
    \n
    [wfp.org/…/gaza-grapples-catastrophic-hunger-new-r…](https://www.wfp.org/news/gaza-grapples-catastrophic-hunger-new-report-predicts-famine-if-conflict-continues)
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      > This is at a scale unheard of in any other modern conflict.\n
      \n
      Here are some ongoing wars that are more destructive:\n
      \n
      Ethiopian Civil War: Up to 600,000 dead, up to 100,000 last year alone.\n
      \n
      Russo-Ukrainian war: Around 200,000 dead, up to 95,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Insurgency in the Maghreb: Up to 400,000 dead, around 14,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Myanmar civil war: Up to 210,000 dead, at least 15,000 this year.\n
      \n
      Yemeni civil war: More than 380,000 dead and 85,000 of those were just kids starving to death from 2015 to 2018.\n
      \n
      Your submission is a prime example of confusing the attention a conflict is getting in the media with its actual scale. Yes, it’s a horrific war, but nobody is getting helped by hysterical hyperbole and shockingly few people care about wars when they are not in the evening news or on their favorite social media service 24/7.\n
      \n
      It doesn’t help that your sources are just as hysterical:\n
      \n
      > In just over two months, the offensive has wreaked more destruction than the razing of Syria’s Aleppo between 2012 and 2016, Ukraine’s Mariupol or, proportionally, the Allied bombing of Germany in World War II\n
      \n
      The Ukrainian governments estimates 25,000 dead in that city alone. Over 31,000 people died in Aleppo and up to 500,000 or 0.6% of Germans died due to Allied bombings (which is more than the 1/200 in Gaza for those following along). Is nobody fact checking anything anymore?\n
      \n
      Not to be the opposite of a Debbie Downer here (Debbie Upper?), but the fact that 75% of civilians in a high-intensity conflict like this one are not starving is extremely unusual and shows that aid is reaching them. You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
      \n
      Netanyahu can get bent, but for all the terrible things he’s responsible for or permitting, braindead settlers included, this war is not one that his government started. They’ll end it, then they’ll get kicked out of office by a furious electorate as soon as it’s done and then Palestinians can piece their lives together and maybe tell the next people like Hamas to get just as bent as Netanyahu instead of starting yet another pointless war with the strongest nation in the Middle East in the next five to fifteen years. What did these Hamas idiots think would happen after staging the worst pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust? Everyone else in the Middle East joining in on the murdering of Israelis with no staging time and against a nation armed with nuclear ICBMs? Ridiculous - and ordinary Palestinians and Israelis got to bear the brunt of this absurdity while uninformed people on the Internet get all high and mighty thinking they’ve got the morality of this irrational conflict figured out.
      """
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    > You also turned 25% starving into 25% starving to death, knowingly or unknowingly, and there is actually a difference. Doesn’t bring any food to their nonexistent table, but again, hyperbole. Right now, 50% of people are starving in Syria, despite the conflict there having died down significantly, but nobody gives a damn and not even that UN buffoon seems to know, even though it’s literally his job to know that. Hell, 16.6% of Indians are starving and there’s peace in most of the country. 13% of Americans are food insecure and the only war that’s currently going on there is the “War on Christmas”, at least according to Fox News.\n
    \n
    Again, you have no sources heres so nit sure where you are getting your figures from.\n
    \n
    When someone is starving, you realize the literal definition is that they are DYING FROM HUNGER. This is not hyperbole.\n
    \n
    Speaking of dying from hunger, the [UN Secretary General](https://twitter.com/antonioguterres/status/1738575438136680790?t=sQzlzKqjBH3cdVJXlxW1Pg&s=19) just stated that “Four out of five of the hungriest people anywhere in the world are in Gaza.”\n
    \n
    > This latest food security analysis for Gaza, which includes data from the World Food Programme (WFP), other UN agencies and non-governmental organizations, confirmed that the entire population of Gaza – roughly 2.2 million people – are in crisis or worse levels of acute food insecurity. The IPC report further highlighted that 26 percent of Gazans (576,600 people) have exhausted their food supplies and coping capacities and face catastrophic hunger (IPC Phase 5) and starvation.\n
    \n
    [wfp.org/…/gaza-grapples-catastrophic-hunger-new-r…](https://www.wfp.org/news/gaza-grapples-catastrophic-hunger-new-report-predicts-famine-if-conflict-continues)
    """
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null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
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    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    ['Prison or bullet’: new Argentina government promises harsh response to protest](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/17/argentina-president-javier-milei-security-guidelines-protests-currency-devaluationhttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/17/argentina-president-javier-milei-security-guidelines-protests-currency-devaluation)\n
    \n
    > President Javier Milei and his allies are preparing new security guidelines in anticipation of protests against currency devaluation
    """
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#2349
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    ['Prison or bullet’: new Argentina government promises harsh response to protest](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/17/argentina-president-javier-milei-security-guidelines-protests-currency-devaluationhttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/17/argentina-president-javier-milei-security-guidelines-protests-currency-devaluation)\n
    \n
    > President Javier Milei and his allies are preparing new security guidelines in anticipation of protests against currency devaluation
    """
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#2349
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    ['Prison or bullet’: new Argentina government promises harsh response to protest](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/17/argentina-president-javier-milei-security-guidelines-protests-currency-devaluationhttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/17/argentina-president-javier-milei-security-guidelines-protests-currency-devaluation)\n
    \n
    > President Javier Milei and his allies are preparing new security guidelines in anticipation of protests against currency devaluation
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2107
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
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      ---\n
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      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2280
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    \n
    > The US and its allies are “more closely aligned than ever” to face the challenges presented by Beijing, Blinken said.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2280
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
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      \n
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      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    [US critical of China’s aggression in the Taiwan Strait](https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/front/archives/2023/12/22/2003810982)\n
    \n
    > US Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Wednesday voiced concern over China’s aggression in the Taiwan Strait during a year-end news conference in Washington.\n
    \n
    > The US and its allies are “more closely aligned than ever” to face the challenges presented by Beijing, Blinken said.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
    \n
    They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
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  }
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  +body: """
    “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
    \n
    (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +image: null
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    +body: """
      It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
      \n
      They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
      """
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    “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
    \n
    (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
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    +image: null
    +parent: null
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      It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
      \n
      They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
      """
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      date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: """
    “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
    \n
    (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
    """
  +lang: "en"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3188
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3189 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  }
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      +body: """
        It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
        \n
        They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
        """
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    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
    +body: """
      “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
      \n
      (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
      """
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    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2992 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2990 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2988 …}
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    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703286316 {#3001
      date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "The author did not age well…"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703458600 {#3186
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  }
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    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
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    date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3188
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3189 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
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    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
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    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
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    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
      +body: """
        It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
        \n
        They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
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      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1707602118 {#2283
        date: 2024-02-10 22:55:18.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
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        "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2193 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2205 …}
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      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2210 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2207 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2208 …}
      -id: 244145
      -bodyTs: "'genocid':159 're':152,157 'war':5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45,50,55,60,65,70,75,80,85,90,95,100,105,110,115,120,125,130,135,140,145,150,155"
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      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703278791 {#2281
        date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
    +body: """
      “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
      \n
      (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 7
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703286316 {#3002
      date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2998 …}
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "The author did not age well…"
  +lang: "en"
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  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703458600 {#3186
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  -id: 249731
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    date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3188
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3189 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
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    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
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    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
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    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
      +body: """
        It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
        \n
        They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 35
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1707602118 {#2283
        date: 2024-02-10 22:55:18.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
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        "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2193 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2205 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2202 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2210 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2207 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2208 …}
      -id: 244145
      -bodyTs: "'genocid':159 're':152,157 'war':5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45,50,55,60,65,70,75,80,85,90,95,100,105,110,115,120,125,130,135,140,145,150,155"
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703278791 {#2281
        date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
    +body: """
      “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
      \n
      (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703286316 {#3002
      date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2998 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2996 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2994 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2992 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2990 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2988 …}
    -id: 244456
    -bodyTs: "'also':11 'bad':23 'book':19 'decent':20 'didn':2 'ender':15 'fight':9,14 'futur':13 'genocid':17 'great':18 'manual':30 'movi':21 'one':8 'use':26 'want':4 'win':6"
    +ranking: 0
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    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703286316 {#3001
      date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "The author did not age well…"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703458600 {#3186
    date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
  }
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    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    "@jarfil@beehaw.org"
  ]
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  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3192 …}
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  -id: 249731
  -bodyTs: "'age':5 'author':2 'well':6"
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  +editedAt: null
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    date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3430
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
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    -id: 36
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
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    +apDeletedAt: null
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    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3188
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3189 …}
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    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
          \n
          They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 35
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1707602118 {#2283
          date: 2024-02-10 22:55:18.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
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          "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2193 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2205 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2202 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2210 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2207 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2208 …}
        -id: 244145
        -bodyTs: "'genocid':159 're':152,157 'war':5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45,50,55,60,65,70,75,80,85,90,95,100,105,110,115,120,125,130,135,140,145,150,155"
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703278791 {#2281
          date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
      +body: """
        “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
        \n
        (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 7
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703286316 {#3002
        date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
        "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2998 …}
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      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2992 …}
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      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2988 …}
      -id: 244456
      -bodyTs: "'also':11 'bad':23 'book':19 'decent':20 'didn':2 'ender':15 'fight':9,14 'futur':13 'genocid':17 'great':18 'manual':30 'movi':21 'one':8 'use':26 'want':4 'win':6"
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703286316 {#3001
        date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
    +body: "The author did not age well…"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 2
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703458600 {#3186
      date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
      "@jarfil@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3190 …}
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    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3200 …}
    -id: 249731
    -bodyTs: "'age':5 'author':2 'well':6"
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    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703458600 {#3187
      date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "Meh… check out Cellini, Wagner, Dalí, Hubbard… as artists go, Card is just “meh”."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703469282 {#3428
    date: 2023-12-25 02:54:42.0 +01:00
  }
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    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    "@jarfil@beehaw.org"
    "@thebardingreen@lemmy.starlightkel.xyz"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3431 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3433 …}
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  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3439 …}
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  -id: 250070
  -bodyTs: "'artist':9 'card':11 'cellini':4 'check':2 'dalí':6 'go':10 'hubbard':7 'meh':1,14 'wagner':5"
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    date: 2023-12-25 02:54:42.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3430
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
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    +customCss: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
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    +markedForDeletionAt: null
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    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
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    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3188
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3189 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
          \n
          They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 35
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1707602118 {#2283
          date: 2024-02-10 22:55:18.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2193 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2205 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2202 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2210 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2207 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2208 …}
        -id: 244145
        -bodyTs: "'genocid':159 're':152,157 'war':5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45,50,55,60,65,70,75,80,85,90,95,100,105,110,115,120,125,130,135,140,145,150,155"
        +ranking: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/6827705"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703278791 {#2281
          date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
      +body: """
        “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
        \n
        (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 7
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703286316 {#3002
        date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
        "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2998 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2996 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2994 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2992 …}
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      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2988 …}
      -id: 244456
      -bodyTs: "'also':11 'bad':23 'book':19 'decent':20 'didn':2 'ender':15 'fight':9,14 'futur':13 'genocid':17 'great':18 'manual':30 'movi':21 'one':8 'use':26 'want':4 'win':6"
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      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703286316 {#3001
        date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
    +body: "The author did not age well…"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 2
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703458600 {#3186
      date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
      "@jarfil@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3190 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3192 …}
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    -id: 249731
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    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703458600 {#3187
      date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "Meh… check out Cellini, Wagner, Dalí, Hubbard… as artists go, Card is just “meh”."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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    date: 2023-12-25 02:54:42.0 +01:00
  }
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    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    "@jarfil@beehaw.org"
    "@thebardingreen@lemmy.starlightkel.xyz"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3431 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3433 …}
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    date: 2023-12-25 02:54:42.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3430
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
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    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
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    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3188
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3189 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3000
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2999 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
          \n
          They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
          """
        +lang: "en"
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          date: 2024-02-10 22:55:18.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
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          "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2193 …}
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        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2210 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2207 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2208 …}
        -id: 244145
        -bodyTs: "'genocid':159 're':152,157 'war':5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45,50,55,60,65,70,75,80,85,90,95,100,105,110,115,120,125,130,135,140,145,150,155"
        +ranking: 0
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703278791 {#2281
          date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
      +body: """
        “I didn’t want to win just one fight, but also all future fights” - Ender the Genocide\n
        \n
        (great books, decent movie, too bad some are using it as a manual)
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 7
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703286316 {#3002
        date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
      }
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      +tags: null
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        "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
        "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2998 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2996 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2994 …}
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        date: 2023-12-23 00:05:16.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
    +body: "The author did not age well…"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 2
    +score: 0
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      date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
      "@jarfil@beehaw.org"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703458600 {#3187
      date: 2023-12-24 23:56:40.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "Meh… check out Cellini, Wagner, Dalí, Hubbard… as artists go, Card is just “meh”."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
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    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    "@jarfil@beehaw.org"
    "@thebardingreen@lemmy.starlightkel.xyz"
  ]
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    date: 2023-12-25 02:54:42.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2984
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2983 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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    +postCount: 0
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
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    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
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    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: """
      It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
      \n
      They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
      """
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    ]
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      date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "It’s critical to note, as you point out, that until you know what the goal is you can’t say whether they are winning or losing."
