GET https://kbin.spritesserver.nl/index.php/m/asklemmy@lemmy.ml/t/1418/How-do-I-learn-to-detect-logical-fallacies-in-a/comment/21563/votes/down

Response
200 OK
IP
216.73.216.148
Profiled on
Token
9003e8

Security

Token

There is no security token.

Firewall

main Name
Security enabled
Stateless

Configuration

Key Value
provider security.user.provider.concrete.app_user_provider
context main
entry_point App\Security\KbinAuthenticator
user_checker App\Security\UserChecker
access_denied_handler (none)
access_denied_url (none)
authenticators 
[
  "two_factor"
  "remember_me"
  "App\Security\KbinAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\FacebookAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GoogleAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GithubAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\KeycloakAuthenticator"
]

Listeners

Listener Duration Response 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ChannelListener {#723
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -httpPort: 80
  -httpsPort: 443
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ContextListener {#706
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\TokenStorage {#1017 …}
  -sessionKey: "_security_main"
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -userProviders: Symfony\Component\DependencyInjection\Argument\RewindableGenerator {#705 …}
  -dispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
  -registered: false
  -trustResolver: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authentication\AuthenticationTrustResolver {#780 …}
  -sessionTrackerEnabler: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage::enableUsageTracking(): void {#703 …}
}
 0.89 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AuthenticatorManagerListener {#584
  -authenticatorManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Authentication\AuthenticatorManager {#595 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Http\Firewall\TwoFactorAccessListener {#582
  -twoFactorFirewallConfig: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\TwoFactor\TwoFactorFirewallConfig {#842 …}
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -twoFactorAccessDecider: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\TwoFactorAccessDecider {#581 …}
}
 0.05 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AccessListener {#579
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -accessDecisionManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\TraceableAccessDecisionManager {#937 …}
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\LogoutListener {#786
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -options: [
    "csrf_parameter" => "_csrf_token"
    "csrf_token_id" => "logout"
    "logout_path" => "app_logout"
  ]
  -httpUtils: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\HttpUtils {#841 …}
  -csrfTokenManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Csrf\CsrfTokenManager {#1015 …}
  -eventDispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none)

Authenticators

No authenticators have been recorded. Check previous profiles on your authentication endpoint.

Access Decision

affirmative Strategy
# Voter class
1 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\AuthenticatedVoter"
2 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
3 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
4 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\ExpressionVoter"
5 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
6 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
7 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
8 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
9 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
10 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
11 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
12 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
13 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
14 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"