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  }
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    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
  ]
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    date: 2023-12-22 22:43:11.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2984
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2983 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
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    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
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    -id: 36
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    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: """
      It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
      \n
      They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
      """
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    ]
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703278791 {#2281
      date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "It’s critical to note, as you point out, that until you know what the goal is you can’t say whether they are winning or losing."
  +lang: "en"
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    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
  ]
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2984
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2983 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
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    +apDiscoverable: true
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
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    +apDeletedAt: null
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2204 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: """
      It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war. It’s not a war.\n
      \n
      They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
      """
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    ]
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3173
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3173
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        They’re not at war. They’re doing genocide.
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3173
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    +description: """
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      +mentions: [
        "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2193 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2205 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2202 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2210 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2207 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2208 …}
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      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703278791 {#2281
        date: 2023-12-22 21:59:51.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
    +body: "It’s critical to note, as you point out, that until you know what the goal is you can’t say whether they are winning or losing."
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    ]
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      date: 2023-12-22 22:43:11.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2194}
  +body: "I mean, the Tet Offensive didn’t really have a goal except to make the occupiers take the opposition seriously."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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    "@Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml"
    "@MagicShel@programming.dev"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152
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  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  +image: null
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2173 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  }
  +image: null
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  }
  +ip: null
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    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2153 …}
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2173 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  }
  +image: null
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  }
  +ip: null
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    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2153 …}
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2968
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2967 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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  }
  +image: null
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    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
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    +lang: "en"
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
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  }
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2968
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2968
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3204
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152}
  +body: """
    Every politician and military leader worth their salt knows that oppression creates terrorism. The way Israel has been treating Palestine made Hamas inevitable, and everyone making decisions in Israel had to have known it. So why intentionally create terrorists? Because theoretically, the existence of terrorists justifies violence. Hamas was created by Israel with the intention of accelerating the genocide under a sympathetic justification.\n
    \n
    Hamas is a Frankenstein’s monster. A creation, deliberately made, which grew out of its creator’s control. Hamas’ cause is more sympathetic than Israel bargained for, because at the end of the day all that rage and violence is motivated by a desire not to be oppressed. And just like in the original Frankenstein, all the creator needs to defeat the monster is a little bit of love. If Israel passed laws guaranteeing the equality of Palestinian citizens, Hamas would have no new recruits and no international support. Its legitimacy and power would evaporate in a day. Israel continues the “war” because it believes it can still control the monster. That it can still use Hamas to justify further violence.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3204
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    Every politician and military leader worth their salt knows that oppression creates terrorism. The way Israel has been treating Palestine made Hamas inevitable, and everyone making decisions in Israel had to have known it. So why intentionally create terrorists? Because theoretically, the existence of terrorists justifies violence. Hamas was created by Israel with the intention of accelerating the genocide under a sympathetic justification.\n
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    Every politician and military leader worth their salt knows that oppression creates terrorism. The way Israel has been treating Palestine made Hamas inevitable, and everyone making decisions in Israel had to have known it. So why intentionally create terrorists? Because theoretically, the existence of terrorists justifies violence. Hamas was created by Israel with the intention of accelerating the genocide under a sympathetic justification.\n
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      Every politician and military leader worth their salt knows that oppression creates terrorism. The way Israel has been treating Palestine made Hamas inevitable, and everyone making decisions in Israel had to have known it. So why intentionally create terrorists? Because theoretically, the existence of terrorists justifies violence. Hamas was created by Israel with the intention of accelerating the genocide under a sympathetic justification.\n
      \n
      Hamas is a Frankenstein’s monster. A creation, deliberately made, which grew out of its creator’s control. Hamas’ cause is more sympathetic than Israel bargained for, because at the end of the day all that rage and violence is motivated by a desire not to be oppressed. And just like in the original Frankenstein, all the creator needs to defeat the monster is a little bit of love. If Israel passed laws guaranteeing the equality of Palestinian citizens, Hamas would have no new recruits and no international support. Its legitimacy and power would evaporate in a day. Israel continues the “war” because it believes it can still control the monster. That it can still use Hamas to justify further violence.
      """
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@DroneRights@beehaw.org"
      "@janabuggs@beehaw.org"
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152}
  +body: "Yep, there was a reason why until 2019 i believe Israel publicly funded the Hamas with the intent to weaken the formation of a Palestinian government. Israel’s far right needs someone they can try and look strong against so people stop looking inword ar what thier government is actually doing."
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3337
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +body: """
      Every politician and military leader worth their salt knows that oppression creates terrorism. The way Israel has been treating Palestine made Hamas inevitable, and everyone making decisions in Israel had to have known it. So why intentionally create terrorists? Because theoretically, the existence of terrorists justifies violence. Hamas was created by Israel with the intention of accelerating the genocide under a sympathetic justification.\n
      \n
      Hamas is a Frankenstein’s monster. A creation, deliberately made, which grew out of its creator’s control. Hamas’ cause is more sympathetic than Israel bargained for, because at the end of the day all that rage and violence is motivated by a desire not to be oppressed. And just like in the original Frankenstein, all the creator needs to defeat the monster is a little bit of love. If Israel passed laws guaranteeing the equality of Palestinian citizens, Hamas would have no new recruits and no international support. Its legitimacy and power would evaporate in a day. Israel continues the “war” because it believes it can still control the monster. That it can still use Hamas to justify further violence.
      """
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      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
      "@DroneRights@beehaw.org"
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152}
  +body: "Yep, there was a reason why until 2019 i believe Israel publicly funded the Hamas with the intent to weaken the formation of a Palestinian government. Israel’s far right needs someone they can try and look strong against so people stop looking inword ar what thier government is actually doing."
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3337
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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      Every politician and military leader worth their salt knows that oppression creates terrorism. The way Israel has been treating Palestine made Hamas inevitable, and everyone making decisions in Israel had to have known it. So why intentionally create terrorists? Because theoretically, the existence of terrorists justifies violence. Hamas was created by Israel with the intention of accelerating the genocide under a sympathetic justification.\n
      \n
      Hamas is a Frankenstein’s monster. A creation, deliberately made, which grew out of its creator’s control. Hamas’ cause is more sympathetic than Israel bargained for, because at the end of the day all that rage and violence is motivated by a desire not to be oppressed. And just like in the original Frankenstein, all the creator needs to defeat the monster is a little bit of love. If Israel passed laws guaranteeing the equality of Palestinian citizens, Hamas would have no new recruits and no international support. Its legitimacy and power would evaporate in a day. Israel continues the “war” because it believes it can still control the monster. That it can still use Hamas to justify further violence.
      """
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      "@DroneRights@beehaw.org"
      "@janabuggs@beehaw.org"
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703297563 {#3203
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152}
  +body: "Yep, there was a reason why until 2019 i believe Israel publicly funded the Hamas with the intent to weaken the formation of a Palestinian government. Israel’s far right needs someone they can try and look strong against so people stop looking inword ar what thier government is actually doing."
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    "@DroneRights@beehaw.org"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3036
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +body: "Netanyahu and Hamas are on the same side."
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3036
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152}
  +body: "Netanyahu and Hamas are on the same side."
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3036
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3037 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2152}
  +body: "Netanyahu and Hamas are on the same side."
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2352
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2491 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2195 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    \n
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
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      ---\n
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      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
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      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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    \n
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      \n
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    They’re not losing. They are kicking the absolute shit out of the Palestinians. This is not even a remotely fair fight. The problem is most of these people didn’t have anything to do with 10/7, which means Israel is destroying any respect or goodwill anyone had for them when this started.\n
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null
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
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      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
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      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      ---\n
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      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
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    +description: """
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
      -id: 244997
      -bodyTs: "'critic':9 'discuss':18 'hope':13 'israel':11 'mani':2 'post':3,15 're':8 'remov':5 'surviv':16"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://literature.cafe/comment/3721577"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
        date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 17
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
      date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
    -id: 245160
    -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
      date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
    date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
  -id: 245311
  -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
    date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1707258339 {#2546
          date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
        -id: 244997
        -bodyTs: "'critic':9 'discuss':18 'hope':13 'israel':11 'mani':2 'post':3,15 're':8 'remov':5 'surviv':16"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://literature.cafe/comment/3721577"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
          date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 17
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
        date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
      -id: 245160
      -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
        date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 2
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
      date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
    -id: 245311
    -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
      date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "Got any examples?"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 3
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
    date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
  -id: 245357
  -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
    date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1707258339 {#2546
          date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
        -id: 244997
        -bodyTs: "'critic':9 'discuss':18 'hope':13 'israel':11 'mani':2 'post':3,15 're':8 'remov':5 'surviv':16"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://literature.cafe/comment/3721577"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
          date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 17
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
        date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
      -id: 245160
      -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
        date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 2
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
      date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
    -id: 245311
    -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
      date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "Got any examples?"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 3
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
    date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
  -id: 245357
  -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
    date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 12
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1707258339 {#2546
          date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
        -id: 244997
        -bodyTs: "'critic':9 'discuss':18 'hope':13 'israel':11 'mani':2 'post':3,15 're':8 'remov':5 'surviv':16"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://literature.cafe/comment/3721577"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
          date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 17
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
        date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
      -id: 245160
      -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
        date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 2
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
      date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
    -id: 245311
    -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
      date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "Got any examples?"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 3
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
    date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
  -id: 245357
  -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
    date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
        +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
          +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: null
          +root: null
          +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 12
          +score: 0
          +lastActive: DateTime @1707258339 {#2546
            date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
          +tags: null
          +mentions: [
            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
          +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
          +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
          -id: 244997
          -bodyTs: "'critic':9 'discuss':18 'hope':13 'israel':11 'mani':2 'post':3,15 're':8 'remov':5 'surviv':16"
          +ranking: 0
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          +upVotes: 0
          +downVotes: 0
          +visibility: "visible             "
          +apId: "https://literature.cafe/comment/3721577"
          +editedAt: null
          +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
            date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 17
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
          date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
        -id: 245160
        -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
          date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 2
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
        date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
      -id: 245311
      -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
        date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "Got any examples?"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 3
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
      date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
    -id: 245357
    -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
      date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
    \n
    Several ten days ago alone.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
    date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
  -id: 245406
  -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
    date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
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    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
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    +apDiscoverable: true
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
        +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
          +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: null
          +root: null
          +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
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            date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
          +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
          +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
          -id: 244997
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            date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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        +score: 0
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          date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
        -id: 245160
        -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
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        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
          date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 2
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
        date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
      -id: 245311
      -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
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      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
        date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "Got any examples?"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 3
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
      date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
    -id: 245357
    -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
      date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
    \n
    Several ten days ago alone.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
    date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
  -id: 245406
  -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
    date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
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    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
        +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
          +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: null
          +root: null
          +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
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            date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
          +tags: null
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
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          -id: 244997
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          +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
            date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 17
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
          date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
        -id: 245160
        -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
        +ranking: 0
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
          date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 2
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
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      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
      -id: 245311
      -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
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      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
        date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "Got any examples?"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 3
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
      date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
    -id: 245357
    -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
    +ranking: 0
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    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
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    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
      date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
    \n
    Several ten days ago alone.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 1
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
    date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
  -id: 245406
  -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
    date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
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        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
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          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
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            +image: null
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            +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
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            ]
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              date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
          +lang: "en"
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          ]
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            date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 2
        +score: 0
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          date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
        }
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        +tags: null
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
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        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
        -id: 245311
        -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
        +ranking: 0
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          date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "Got any examples?"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 3
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
        date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
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      -id: 245357
      -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
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      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
        date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
      \n
      Several ten days ago alone.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 1
    +score: 0
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      date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
    -id: 245406
    -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
    +ranking: 0
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    +downVotes: 0
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    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
      date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
    \n
    It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
    \n
    It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 13
  +score: 0
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    date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
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  -id: 245487
  -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
  +ranking: 0
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  +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
    date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
  }
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
    date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
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    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
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    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
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    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
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    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
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          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
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            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: null
            +root: null
            +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
            +lang: "en"
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              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
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          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
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          -id: 245160
          -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
          +ranking: 0
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            date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 2
        +score: 0
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
        -id: 245311
        -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
          date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "Got any examples?"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 3
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
        date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
      -id: 245357
      -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
        date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
      \n
      Several ten days ago alone.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 1
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
      date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
    -id: 245406
    -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
      date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
    \n
    It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
    \n
    It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 13
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703324669 {#3518
    date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3532 …}
  -id: 245487
  -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903286"
  +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
    date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
  }
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
    date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
          +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
            +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
            +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: null
            +root: null
            +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
            +favouriteCount: 12
            +score: 0
            +lastActive: DateTime @1707258339 {#2546
              date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
            +mentions: [
              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
            +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
            +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
            +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
            +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
            -id: 244997
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            +ranking: 0
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            +editedAt: null
            +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
              date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 17
          +score: 0
          +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
            date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
          +tags: null
          +mentions: [
            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
          +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
          +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
          -id: 245160
          -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
          +ranking: 0
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          +visibility: "visible             "
          +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
          +editedAt: null
          +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
            date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 2
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
          date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
        -id: 245311
        -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
          date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "Got any examples?"
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 3
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
        date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
      -id: 245357
      -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
        date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
      \n
      Several ten days ago alone.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 1
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
      date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
    -id: 245406
    -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
      date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
    \n
    It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
    \n
    It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 13
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703324669 {#3518
    date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3532 …}
  -id: 245487
  -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903286"
  +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
    date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
  }
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
    date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3558
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3559 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
        +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
          +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
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          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
            +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
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            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
              +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
              +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
              +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
              +image: null
              +parent: null
              +root: null
              +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
              +lang: "en"
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                date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
              }
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                "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              ]
              +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
              +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
              +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
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                date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
            +favouriteCount: 17
            +score: 0
            +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
              date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
            +mentions: [
              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
            +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
            +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
            +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
            +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
            -id: 245160
            -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
            +ranking: 0
            +commentCount: 0
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            +downVotes: 0
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            +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
            +editedAt: null
            +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
              date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 2
          +score: 0
          +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
            date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
          +tags: null
          +mentions: [
            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
          +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
          +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
          -id: 245311
          -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
          +ranking: 0
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          +visibility: "visible             "
          +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
          +editedAt: null
          +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
            date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "Got any examples?"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 3
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
          date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
        -id: 245357
        -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
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        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
          date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
        \n
        Several ten days ago alone.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 1
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
        date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
      -id: 245406
      -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
        date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
      \n
      It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 13
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703324669 {#3518
      date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3532 …}
    -id: 245487
    -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903286"
    +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
      date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
    }
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
      date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
    \n
    > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
    \n
    Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703351145 {#3556
    date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3560 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3562 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3564 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3566 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3568 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3570 …}
  -id: 246293
  -bodyTs: "'appropri':52 'bias':47 'censor':60 'censorship':28,40,44,53,58 'comment':15 'could':42 'couldn':19 'even':50 'haven':11 'let':21 'liter':57 'm':2 'might':49 'one':5 'post':33 're':31 'read':13 'reduc':46 'referenc':17 'remov':32 'repli':8 'side':36 'speech':61 'stand':23 'unchalleng':24 'yes':37"
  +ranking: 0
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  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
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  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703351145 {#3557
    date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3558
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3559 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
        +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
          +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
            +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
            +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
              +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
              +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
              +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
              +image: null
              +parent: null
              +root: null
              +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
              +lang: "en"
              +isAdult: false
              +favouriteCount: 12
              +score: 0
              +lastActive: DateTime @1707258339 {#2546
                date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
              }
              +ip: null
              +tags: null
              +mentions: [
                "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              ]
              +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
              +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
              +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
              +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
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              +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
              -id: 244997
              -bodyTs: "'critic':9 'discuss':18 'hope':13 'israel':11 'mani':2 'post':3,15 're':8 'remov':5 'surviv':16"
              +ranking: 0
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              +apId: "https://literature.cafe/comment/3721577"
              +editedAt: null
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                date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
            +favouriteCount: 17
            +score: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
            +mentions: [
              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
            +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
            +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
            +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
            +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
            -id: 245160
            -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
            +ranking: 0
            +commentCount: 0
            +upVotes: 0
            +downVotes: 0
            +visibility: "visible             "
            +apId: "https://slrpnk.net/comment/4876803"
            +editedAt: null
            +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
              date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 2
          +score: 0
          +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
            date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
          +tags: null
          +mentions: [
            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
          +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
          +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
          -id: 245311
          -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
          +ranking: 0
          +commentCount: 0
          +upVotes: 0
          +downVotes: 0
          +visibility: "visible             "
          +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
          +editedAt: null
          +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
            date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "Got any examples?"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 3
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
          date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
        -id: 245357
        -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
        +ranking: 0
        +commentCount: 0
        +upVotes: 0
        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
          date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
        \n
        Several ten days ago alone.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 1
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
        date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
      -id: 245406
      -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
        date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
      \n
      It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 13
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703324669 {#3518
      date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3532 …}
    -id: 245487
    -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
    +ranking: 0
    +commentCount: 0
    +upVotes: 0
    +downVotes: 0
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903286"
    +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
      date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
    }
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
      date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
    \n
    > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
    \n
    Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 2
  +score: 0
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    date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3560 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3562 …}
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  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3566 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3568 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3570 …}
  -id: 246293
  -bodyTs: "'appropri':52 'bias':47 'censor':60 'censorship':28,40,44,53,58 'comment':15 'could':42 'couldn':19 'even':50 'haven':11 'let':21 'liter':57 'm':2 'might':49 'one':5 'post':33 're':31 'read':13 'reduc':46 'referenc':17 'remov':32 'repli':8 'side':36 'speech':61 'stand':23 'unchalleng':24 'yes':37"
  +ranking: 0
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703351145 {#3557
    date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3558
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3559 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +postCommentCount: 0
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
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    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
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    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
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    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
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    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
      +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
        +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
          +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
            +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
            +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
              +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
              +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
              +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
              +image: null
              +parent: null
              +root: null
              +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
              +lang: "en"
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                date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
              }
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                "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              ]
              +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
              +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
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                date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
            +lang: "en"
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              date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
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              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
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            +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
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            +ranking: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 2
          +score: 0
          +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
            date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
          +tags: null
          +mentions: [
            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
          +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
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          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
          -id: 245311
          -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
          +ranking: 0
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          +visibility: "visible             "
          +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
          +editedAt: null
          +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
            date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: "Got any examples?"
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 3
        +score: 0
        +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
          date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
        +mentions: [
          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
        -id: 245357
        -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
          date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
        \n
        Several ten days ago alone.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 1
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703321332 {#3465
        date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
      -id: 245406
      -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
      +ranking: 0
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      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
        date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
      \n
      It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 13
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    }
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3532 …}
    -id: 245487
    -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
    +ranking: 0
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    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903286"
    +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
      date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
    }
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
      date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
    \n
    > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
    \n
    Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
    """
  +lang: "en"
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3560 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3562 …}
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  -id: 246293
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  +ranking: 0
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  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703351145 {#3557
    date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3596
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3597 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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    +postCommentCount: 0
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
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    +markedForDeletionAt: null
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    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
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    -id: 36
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    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
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      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
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          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
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            +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
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              +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
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                +image: null
                +parent: null
                +root: null
                +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
                +lang: "en"
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                  date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
                }
                +ip: null
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                  "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                ]
                +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
                +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
                +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2557 …}
                +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2559 …}
                +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2561 …}
                +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2563 …}
                -id: 244997
                -bodyTs: "'critic':9 'discuss':18 'hope':13 'israel':11 'mani':2 'post':3,15 're':8 'remov':5 'surviv':16"
                +ranking: 0
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                  date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
                }
              }
              +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
              +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
              +lang: "en"
              +isAdult: false
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                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
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                "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
                "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
              ]
              +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
              +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
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              +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
              -id: 245160
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              +ranking: 0
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              +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
            +favouriteCount: 2
            +score: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
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              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
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            -id: 245311
            -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
            +ranking: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Got any examples?"
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 3
          +score: 0
          +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
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          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
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          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
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          -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
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          +editedAt: null
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: """
          [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
          \n
          Several ten days ago alone.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
        +score: 0
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          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
        }
        +ip: null
        +tags: null
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
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        -id: 245406
        -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
        +ranking: 0
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        +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
        \n
        It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
        \n
        It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
        """
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      +isAdult: false
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        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
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        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
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      -id: 245487
      -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
      +ranking: 0
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      +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
        date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
      }
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
      \n
      > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
    }
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3560 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3562 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3564 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3566 …}
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    -bodyTs: "'appropri':52 'bias':47 'censor':60 'censorship':28,40,44,53,58 'comment':15 'could':42 'couldn':19 'even':50 'haven':11 'let':21 'liter':57 'm':2 'might':49 'one':5 'post':33 're':31 'read':13 'reduc':46 'referenc':17 'remov':32 'repli':8 'side':36 'speech':61 'stand':23 'unchalleng':24 'yes':37"
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "![](https://beehaw.org/pictrs/image/50526d5b-04e3-4a98-a4ce-a0d0ad7146d5.webp)"
  +lang: "en"
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  }
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    "@m0darn@lemmy.ca"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3598 …}
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  -id: 247701
  -bodyTs: "'/pictrs/image/50526d5b-04e3-4a98-a4ce-a0d0ad7146d5.webp)':3 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/pictrs/image/50526d5b-04e3-4a98-a4ce-a0d0ad7146d5.webp)':1"
  +ranking: 0
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    date: 2023-12-24 04:17:54.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3596
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3597 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3558
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3559 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
          +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
            +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
            +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
              +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
              +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
              +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
              +image: null
              +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
                +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
                +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
                +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
                +image: null
                +parent: null
                +root: null
                +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
                +lang: "en"
                +isAdult: false
                +favouriteCount: 12
                +score: 0
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                  date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
                }
                +ip: null
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                  "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                ]
                +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
                +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
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                -id: 244997
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                +ranking: 0
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                +editedAt: null
                +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703305704 {#2547
                  date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
                }
              }
              +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
              +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
              +lang: "en"
              +isAdult: false
              +favouriteCount: 17
              +score: 0
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                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
              +ip: null
              +tags: null
              +mentions: [
                "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
                "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
              ]
              +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
              +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
              +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
              +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
              +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
              +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
              -id: 245160
              -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
              +ranking: 0
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                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
            +favouriteCount: 2
            +score: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
            +mentions: [
              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
            +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
            +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
            +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
            +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
            -id: 245311
            -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
            +ranking: 0
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            +visibility: "visible             "
            +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903192"
            +editedAt: null
            +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318291 {#3218
              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Got any examples?"
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 3
          +score: 0
          +lastActive: DateTime @1703319700 {#3351
            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
          +tags: null
          +mentions: [
            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
          +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3358 …}
          +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3360 …}
          +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
          -id: 245357
          -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
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          +editedAt: null
          +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703319700 {#3352
            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: """
          [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
          \n
          Several ten days ago alone.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
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        -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
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          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
        \n
        It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
        \n
        It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
        """
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        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
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        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
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      -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
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        date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
      }
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
      \n
      > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
      """
    +lang: "en"
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3560 …}
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "![](https://beehaw.org/pictrs/image/50526d5b-04e3-4a98-a4ce-a0d0ad7146d5.webp)"
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    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    "@m0darn@lemmy.ca"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3598 …}
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  -id: 247701
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    date: 2023-12-24 04:17:54.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3596
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3597 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3558
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3559 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
          +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
            +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
            +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
              +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
              +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
              +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
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              +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
                +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
                +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
                +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
                +image: null
                +parent: null
                +root: null
                +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
                +lang: "en"
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                  date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
                }
                +ip: null
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                  "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                ]
                +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
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                +ranking: 0
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                  date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
                }
              }
              +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
              +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
              +lang: "en"
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                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
              +ip: null
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                "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
                "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
              ]
              +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
              +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
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              -id: 245160
              -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
              +ranking: 0
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                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
            +favouriteCount: 2
            +score: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
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              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
            +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3224 …}
            +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3226 …}
            +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3228 …}
            +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3230 …}
            -id: 245311
            -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
            +ranking: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Got any examples?"
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 3
          +score: 0
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
          +ip: null
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
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          -id: 245357
          -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: """
          [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
          \n
          Several ten days ago alone.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
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        }
        +ip: null
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
        +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3472 …}
        +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3474 …}
        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
        -id: 245406
        -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
        +ranking: 0
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        +downVotes: 0
        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
        \n
        It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
        \n
        It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 13
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1703324669 {#3518
        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
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      -id: 245487
      -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
      +ranking: 0
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      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903286"
      +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
        date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
      }
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
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    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
      \n
      > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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    +score: 0
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3560 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3562 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3564 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3566 …}
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "![](https://beehaw.org/pictrs/image/50526d5b-04e3-4a98-a4ce-a0d0ad7146d5.webp)"
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    "@m0darn@lemmy.ca"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3598 …}
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  -id: 247701
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    date: 2023-12-24 04:17:54.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3613
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
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    +markedForDeletionAt: null
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    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
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    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3558
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3559 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3521
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3467
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3353
          +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
          +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
          +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
          +image: null
          +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
            +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
            +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
            +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
            +image: null
            +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
              +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
              +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
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              +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
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                +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
                +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
                +image: null
                +parent: null
                +root: null
                +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
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                +lastActive: DateTime @1707258339 {#2546
                  date: 2024-02-06 23:25:39.0 +01:00
                }
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                  "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                ]
                +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2553 …}
                +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2555 …}
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                +ranking: 0
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                  date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
                }
              }
              +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
              +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
              +lang: "en"
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                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
              +ip: null
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                "@Five@slrpnk.net"
                "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
                "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
              ]
              +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
              +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
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              -id: 245160
              -bodyTs: "'admir':40 'alyaza@beehaw.org':42 'beaten':45 'beehaw':34 'censorship':28 'conflict':16 'gaza':30 'human':8 'improv':22 'lemmy.world':18 'lot':38 'near':11 'never':26 'palestinian':9 'post':6,49 'remov':10 'report':31 'seen':27 'sever':5,50 'start':13 'thing':20 'though':19 'time':51 've':3,25 'yes':1"
              +ranking: 0
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                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
            +favouriteCount: 2
            +score: 0
            +lastActive: DateTime @1703318291 {#3217
              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
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              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
            +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
            +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3222 …}
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            -id: 245311
            -bodyTs: "'accord':1 'censorship':18 'definit':17 'israel':11 'modlog':4 'negat':9 'post':5 'remov':14 'toward':10"
            +ranking: 0
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Got any examples?"
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
          +favouriteCount: 3
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
          +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3356 …}
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          +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3362 …}
          +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3364 …}
          -id: 245357
          -bodyTs: "'exampl':3 'got':1"
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          +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903210"
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: """
          [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
          \n
          Several ten days ago alone.
          """
        +lang: "en"
        +isAdult: false
        +favouriteCount: 1
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          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
        }
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        +tags: null
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
        ]
        +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3468 …}
        +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3470 …}
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        +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3476 …}
        +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3478 …}
        -id: 245406
        -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
        +ranking: 0
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        +visibility: "visible             "
        +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903239"
        +editedAt: null
        +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703321332 {#3466
          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
        \n
        It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
        \n
        It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
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        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3522 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3524 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3526 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3528 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3530 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3532 …}
      -id: 245487
      -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
      +ranking: 0
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      +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903286"
      +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
        date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
      }
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703324669 {#3520
        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
      \n
      > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
      """
    +lang: "en"
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3560 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3562 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3564 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3566 …}
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    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3570 …}
    -id: 246293
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    +ranking: 0
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703351145 {#3557
      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "If you read who I was responding to, they are asserting that this is ***political censorship*** of pro-Israel content. It may be censorship, but not towards a certain political viewpoint, just towards assholes."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
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    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    "@m0darn@lemmy.ca"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3614 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3616 …}
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  -id: 246368
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  +ranking: 0
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  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903883"
  +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1707149174 {#3611
    date: 2024-02-05 17:06:14.0 +01:00
  }
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703352986 {#3612
    date: 2023-12-23 18:36:26.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3613
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
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    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
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    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
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              +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
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                "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
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            +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
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          }
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          +body: "Got any examples?"
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            "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          ]
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
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        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: """
          [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
          \n
          Several ten days ago alone.
          """
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          "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
        ]
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          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
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      }
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      +body: """
        The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
        \n
        It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
        \n
        It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
        """
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        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
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        date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
      \n
      > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
      """
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      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
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  +body: "If you read who I was responding to, they are asserting that this is ***political censorship*** of pro-Israel content. It may be censorship, but not towards a certain political viewpoint, just towards assholes."
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3613
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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                +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
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              +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
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              +editedAt: null
              +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
                date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
              }
            }
            +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
            +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
            +lang: "en"
            +isAdult: false
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
            +ip: null
            +tags: null
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              "@Five@slrpnk.net"
              "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
              "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            ]
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              date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
            }
          }
          +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
          +body: "Got any examples?"
          +lang: "en"
          +isAdult: false
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
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            "@Five@slrpnk.net"
            "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
            "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
            "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          ]
          +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3354 …}
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            date: 2023-12-23 09:21:40.0 +01:00
          }
        }
        +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
        +body: """
          [beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)\n
          \n
          Several ten days ago alone.
          """
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        +isAdult: false
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          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
          "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
          "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
          "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
          "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
        ]
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        -id: 245406
        -bodyTs: "'/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':3 'ago':7 'alon':8 'beehaw.org':2 'beehaw.org/modlog/8](https://beehaw.org/modlog/8)':1 'day':6 'sever':4 'ten':5"
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          date: 2023-12-23 09:48:52.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: """
        The top one on that list is a comment condemning Israel, and the mods removed it. Several others, too.\n
        \n
        It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
        \n
        It mostly looks like the same 2-3 trolls posting inflammatory content that is getting removed.
        """
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        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
        "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
      ]
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      -bodyTs: "'-3':39 '2':38 'censorship':23 'comment':9 'condemn':10 'content':43 'get':46 'inflammatori':42 'israel':11 'like':35 'list':6 'look':34 'mod':14 'most':33 'one':3 'other':18 'post':28,41 're':26 'remov':15,27,47 'sever':17 'side':31 'top':2 'troll':40"
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      +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1706814735 {#3519
        date: 2024-02-01 20:12:15.0 +01:00
      }
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        date: 2023-12-23 10:44:29.0 +01:00
      }
    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: """
      I’m not the one you were replying to and haven’t read the comments you referenced but couldn’t let this stand unchallenged:\n
      \n
      > It’s not censorship when they’re removing posts by both sides.\n
      \n
      Yes it is censorship, it could be censorship with reduced bias, it might even be appropriate censorship. But it is literally censorship to censor speech.
      """
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
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      date: 2023-12-23 18:05:45.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "If you read who I was responding to, they are asserting that this is ***political censorship*** of pro-Israel content. It may be censorship, but not towards a certain political viewpoint, just towards assholes."
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
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    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    "@m0darn@lemmy.ca"
  ]
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    date: 2024-02-05 17:06:14.0 +01:00
  }
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    date: 2023-12-23 18:36:26.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3368
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3322 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
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    +customCss: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
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    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
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    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3219
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
        +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: "Too many posts are removed if they’re critical of Israel. I hope this post survives for discussion."
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        ]
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          date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
      +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
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        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
        "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
      ]
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        date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
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    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "According to the modlog, posts that are not negative towards Israel have been removed. There is definitely censorship here."
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3220 …}
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      date: 2023-12-23 08:58:11.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: "you literally just had a protracted argument with me, an admin who determines what gets removed or not, in another thread over Israel and that was not removed. you have another pro-Israel set of comments in this thread that have not been removed even though i personally think they’re even less defensible than what you were arguing with me. i don’t know how you can seriously attempt to make this point."
  +lang: "en"
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3369 …}
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  +ranking: 0
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    date: 2023-12-23 17:36:58.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3368
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3322 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
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    +entryCommentCount: 3849
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    +markedForDeletionAt: null
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3368
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
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      \n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3235
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    }
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    +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1703311103 {#3054
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    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
      "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3058 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3060 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3062 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3064 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3066 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3068 …}
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    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703311103 {#3055
      date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    Lemmy.world hasn’t improved as far as I can tell. Or maybe their bias was even worse before I noticed.\n
    \n
    In any event, their entire instance is now blocked from my feeds, so I won’t have to deal with them.
    """
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
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  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703374673 {#3234
    date: 2023-12-24 00:37:53.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3235
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +apDiscoverable: true
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3057 …}
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    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
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      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
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        date: 2023-12-23 05:28:24.0 +01:00
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    }
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      date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    Lemmy.world hasn’t improved as far as I can tell. Or maybe their bias was even worse before I noticed.\n
    \n
    In any event, their entire instance is now blocked from my feeds, so I won’t have to deal with them.
    """
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    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
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    date: 2024-02-07 03:27:16.0 +01:00
  }
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703374673 {#3234
    date: 2023-12-24 00:37:53.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3235
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
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  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3056
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      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
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      ]
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    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
    +body: "Yes, I’ve had several posts that humanize Palestinians removed near the start of the conflict on Lemmy.World, though things have improved there. I’ve never seen censorship of Gaza reporting here at BeeHaw; I have a lot of admiration for @alyaza@beehaw.org who has beaten me to the post several times."
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
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      date: 2023-12-23 06:58:23.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2551}
  +body: """
    Lemmy.world hasn’t improved as far as I can tell. Or maybe their bias was even worse before I noticed.\n
    \n
    In any event, their entire instance is now blocked from my feeds, so I won’t have to deal with them.
    """
  +lang: "en"
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@alyaza@beehaw.org"
    "@CaptObvious@literature.cafe"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3236 …}
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  }
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    date: 2023-12-24 00:37:53.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2626
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2639 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2626
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2713 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +image: null
  +parent: null
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    This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
    \n
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    \n
    Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
    \n
    This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +image: null
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  +body: """
    This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
    \n
    Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
    \n
    Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
    \n
    This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
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      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
    \n
    Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
    \n
    Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
    \n
    This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3072
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
      \n
      Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
      \n
      Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
      \n
      This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
      """
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      date: 2023-12-23 06:30:55.0 +01:00
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700}
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    Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
    \n
    It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
    \n
    I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3072
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +body: """
      This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
      \n
      Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
      \n
      Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
      \n
      This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
      """
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      date: 2023-12-23 06:30:55.0 +01:00
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700}
  +body: """
    Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
    \n
    It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
    \n
    I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3072
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3073 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +image: null
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      This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
      \n
      Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
      \n
      Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
      \n
      This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
      """
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    Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
    \n
    It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
    \n
    I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3284
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700
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      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
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      +body: """
        This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
        \n
        Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
        \n
        Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
        \n
        This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
        """
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        date: 2023-12-23 06:30:55.0 +01:00
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700}
    +body: """
      Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
      \n
      It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
      \n
      I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
      """
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      "@andrewrgross@slrpnk.net"
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      date: 2023-12-24 06:52:20.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2700}
  +body: """
    I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
    \n
    Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
    \n
    The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
    \n
    Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
    \n
    Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
    \n
    Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
    """
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    "@Boff@beehaw.org"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3284
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
        \n
        Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
        \n
        Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
        \n
        This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
        """
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      Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
      \n
      It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
      \n
      I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
      """
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    I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
    \n
    Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
    \n
    The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
    \n
    Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
    \n
    Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
    \n
    Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
    """
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#3284
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      +body: """
        This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
        \n
        Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
        \n
        Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
        \n
        This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
        """
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      Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
      \n
      It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
      \n
      I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
      """
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    I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
    \n
    Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
    \n
    The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
    \n
    Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
    \n
    Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
    \n
    Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#3399
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    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3284
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    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3072
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        +image: null
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        +body: """
          This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
          \n
          Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
          \n
          Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
          \n
          This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
          """
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        Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
        \n
        It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
        \n
        I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
        """
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        date: 2023-12-24 06:52:20.0 +01:00
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      I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
      \n
      Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
      \n
      The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
      \n
      Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
      \n
      Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
      \n
      Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
      """
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    You should think a bit more about that “ladder” concept. In the same way that advocating for manumission doesn’t fix any of the issues with slavery a “path to the rights of the group above” doesn’t fix any of the issues with an apartheid state.\n
    \n
    Unless you’re fine with a little genocide, *any* apartheid state is not a solution.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3399
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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          This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
          \n
          Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
          \n
          Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
          \n
          This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
          """
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        Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
        \n
        It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
        \n
        I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
        """
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      I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
      \n
      Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
      \n
      The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
      \n
      Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
      \n
      Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
      \n
      Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
      """
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    You should think a bit more about that “ladder” concept. In the same way that advocating for manumission doesn’t fix any of the issues with slavery a “path to the rights of the group above” doesn’t fix any of the issues with an apartheid state.\n
    \n
    Unless you’re fine with a little genocide, *any* apartheid state is not a solution.
    """
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        +body: """
          This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
          \n
          Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
          \n
          Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
          \n
          This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
          """
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        Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
        \n
        It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
        \n
        I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
        """
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    +body: """
      I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
      \n
      Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
      \n
      The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
      \n
      Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
      \n
      Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
      \n
      Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
      """
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    You should think a bit more about that “ladder” concept. In the same way that advocating for manumission doesn’t fix any of the issues with slavery a “path to the rights of the group above” doesn’t fix any of the issues with an apartheid state.\n
    \n
    Unless you’re fine with a little genocide, *any* apartheid state is not a solution.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#3482
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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          +body: """
            This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
            \n
            Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
            \n
            Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
            \n
            This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
            """
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          Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
          \n
          It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
          \n
          I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
          """
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      +body: """
        I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
        \n
        Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
        \n
        The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
        \n
        Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
        \n
        Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
        \n
        Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
        """
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      You should think a bit more about that “ladder” concept. In the same way that advocating for manumission doesn’t fix any of the issues with slavery a “path to the rights of the group above” doesn’t fix any of the issues with an apartheid state.\n
      \n
      Unless you’re fine with a little genocide, *any* apartheid state is not a solution.
      """
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    I’m saying that the apartheid state needs dismantled.\n
    \n
    It’s just a mental exercise to get people to expand their imagination. I don’t expect the end of apartheid to literally require each group to pass through a series of stages.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3482
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    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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            This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
            \n
            Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
            \n
            Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
            \n
            This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
            """
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          Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
          \n
          It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
          \n
          I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
          """
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        I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
        \n
        Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
        \n
        The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
        \n
        Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
        \n
        Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
        \n
        Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
        """
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      You should think a bit more about that “ladder” concept. In the same way that advocating for manumission doesn’t fix any of the issues with slavery a “path to the rights of the group above” doesn’t fix any of the issues with an apartheid state.\n
      \n
      Unless you’re fine with a little genocide, *any* apartheid state is not a solution.
      """
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    I’m saying that the apartheid state needs dismantled.\n
    \n
    It’s just a mental exercise to get people to expand their imagination. I don’t expect the end of apartheid to literally require each group to pass through a series of stages.
    """
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#3482
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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          +body: """
            This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
            \n
            Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
            \n
            Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
            \n
            This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
            """
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          Honest question, what is Israel supposed to do? Give Hamas concessions? I think history shows that appeasement only emboldens terrorism. Back out now and let Hamas come back with even more local support?\n
          \n
          It’s a lose/lose. There is no winning for Israel. It seems that either Israel makes itself a pariah in the international community by killing countless innocent Palestinians or it lets terrorists win.\n
          \n
          I would love for you or someone to help me see a different way Israel can get back out of this.
          """
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      +body: """
        I’m going to answer in two parts.\n
        \n
        Part 1: I grew up a Zionist. In most versions, Zionism envisioned a peaceful, multi-ethnic state. In that sense, the zionist project is half-complete.\n
        \n
        The first half was accomplished by people who aspired to something that everyone said was madness, totally impossible, completely unfeasible, hopelessly unworkable. And they fucking did that thing.\n
        \n
        Now, anyone who considers themselves a Zionist needs to take on the responsibility for continuing that project with the sense of courage and insane vision that brought Israel into existence. ‘It’s too hard!’ ‘There are no good solutions!’ BULLSHIT. The whole country is founded on the idea that nothing is impossible, so let’s stop making excuses.\n
        \n
        Part 2: The biggest problem is Jewish radicals. Itmar Ben Givir of the Jewish Power Party, Bezalel Smotrich of the Religious Zionist Party, and Netanyahu of Likud. These are the primary leaders of a genocide, and Netanyahu’s special move for decades has been foreclosing peace. Step one is wanting peace, and step two is holding accountable the people who’ve never wanted it and always tried to keep it out of reach.\n
        \n
        Step three, I think, is to help every Palestinian climb what I think of as “the ladder”. Israel is an apartheid state. You’ve got Ashkenazi Jews at the top, and Mizrahi/Sphardeic Jews close but just below. Then you’ve got Palestinian Israelis, then a whole bunch of tiers of West Bank / East Jeruselum Palestinians, then Gazans / foreign refugees. Each group needs a path to the rights of the group above, and there has to be a roadmap to a roadmap to peace. And that is going to require international brokers. Israeli needs a government that isn’t hostile to the UN, and the US needs to reduce its involvement and stay the fuck out of the peace process.
        """
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      You should think a bit more about that “ladder” concept. In the same way that advocating for manumission doesn’t fix any of the issues with slavery a “path to the rights of the group above” doesn’t fix any of the issues with an apartheid state.\n
      \n
      Unless you’re fine with a little genocide, *any* apartheid state is not a solution.
      """
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    I’m saying that the apartheid state needs dismantled.\n
    \n
    It’s just a mental exercise to get people to expand their imagination. I don’t expect the end of apartheid to literally require each group to pass through a series of stages.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3088
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
      \n
      Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
      \n
      Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
      \n
      This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
      """
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    The US’s twenty years in Afghanistan should have taught the rest of the world the “forever wars” don’t work.\n
    \n
    But I suppose not.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3088
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
      \n
      Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
      \n
      Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
      \n
      This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
      """
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    The US’s twenty years in Afghanistan should have taught the rest of the world the “forever wars” don’t work.\n
    \n
    But I suppose not.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3088
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3089 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      This is devastating. And amidst so much debate over Israel’s right to defend itself, I feel it’s getting lost that this military campaign is only a success if measured by a set of goals even most Zionists would not recognize as productive.\n
      \n
      Will it make Israel safer? No, undoubtedly the war has cost international standing, strained the US-Israel relationship, and will inevitably radicalize far more extremists than are killed.\n
      \n
      Will it continue the right-ward shift of Israeli policy? Does it cut off avenues for peace and reconciliation and foster militant Israeli nationalism? Yes.\n
      \n
      This campaign is only a success if the primary objective is the eventual capture of the entire region at the cost of Israel’s safety (and the safety of Jews around the world) and Israel’s international standing. By any more conventional aims, it is an unmitigated disaster.
      """
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    The US’s twenty years in Afghanistan should have taught the rest of the world the “forever wars” don’t work.\n
    \n
    But I suppose not.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    > health officials said Friday.\n
    \n
    Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773
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  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    > health officials said Friday.\n
    \n
    Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773
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  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    > health officials said Friday.\n
    \n
    Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3105
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +image: null
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      > health officials said Friday.\n
      \n
      Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
      """
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    How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
    \n
    The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
    \n
    The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
    \n
    But keep up your propaganda, bro.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3105
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      > health officials said Friday.\n
      \n
      Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
      """
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    How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
    \n
    The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
    \n
    The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
    \n
    But keep up your propaganda, bro.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3105
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      > health officials said Friday.\n
      \n
      Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
      """
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  +body: """
    How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
    \n
    The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
    \n
    The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
    \n
    But keep up your propaganda, bro.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3251
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  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        > health officials said Friday.\n
        \n
        Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
        """
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      How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
      \n
      The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
      \n
      The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
      \n
      But keep up your propaganda, bro.
      """
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    Israel has not released any official numbers on dead Palestinians, which is why there hasn’t been anything disputed. The most we got was a number of dead Hamas commanders - which some people seriously tried to twist into “Israel only killed a few dozen Hamas members” - and a leaked, but unconfirmed estimate from an unnamed Israeli government official.\n
    \n
    > They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers\n
    \n
    The list included at least one person who died in 2014:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1718622126624645352](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1718622126624645352)\n
    \n
    The numbers published show ridiculous patterns, like days in which almost no man dies or when the number of dead women and children increase more than the total number of dead:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1731753062622982386](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1731753062622982386)\n
    \n
    Then there was the whole hospital parking lot incident, when Hamas made a claim that 500 people died in an air strike on a hospital with 85 beds and that the hospital had been flattened, only to then increase the number of dead to more than 700. Even during that night, it became apparent through footage published by Palestinians themselves that in reality, a rocket fired from Gaza at a city in Israel had malfunctioned and dropped on the area. After sunrise, it turned out that the hospital was still standing. Hamas officials later claimed, when asked about the projectile, that “the missile has dissolved like salt in the water. It’s vaporized. Nothing is left.”\n
    \n
    [nytimes.com/…/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/22/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html)\n
    \n
    Those 500, later reduced to 470, from this blast are *still* part of the official death toll. One has to assume that, given the pattern we have seen so far and the frequent tendency of Hamas officials to blame Israel for their own rockets and that of affiliated groups falling onto the strip (the failure rate is between 15 and 25%), that this kind of false reporting is common and routine, making the numbers released anything but reliable.\n
    \n
    > But keep up your propaganda, bro.\n
    \n
    Welcome to the post-information age, where obvious and transparent lies are being eaten up by well-meaning, but naive people and using the most basic critical thinking skills gets someone labeled as a propagandist. Seriously, you and so many others are eating up whatever Hamas says and it’s embarrassing. They are no different than ISIS, yet you didn’t do the same with any press releases made by that terror group. Why is that?
    """
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        > health officials said Friday.\n
        \n
        Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
        """
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    +body: """
      How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
      \n
      The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
      \n
      The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
      \n
      But keep up your propaganda, bro.
      """
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    Israel has not released any official numbers on dead Palestinians, which is why there hasn’t been anything disputed. The most we got was a number of dead Hamas commanders - which some people seriously tried to twist into “Israel only killed a few dozen Hamas members” - and a leaked, but unconfirmed estimate from an unnamed Israeli government official.\n
    \n
    > They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers\n
    \n
    The list included at least one person who died in 2014:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1718622126624645352](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1718622126624645352)\n
    \n
    The numbers published show ridiculous patterns, like days in which almost no man dies or when the number of dead women and children increase more than the total number of dead:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1731753062622982386](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1731753062622982386)\n
    \n
    Then there was the whole hospital parking lot incident, when Hamas made a claim that 500 people died in an air strike on a hospital with 85 beds and that the hospital had been flattened, only to then increase the number of dead to more than 700. Even during that night, it became apparent through footage published by Palestinians themselves that in reality, a rocket fired from Gaza at a city in Israel had malfunctioned and dropped on the area. After sunrise, it turned out that the hospital was still standing. Hamas officials later claimed, when asked about the projectile, that “the missile has dissolved like salt in the water. It’s vaporized. Nothing is left.”\n
    \n
    [nytimes.com/…/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/22/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html)\n
    \n
    Those 500, later reduced to 470, from this blast are *still* part of the official death toll. One has to assume that, given the pattern we have seen so far and the frequent tendency of Hamas officials to blame Israel for their own rockets and that of affiliated groups falling onto the strip (the failure rate is between 15 and 25%), that this kind of false reporting is common and routine, making the numbers released anything but reliable.\n
    \n
    > But keep up your propaganda, bro.\n
    \n
    Welcome to the post-information age, where obvious and transparent lies are being eaten up by well-meaning, but naive people and using the most basic critical thinking skills gets someone labeled as a propagandist. Seriously, you and so many others are eating up whatever Hamas says and it’s embarrassing. They are no different than ISIS, yet you didn’t do the same with any press releases made by that terror group. Why is that?
    """
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        > health officials said Friday.\n
        \n
        Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
        """
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      How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
      \n
      The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
      \n
      The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
      \n
      But keep up your propaganda, bro.
      """
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  +body: """
    Israel has not released any official numbers on dead Palestinians, which is why there hasn’t been anything disputed. The most we got was a number of dead Hamas commanders - which some people seriously tried to twist into “Israel only killed a few dozen Hamas members” - and a leaked, but unconfirmed estimate from an unnamed Israeli government official.\n
    \n
    > They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers\n
    \n
    The list included at least one person who died in 2014:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1718622126624645352](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1718622126624645352)\n
    \n
    The numbers published show ridiculous patterns, like days in which almost no man dies or when the number of dead women and children increase more than the total number of dead:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1731753062622982386](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1731753062622982386)\n
    \n
    Then there was the whole hospital parking lot incident, when Hamas made a claim that 500 people died in an air strike on a hospital with 85 beds and that the hospital had been flattened, only to then increase the number of dead to more than 700. Even during that night, it became apparent through footage published by Palestinians themselves that in reality, a rocket fired from Gaza at a city in Israel had malfunctioned and dropped on the area. After sunrise, it turned out that the hospital was still standing. Hamas officials later claimed, when asked about the projectile, that “the missile has dissolved like salt in the water. It’s vaporized. Nothing is left.”\n
    \n
    [nytimes.com/…/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/22/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html)\n
    \n
    Those 500, later reduced to 470, from this blast are *still* part of the official death toll. One has to assume that, given the pattern we have seen so far and the frequent tendency of Hamas officials to blame Israel for their own rockets and that of affiliated groups falling onto the strip (the failure rate is between 15 and 25%), that this kind of false reporting is common and routine, making the numbers released anything but reliable.\n
    \n
    > But keep up your propaganda, bro.\n
    \n
    Welcome to the post-information age, where obvious and transparent lies are being eaten up by well-meaning, but naive people and using the most basic critical thinking skills gets someone labeled as a propagandist. Seriously, you and so many others are eating up whatever Hamas says and it’s embarrassing. They are no different than ISIS, yet you didn’t do the same with any press releases made by that terror group. Why is that?
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
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      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        > health officials said Friday.\n
        \n
        Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
        """
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      How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
      \n
      The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
      \n
      The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
      \n
      But keep up your propaganda, bro.
      """
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    Israel has not released any official numbers on dead Palestinians, which is why there hasn’t been anything disputed. The most we got was a number of dead Hamas commanders - which some people seriously tried to twist into “Israel only killed a few dozen Hamas members” - and a leaked, but unconfirmed estimate from an unnamed Israeli government official.\n
    \n
    > They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers\n
    \n
    The list included at least one person who died in 2014:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1718622126624645352](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1718622126624645352)\n
    \n
    The numbers published show ridiculous patterns, like days in which almost no man dies or when the number of dead women and children increase more than the total number of dead:\n
    \n
    [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1731753062622982386](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1731753062622982386)\n
    \n
    Then there was the whole hospital parking lot incident, when Hamas made a claim that 500 people died in an air strike on a hospital with 85 beds and that the hospital had been flattened, only to then increase the number of dead to more than 700. Even during that night, it became apparent through footage published by Palestinians themselves that in reality, a rocket fired from Gaza at a city in Israel had malfunctioned and dropped on the area. After sunrise, it turned out that the hospital was still standing. Hamas officials later claimed, when asked about the projectile, that “the missile has dissolved like salt in the water. It’s vaporized. Nothing is left.”\n
    \n
    [nytimes.com/…/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/22/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html)\n
    \n
    Those 500, later reduced to 470, from this blast are *still* part of the official death toll. One has to assume that, given the pattern we have seen so far and the frequent tendency of Hamas officials to blame Israel for their own rockets and that of affiliated groups falling onto the strip (the failure rate is between 15 and 25%), that this kind of false reporting is common and routine, making the numbers released anything but reliable.\n
    \n
    > But keep up your propaganda, bro.\n
    \n
    Welcome to the post-information age, where obvious and transparent lies are being eaten up by well-meaning, but naive people and using the most basic critical thinking skills gets someone labeled as a propagandist. Seriously, you and so many others are eating up whatever Hamas says and it’s embarrassing. They are no different than ISIS, yet you didn’t do the same with any press releases made by that terror group. Why is that?
    """
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      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
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          > health officials said Friday.\n
          \n
          Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
          """
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        How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
        \n
        The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
        \n
        The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
        \n
        But keep up your propaganda, bro.
        """
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      Israel has not released any official numbers on dead Palestinians, which is why there hasn’t been anything disputed. The most we got was a number of dead Hamas commanders - which some people seriously tried to twist into “Israel only killed a few dozen Hamas members” - and a leaked, but unconfirmed estimate from an unnamed Israeli government official.\n
      \n
      > They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers\n
      \n
      The list included at least one person who died in 2014:\n
      \n
      [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1718622126624645352](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1718622126624645352)\n
      \n
      The numbers published show ridiculous patterns, like days in which almost no man dies or when the number of dead women and children increase more than the total number of dead:\n
      \n
      [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1731753062622982386](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1731753062622982386)\n
      \n
      Then there was the whole hospital parking lot incident, when Hamas made a claim that 500 people died in an air strike on a hospital with 85 beds and that the hospital had been flattened, only to then increase the number of dead to more than 700. Even during that night, it became apparent through footage published by Palestinians themselves that in reality, a rocket fired from Gaza at a city in Israel had malfunctioned and dropped on the area. After sunrise, it turned out that the hospital was still standing. Hamas officials later claimed, when asked about the projectile, that “the missile has dissolved like salt in the water. It’s vaporized. Nothing is left.”\n
      \n
      [nytimes.com/…/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/22/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html)\n
      \n
      Those 500, later reduced to 470, from this blast are *still* part of the official death toll. One has to assume that, given the pattern we have seen so far and the frequent tendency of Hamas officials to blame Israel for their own rockets and that of affiliated groups falling onto the strip (the failure rate is between 15 and 25%), that this kind of false reporting is common and routine, making the numbers released anything but reliable.\n
      \n
      > But keep up your propaganda, bro.\n
      \n
      Welcome to the post-information age, where obvious and transparent lies are being eaten up by well-meaning, but naive people and using the most basic critical thinking skills gets someone labeled as a propagandist. Seriously, you and so many others are eating up whatever Hamas says and it’s embarrassing. They are no different than ISIS, yet you didn’t do the same with any press releases made by that terror group. Why is that?
      """
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    You continuously link to conspiracy sites and random parties social media posts. Your evidence is a joke.\n
    \n
    Show me an actual source from an organization that works in Gaza, saying the numbers are falsified, not another Israel apologist cooking numbers on Twitter.\n
    \n
    You make a claim, that the Health Ministry is including the Al-Shifa numbers in their data currently, without citation, and use that claim to extrapolate that any numbers must all be false.\n
    \n
    And again, your only argument is, “it’s Hamas and you’re eating it up!”.\n
    \n
    Israel has released plenty of numbers of persons killed throughout the conflict, both on their and on Hamas’ sides.
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3384
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3105
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      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773
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        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          > health officials said Friday.\n
          \n
          Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
          """
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        ]
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          date: 2023-12-23 08:59:10.0 +01:00
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      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
      +body: """
        How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
        \n
        The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
        \n
        The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
        \n
        But keep up your propaganda, bro.
        """
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
    +body: """
      Israel has not released any official numbers on dead Palestinians, which is why there hasn’t been anything disputed. The most we got was a number of dead Hamas commanders - which some people seriously tried to twist into “Israel only killed a few dozen Hamas members” - and a leaked, but unconfirmed estimate from an unnamed Israeli government official.\n
      \n
      > They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers\n
      \n
      The list included at least one person who died in 2014:\n
      \n
      [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1718622126624645352](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1718622126624645352)\n
      \n
      The numbers published show ridiculous patterns, like days in which almost no man dies or when the number of dead women and children increase more than the total number of dead:\n
      \n
      [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1731753062622982386](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1731753062622982386)\n
      \n
      Then there was the whole hospital parking lot incident, when Hamas made a claim that 500 people died in an air strike on a hospital with 85 beds and that the hospital had been flattened, only to then increase the number of dead to more than 700. Even during that night, it became apparent through footage published by Palestinians themselves that in reality, a rocket fired from Gaza at a city in Israel had malfunctioned and dropped on the area. After sunrise, it turned out that the hospital was still standing. Hamas officials later claimed, when asked about the projectile, that “the missile has dissolved like salt in the water. It’s vaporized. Nothing is left.”\n
      \n
      [nytimes.com/…/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/22/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html)\n
      \n
      Those 500, later reduced to 470, from this blast are *still* part of the official death toll. One has to assume that, given the pattern we have seen so far and the frequent tendency of Hamas officials to blame Israel for their own rockets and that of affiliated groups falling onto the strip (the failure rate is between 15 and 25%), that this kind of false reporting is common and routine, making the numbers released anything but reliable.\n
      \n
      > But keep up your propaganda, bro.\n
      \n
      Welcome to the post-information age, where obvious and transparent lies are being eaten up by well-meaning, but naive people and using the most basic critical thinking skills gets someone labeled as a propagandist. Seriously, you and so many others are eating up whatever Hamas says and it’s embarrassing. They are no different than ISIS, yet you didn’t do the same with any press releases made by that terror group. Why is that?
      """
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      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: """
    You continuously link to conspiracy sites and random parties social media posts. Your evidence is a joke.\n
    \n
    Show me an actual source from an organization that works in Gaza, saying the numbers are falsified, not another Israel apologist cooking numbers on Twitter.\n
    \n
    You make a claim, that the Health Ministry is including the Al-Shifa numbers in their data currently, without citation, and use that claim to extrapolate that any numbers must all be false.\n
    \n
    And again, your only argument is, “it’s Hamas and you’re eating it up!”.\n
    \n
    Israel has released plenty of numbers of persons killed throughout the conflict, both on their and on Hamas’ sides.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3384
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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        +body: """
          > health officials said Friday.\n
          \n
          Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
          """
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      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
      +body: """
        How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
        \n
        The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
        \n
        The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
        \n
        But keep up your propaganda, bro.
        """
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    +body: """
      Israel has not released any official numbers on dead Palestinians, which is why there hasn’t been anything disputed. The most we got was a number of dead Hamas commanders - which some people seriously tried to twist into “Israel only killed a few dozen Hamas members” - and a leaked, but unconfirmed estimate from an unnamed Israeli government official.\n
      \n
      > They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers\n
      \n
      The list included at least one person who died in 2014:\n
      \n
      [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1718622126624645352](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1718622126624645352)\n
      \n
      The numbers published show ridiculous patterns, like days in which almost no man dies or when the number of dead women and children increase more than the total number of dead:\n
      \n
      [nitter.net/Aizenberg55/…/1731753062622982386](https://nitter.net/Aizenberg55/status/1731753062622982386)\n
      \n
      Then there was the whole hospital parking lot incident, when Hamas made a claim that 500 people died in an air strike on a hospital with 85 beds and that the hospital had been flattened, only to then increase the number of dead to more than 700. Even during that night, it became apparent through footage published by Palestinians themselves that in reality, a rocket fired from Gaza at a city in Israel had malfunctioned and dropped on the area. After sunrise, it turned out that the hospital was still standing. Hamas officials later claimed, when asked about the projectile, that “the missile has dissolved like salt in the water. It’s vaporized. Nothing is left.”\n
      \n
      [nytimes.com/…/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/22/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hospital-evidence.html)\n
      \n
      Those 500, later reduced to 470, from this blast are *still* part of the official death toll. One has to assume that, given the pattern we have seen so far and the frequent tendency of Hamas officials to blame Israel for their own rockets and that of affiliated groups falling onto the strip (the failure rate is between 15 and 25%), that this kind of false reporting is common and routine, making the numbers released anything but reliable.\n
      \n
      > But keep up your propaganda, bro.\n
      \n
      Welcome to the post-information age, where obvious and transparent lies are being eaten up by well-meaning, but naive people and using the most basic critical thinking skills gets someone labeled as a propagandist. Seriously, you and so many others are eating up whatever Hamas says and it’s embarrassing. They are no different than ISIS, yet you didn’t do the same with any press releases made by that terror group. Why is that?
      """
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  +body: """
    You continuously link to conspiracy sites and random parties social media posts. Your evidence is a joke.\n
    \n
    Show me an actual source from an organization that works in Gaza, saying the numbers are falsified, not another Israel apologist cooking numbers on Twitter.\n
    \n
    You make a claim, that the Health Ministry is including the Al-Shifa numbers in their data currently, without citation, and use that claim to extrapolate that any numbers must all be false.\n
    \n
    And again, your only argument is, “it’s Hamas and you’re eating it up!”.\n
    \n
    Israel has released plenty of numbers of persons killed throughout the conflict, both on their and on Hamas’ sides.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3267
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3268 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
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      +body: """
        > health officials said Friday.\n
        \n
        Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
        """
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    +body: """
      How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
      \n
      The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
      \n
      The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
      \n
      But keep up your propaganda, bro.
      """
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      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
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      date: 2023-12-23 09:20:51.0 +01:00
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: """
    In October the Gaza Health Ministry claimed 471 people were killed by an Israeli missile strike on a hospital. Widespread credible (independent) evidence proves a small Hamas rocket missfired and hit a carpark near the hospital, causing relatively minor damage (there was a large fireball, but it was mostly rocket fuel - which is far less damaging than an explosive payload intended to kill).\n
    \n
    None of the credible evidence was able to put a number to the deaths in that accident but it’s highly improbable that 471 people were in the carpark. And it definitely wasn’t an Israeli rocket.\n
    \n
    In other words - Gaza’s health ministry is not a reliable source. Some of the things they report are probably accurate but they have been proven to be unreliable. Don’t trust anything they say unless it’s been backed by someone more reliable (in which case, you might as well refer to the other source instead).\n
    \n
    At best, the ministry failed verify facts (e.g. was a large missile even fired at all?) before reporting what happened. But I think that’s being too charitable. For example where did they get the 471 number from? I think they made it up. I don’t have proof but it’s the only believable explanation.\n
    \n
    Worse though - they haven’t retracted the claim. Mistakes are understandable… but failing to admit someone in your organisation made a mistake is unacceptable.
    """
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    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3267
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3268 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
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      +body: """
        > health officials said Friday.\n
        \n
        Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
        """
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        date: 2023-12-23 08:59:10.0 +01:00
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    +body: """
      How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
      \n
      The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
      \n
      The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
      \n
      But keep up your propaganda, bro.
      """
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
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      date: 2023-12-23 09:20:51.0 +01:00
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: """
    In October the Gaza Health Ministry claimed 471 people were killed by an Israeli missile strike on a hospital. Widespread credible (independent) evidence proves a small Hamas rocket missfired and hit a carpark near the hospital, causing relatively minor damage (there was a large fireball, but it was mostly rocket fuel - which is far less damaging than an explosive payload intended to kill).\n
    \n
    None of the credible evidence was able to put a number to the deaths in that accident but it’s highly improbable that 471 people were in the carpark. And it definitely wasn’t an Israeli rocket.\n
    \n
    In other words - Gaza’s health ministry is not a reliable source. Some of the things they report are probably accurate but they have been proven to be unreliable. Don’t trust anything they say unless it’s been backed by someone more reliable (in which case, you might as well refer to the other source instead).\n
    \n
    At best, the ministry failed verify facts (e.g. was a large missile even fired at all?) before reporting what happened. But I think that’s being too charitable. For example where did they get the 471 number from? I think they made it up. I don’t have proof but it’s the only believable explanation.\n
    \n
    Worse though - they haven’t retracted the claim. Mistakes are understandable… but failing to admit someone in your organisation made a mistake is unacceptable.
    """
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    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3267
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
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    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
      +image: null
      +parent: null
      +root: null
      +body: """
        > health officials said Friday.\n
        \n
        Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
        """
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        date: 2023-12-23 08:59:10.0 +01:00
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    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
    +body: """
      How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
      \n
      The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
      \n
      The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
      \n
      But keep up your propaganda, bro.
      """
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    ]
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      date: 2023-12-23 09:20:51.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: """
    In October the Gaza Health Ministry claimed 471 people were killed by an Israeli missile strike on a hospital. Widespread credible (independent) evidence proves a small Hamas rocket missfired and hit a carpark near the hospital, causing relatively minor damage (there was a large fireball, but it was mostly rocket fuel - which is far less damaging than an explosive payload intended to kill).\n
    \n
    None of the credible evidence was able to put a number to the deaths in that accident but it’s highly improbable that 471 people were in the carpark. And it definitely wasn’t an Israeli rocket.\n
    \n
    In other words - Gaza’s health ministry is not a reliable source. Some of the things they report are probably accurate but they have been proven to be unreliable. Don’t trust anything they say unless it’s been backed by someone more reliable (in which case, you might as well refer to the other source instead).\n
    \n
    At best, the ministry failed verify facts (e.g. was a large missile even fired at all?) before reporting what happened. But I think that’s being too charitable. For example where did they get the 471 number from? I think they made it up. I don’t have proof but it’s the only believable explanation.\n
    \n
    Worse though - they haven’t retracted the claim. Mistakes are understandable… but failing to admit someone in your organisation made a mistake is unacceptable.
    """
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3415
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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          > health officials said Friday.\n
          \n
          Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
          """
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      +body: """
        How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
        \n
        The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
        \n
        The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
        \n
        But keep up your propaganda, bro.
        """
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
    +body: """
      In October the Gaza Health Ministry claimed 471 people were killed by an Israeli missile strike on a hospital. Widespread credible (independent) evidence proves a small Hamas rocket missfired and hit a carpark near the hospital, causing relatively minor damage (there was a large fireball, but it was mostly rocket fuel - which is far less damaging than an explosive payload intended to kill).\n
      \n
      None of the credible evidence was able to put a number to the deaths in that accident but it’s highly improbable that 471 people were in the carpark. And it definitely wasn’t an Israeli rocket.\n
      \n
      In other words - Gaza’s health ministry is not a reliable source. Some of the things they report are probably accurate but they have been proven to be unreliable. Don’t trust anything they say unless it’s been backed by someone more reliable (in which case, you might as well refer to the other source instead).\n
      \n
      At best, the ministry failed verify facts (e.g. was a large missile even fired at all?) before reporting what happened. But I think that’s being too charitable. For example where did they get the 471 number from? I think they made it up. I don’t have proof but it’s the only believable explanation.\n
      \n
      Worse though - they haven’t retracted the claim. Mistakes are understandable… but failing to admit someone in your organisation made a mistake is unacceptable.
      """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3415
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    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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          > health officials said Friday.\n
          \n
          Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
          """
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      +body: """
        How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
        \n
        The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
        \n
        The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
        \n
        But keep up your propaganda, bro.
        """
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    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
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      In October the Gaza Health Ministry claimed 471 people were killed by an Israeli missile strike on a hospital. Widespread credible (independent) evidence proves a small Hamas rocket missfired and hit a carpark near the hospital, causing relatively minor damage (there was a large fireball, but it was mostly rocket fuel - which is far less damaging than an explosive payload intended to kill).\n
      \n
      None of the credible evidence was able to put a number to the deaths in that accident but it’s highly improbable that 471 people were in the carpark. And it definitely wasn’t an Israeli rocket.\n
      \n
      In other words - Gaza’s health ministry is not a reliable source. Some of the things they report are probably accurate but they have been proven to be unreliable. Don’t trust anything they say unless it’s been backed by someone more reliable (in which case, you might as well refer to the other source instead).\n
      \n
      At best, the ministry failed verify facts (e.g. was a large missile even fired at all?) before reporting what happened. But I think that’s being too charitable. For example where did they get the 471 number from? I think they made it up. I don’t have proof but it’s the only believable explanation.\n
      \n
      Worse though - they haven’t retracted the claim. Mistakes are understandable… but failing to admit someone in your organisation made a mistake is unacceptable.
      """
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: "And these credible independent sources are…? You’ll forgive me if I don’t take your word for it."
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3415
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3267
    +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3268 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#3105
      +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#3106 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
      +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
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      +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773
        +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
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        +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
        +image: null
        +parent: null
        +root: null
        +body: """
          > health officials said Friday.\n
          \n
          Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
          """
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        }
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          "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        ]
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          date: 2023-12-23 08:59:10.0 +01:00
        }
      }
      +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
      +body: """
        How I hate the lazy deflection and caping for Israel in your comments.\n
        \n
        The Gaza Health Ministry is considered to be reliable for casualty reporting due to independent verification by groups that monitor the conflict like Human Rights Watch and the UN. They release specific casualty data including names, ages, and ID numbers.\n
        \n
        The only argument that Israel or their allies have used against their released casualty numbers is that they’re run by Hamas (the Gaza government), but oddly those people, yourself included, never seem to dispute Israeli numbers for the same reason.\n
        \n
        But keep up your propaganda, bro.
        """
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        "@Five@slrpnk.net"
        "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      ]
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        date: 2024-02-01 21:09:25.0 +01:00
      }
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        date: 2023-12-23 09:20:51.0 +01:00
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    }
    +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
    +body: """
      In October the Gaza Health Ministry claimed 471 people were killed by an Israeli missile strike on a hospital. Widespread credible (independent) evidence proves a small Hamas rocket missfired and hit a carpark near the hospital, causing relatively minor damage (there was a large fireball, but it was mostly rocket fuel - which is far less damaging than an explosive payload intended to kill).\n
      \n
      None of the credible evidence was able to put a number to the deaths in that accident but it’s highly improbable that 471 people were in the carpark. And it definitely wasn’t an Israeli rocket.\n
      \n
      In other words - Gaza’s health ministry is not a reliable source. Some of the things they report are probably accurate but they have been proven to be unreliable. Don’t trust anything they say unless it’s been backed by someone more reliable (in which case, you might as well refer to the other source instead).\n
      \n
      At best, the ministry failed verify facts (e.g. was a large missile even fired at all?) before reporting what happened. But I think that’s being too charitable. For example where did they get the 471 number from? I think they made it up. I don’t have proof but it’s the only believable explanation.\n
      \n
      Worse though - they haven’t retracted the claim. Mistakes are understandable… but failing to admit someone in your organisation made a mistake is unacceptable.
      """
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
      "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
      "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    ]
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      date: 2024-02-08 02:28:08.0 +01:00
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      date: 2023-12-24 08:35:47.0 +01:00
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: "And these credible independent sources are…? You’ll forgive me if I don’t take your word for it."
  +lang: "en"
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    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
    "@t3rmit3@beehaw.org"
    "@abhibeckert@beehaw.org"
  ]
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  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3121
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
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  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: """
      > health officials said Friday.\n
      \n
      Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: """
    Hamas is the government in Gaza. Who else *would* run their health ministry? Israel obviously doesn’t give a damn about them.\n
    \n
    How I hate the lazy trolling on this conflict.
    """
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3121
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
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    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: """
      > health officials said Friday.\n
      \n
      Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
      """
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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    +score: 0
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
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    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2774 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2776 …}
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    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2780 …}
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703318350 {#2769
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  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2773}
  +body: """
    Hamas is the government in Gaza. Who else *would* run their health ministry? Israel obviously doesn’t give a damn about them.\n
    \n
    How I hate the lazy trolling on this conflict.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
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  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703374280 {#3119
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  }
  +ip: null
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    "@Five@slrpnk.net"
    "@DdCno1@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3122 …}
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3121
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2565 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +image: null
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    +user: App\Entity\User {#2011 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2552 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: """
      > health officials said Friday.\n
      \n
      Hamas health officials. How I hate the lazy reporting on this conflict.
      """
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      "@Five@slrpnk.net"
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  +body: """
    Hamas is the government in Gaza. Who else *would* run their health ministry? Israel obviously doesn’t give a damn about them.\n
    \n
    How I hate the lazy trolling on this conflict.
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2788
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2802 …}
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  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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    +tags: null
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2788
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2802 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2789 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2788
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2802 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2789 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2862
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2876 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2863 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
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      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
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      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
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      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#2862
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
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    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
null
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3136
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    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2862}
  +body: """
    [Julian Assange’s forthcoming hearings and what they could mean for his freedom](https://www.pressenza.com/2023/12/julian-assanges-forthcoming-hearings-and-what-they-could-mean-for-his-freedom/)\n
    \n
    > The announcement of what could be Julian Assange’s final hearings – on 20 and 21 February before the British High Court – has sparked a flurry of speculation about what could be the final fate of the now 52-year-old Australian journalist and publisher, who has been imprisoned in London for four years while awaiting extradition to the United States where 175 years of supermax almost certainly await him.\n
    \n
    > But how is it possible that Assange can be jailed for 175 years, just for doing what any responsible journalist and editor should always do – that is, disclose war crimes and other wrongdoings he or she learns about by way of spontaneous witnesses? Especially since the US Supreme Court ruled in 1971 that it is permissible to reveal state secrets if it is in the public interest to do so?
    """
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3136
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  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2863 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
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    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
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  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2862
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2876 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2863 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: "Ehm… what about Julian Assange himself?"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
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    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1707399411 {#2857
      date: 2024-02-08 14:36:51.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2864 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2866 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2868 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2870 …}
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    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2874 …}
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    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703354521 {#2858
      date: 2023-12-23 19:02:01.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2862}
  +body: """
    [Julian Assange’s forthcoming hearings and what they could mean for his freedom](https://www.pressenza.com/2023/12/julian-assanges-forthcoming-hearings-and-what-they-could-mean-for-his-freedom/)\n
    \n
    > The announcement of what could be Julian Assange’s final hearings – on 20 and 21 February before the British High Court – has sparked a flurry of speculation about what could be the final fate of the now 52-year-old Australian journalist and publisher, who has been imprisoned in London for four years while awaiting extradition to the United States where 175 years of supermax almost certainly await him.\n
    \n
    > But how is it possible that Assange can be jailed for 175 years, just for doing what any responsible journalist and editor should always do – that is, disclose war crimes and other wrongdoings he or she learns about by way of spontaneous witnesses? Especially since the US Supreme Court ruled in 1971 that it is permissible to reveal state secrets if it is in the public interest to do so?
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 0
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703413744 {#3134
    date: 2023-12-24 11:29:04.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    "@black_mouflon@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3137 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3139 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3141 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3143 …}
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  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3147 …}
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  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1905517"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703413744 {#3135
    date: 2023-12-24 11:29:04.0 +01:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\EntryComment {#3136
  +user: App\Entity\User {#2329 …}
  +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2863 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
    +name: "news@beehaw.org"
    +title: "news"
    +description: """
      Breaking news from around the world.\n
      \n
      News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
      \n
      - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
          - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
      - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
      - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
      - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
      \n
      These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
      \n
      ---\n
      \n
      This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 1
    +entryCount: 579
    +entryCommentCount: 3849
    +postCount: 0
    +postCommentCount: 0
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
      date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#241 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#144 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
    +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
    -id: 36
    +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
    +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
    +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
    +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
    +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
    +apPreferredUsername: "news"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
      date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
      date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2862
    +user: App\Entity\User {#2876 …}
    +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#2863 …}
    +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#306}
    +image: null
    +parent: null
    +root: null
    +body: "Ehm… what about Julian Assange himself?"
    +lang: "en"
    +isAdult: false
    +favouriteCount: 1
    +score: 0
    +lastActive: DateTime @1707399411 {#2857
      date: 2024-02-08 14:36:51.0 +01:00
    }
    +ip: null
    +tags: null
    +mentions: [
      "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    ]
    +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2864 …}
    +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2866 …}
    +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2868 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2870 …}
    +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2872 …}
    +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2874 …}
    -id: 246433
    -bodyTs: "'assang':5 'ehm':1 'julian':4"
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    +visibility: "visible             "
    +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1903929"
    +editedAt: null
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703354521 {#2858
      date: 2023-12-23 19:02:01.0 +01:00
    }
  }
  +root: App\Entity\EntryComment {#2862}
  +body: """
    [Julian Assange’s forthcoming hearings and what they could mean for his freedom](https://www.pressenza.com/2023/12/julian-assanges-forthcoming-hearings-and-what-they-could-mean-for-his-freedom/)\n
    \n
    > The announcement of what could be Julian Assange’s final hearings – on 20 and 21 February before the British High Court – has sparked a flurry of speculation about what could be the final fate of the now 52-year-old Australian journalist and publisher, who has been imprisoned in London for four years while awaiting extradition to the United States where 175 years of supermax almost certainly await him.\n
    \n
    > But how is it possible that Assange can be jailed for 175 years, just for doing what any responsible journalist and editor should always do – that is, disclose war crimes and other wrongdoings he or she learns about by way of spontaneous witnesses? Especially since the US Supreme Court ruled in 1971 that it is permissible to reveal state secrets if it is in the public interest to do so?
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 0
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1703413744 {#3134
    date: 2023-12-24 11:29:04.0 +01:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@tardigrada@beehaw.org"
    "@black_mouflon@beehaw.org"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3137 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3139 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3141 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3143 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3145 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#3147 …}
  -id: 248276
  -bodyTs: "'/2023/12/julian-assanges-forthcoming-hearings-and-what-they-could-mean-for-his-freedom/)':16 '175':79,98 '1971':138 '20':29 '21':31 '52':54 'almost':83 'alway':110 'announc':18 'assang':2,24,93 'australian':58 'await':72,85 'british':35 'certain':84 'could':9,21,46 'court':37,135 'crime':116 'disclos':114 'editor':108 'especi':130 'extradit':73 'fate':50 'februari':32 'final':26,49 'flurri':41 'forthcom':4 'four':69 'freedom':13 'hear':5,27 'high':36 'imprison':65 'interest':153 'jail':96 'journalist':59,106 'julian':1,23 'learn':123 'london':67 'mean':10 'old':57 'permiss':142 'possibl':91 'public':152 'publish':61 'respons':105 'reveal':144 'rule':136 'secret':146 'sinc':131 'spark':39 'specul':43 'spontan':128 'state':77,145 'supermax':82 'suprem':134 'unit':76 'us':133 'war':115 'way':126 'wit':129 'wrongdo':119 'www.pressenza.com':15 'www.pressenza.com/2023/12/julian-assanges-forthcoming-hearings-and-what-they-could-mean-for-his-freedom/)':14 'year':56,70,80,99 'year-old':55"
  +ranking: 0
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  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://beehaw.org/comment/1905517"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1703413744 {#3135
    date: 2023-12-24 11:29:04.0 +01:00
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}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
App\Entity\Magazine {#306
  +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#287 …}
  +name: "news@beehaw.org"
  +title: "news"
  +description: """
    Breaking news from around the world.\n
    \n
    News that is American but has an international facet may also be posted here.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    ##### Guidelines for submissions:\n
    \n
    - Where possible, post the original source of information. \n
        - If there is a paywall, you can use alternative sources or provide an archive.today, 12ft.io, etc. link in the body.\n
    - Do not editorialize titles. Preserve the original title when possible; edits for clarity are fine.\n
    - Do not post ragebait or shock stories. These will be removed.\n
    - Do not post tabloid or blogspam stories. These will be removed.\n
    - Social media should be a source of last resort.\n
    \n
    These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    For US News, see the [US News](https://beehaw.org/c/usnews) community.\n
    \n
    ---\n
    \n
    This community’s icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the [CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/).
    """
  +rules: null
  +subscriptionsCount: 1
  +entryCount: 579
  +entryCommentCount: 3849
  +postCount: 0
  +postCommentCount: 0
  +isAdult: false
  +customCss: null
  +lastActive: DateTime @1729562937 {#314
    date: 2024-10-22 04:08:57.0 +02:00
  }
  +markedForDeletionAt: null
  +tags: null
  +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#278 …}
  +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#274 …}
  +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#263 …}
  +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#221 …}
  +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#179 …}
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  +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#158 …}
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  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#122 …}
  +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#112 …}
  +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#101 …}
  +categories: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#88 …}
  -id: 36
  +apId: "news@beehaw.org"
  +apProfileId: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
  +apPublicUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news"
  +apFollowersUrl: "https://beehaw.org/c/news/followers"
  +apInboxUrl: "https://beehaw.org/inbox"
  +apDomain: "beehaw.org"
  +apPreferredUsername: "news"
  +apDiscoverable: true
  +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
  +privateKey: null
  +publicKey: null
  +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1729580679 {#315
    date: 2024-10-22 09:04:39.0 +02:00
  }
  +apDeletedAt: null
  +apTimeoutAt: null
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1696204467 {#309
    date: 2023-10-02 01:54:27.0 +02:00
  }
}
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"

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