Access decision log

# Result Attributes Object
1 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
2 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1365
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1371 …}
  +entry: App\Entity\Entry {#1805 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#311
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#292 …}
    +name: "asklemmy@lemmy.ml"
    +title: "asklemmy"
    +description: """
      A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions\n
      \n
      **[Search asklemmy](https://lemmy.ml/search?q=&type=Posts&listingType=All&communityId=8&page=1&sort=TopAll) 🔍**\n
      \n
      If your post meets the following criteria, it’s welcome here!\n
      \n
      1. Open-ended\n
      2. Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions\n
      3. **Not regarding using or support for Lemmy**: [context](https://lemmy.ml/post/1223478), find help in the list of support alternatives below\n
      4. Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members\n
      5. [An actual topic of discussion](https://lemmy.ml/post/1239589)\n
      \n
      Support alternatives:\n
      \n
      - [!lemmy_support@lemmy.ml](https://lemmy.ml/c/lemmy_support)\n
      - [!nostupidlemmyquestions@lemmy.dbzer0.com](https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/c/nostupidlemmyquestions)\n
      - [!selfhosted@lemmy.world](https://lemmy.world/c/selfhosted)\n
      \n
      ~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
      """
    +rules: null
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      date: 2023-07-19 08:31:44.0 +02:00
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    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#283 …}
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    +apPreferredUsername: "asklemmy"
    +apDiscoverable: true
    +apManuallyApprovesFollowers: null
    +privateKey: null
    +publicKey: null
    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1689747596 {#320
      date: 2023-07-19 08:19:56.0 +02:00
    }
    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1686889707 {#314
      date: 2023-06-16 06:28:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    Logical fallacies don’t necessarily disagree with facts. While the most common examples are simply unsupported statements that sound supported, very often we don’t have the luxury of working with clearly factual statements as a basis.\n
    \n
    All rhetoric is at the end of the day a fallacy, as the truth of the matter is independent on how it is argued. Yet we don’t consider all rhetoric invalid, because we can’t just chain factual statements in real debates. Leaps of logic are universally accepted, common knowledge is shared without any proof, and reasonable assumptions made left and right.\n
    \n
    In fact one persons valid rhetoric is another persons fallacy. If the common knowledge was infact not shared, or an assumption not accepted, the leap in logic is a fallacy.\n
    \n
    I would try to focus less on lists of fallacies or cognitive biases and more on natural logic. Learn how to make idealised proofs, and through that learn to identify what is constantly assumed in everyday discussions. The fallacies itself don’t matter, what matters is spotting leaps in logic and why it feels like a leap in logic to you.\n
    \n
    After all, very often authoritive figures do tell the truth, and both sides of the debate agree on general values without stating them. If someone starts questioning NASA or declares they actually want more people to live in poverty, they did infact spot very real logical fallacies in the debate, but at the same time those fallacies only exist from their point of view, and others might not care to argue without such unstated common ground.
    """
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  +favouriteCount: 9
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1689693300 {#1602
    date: 2023-07-18 17:15:00.0 +02:00
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  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
    "@Datman2020@lemmy.fmhy.ml"
  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1375 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1400 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2428 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1904 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#60 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2487 …}
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  +ranking: 0
  +commentCount: 0
  +upVotes: 0
  +downVotes: 0
  +visibility: "visible             "
  +apId: "https://lemmy.fmhy.ml/comment/1167934"
  +editedAt: null
  +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1689668855 {#1941
    date: 2023-07-18 10:27:35.0 +02:00
  }
}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
3 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1365
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1371 …}
  +entry: App\Entity\Entry {#1805 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#311
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#292 …}
    +name: "asklemmy@lemmy.ml"
    +title: "asklemmy"
    +description: """
      A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions\n
      \n
      **[Search asklemmy](https://lemmy.ml/search?q=&type=Posts&listingType=All&communityId=8&page=1&sort=TopAll) 🔍**\n
      \n
      If your post meets the following criteria, it’s welcome here!\n
      \n
      1. Open-ended\n
      2. Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions\n
      3. **Not regarding using or support for Lemmy**: [context](https://lemmy.ml/post/1223478), find help in the list of support alternatives below\n
      4. Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members\n
      5. [An actual topic of discussion](https://lemmy.ml/post/1239589)\n
      \n
      Support alternatives:\n
      \n
      - [!lemmy_support@lemmy.ml](https://lemmy.ml/c/lemmy_support)\n
      - [!nostupidlemmyquestions@lemmy.dbzer0.com](https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/c/nostupidlemmyquestions)\n
      - [!selfhosted@lemmy.world](https://lemmy.world/c/selfhosted)\n
      \n
      ~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
      """
    +rules: null
    +subscriptionsCount: 0
    +entryCount: 580
    +entryCommentCount: 15558
    +postCount: 7
    +postCommentCount: 129
    +isAdult: false
    +customCss: null
    +lastActive: DateTime @1689748304 {#319
      date: 2023-07-19 08:31:44.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#283 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#279 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#268 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#226 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#184 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#246 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#163 …}
    +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#149 …}
    +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#127 …}
    +logs: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#117 …}
    +awards: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#106 …}
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    +apFetchedAt: DateTime @1689747596 {#320
      date: 2023-07-19 08:19:56.0 +02:00
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    +apDeletedAt: null
    +apTimeoutAt: null
    +visibility: "visible             "
    +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1686889707 {#314
      date: 2023-06-16 06:28:27.0 +02:00
    }
  }
  +image: null
  +parent: null
  +root: null
  +body: """
    Logical fallacies don’t necessarily disagree with facts. While the most common examples are simply unsupported statements that sound supported, very often we don’t have the luxury of working with clearly factual statements as a basis.\n
    \n
    All rhetoric is at the end of the day a fallacy, as the truth of the matter is independent on how it is argued. Yet we don’t consider all rhetoric invalid, because we can’t just chain factual statements in real debates. Leaps of logic are universally accepted, common knowledge is shared without any proof, and reasonable assumptions made left and right.\n
    \n
    In fact one persons valid rhetoric is another persons fallacy. If the common knowledge was infact not shared, or an assumption not accepted, the leap in logic is a fallacy.\n
    \n
    I would try to focus less on lists of fallacies or cognitive biases and more on natural logic. Learn how to make idealised proofs, and through that learn to identify what is constantly assumed in everyday discussions. The fallacies itself don’t matter, what matters is spotting leaps in logic and why it feels like a leap in logic to you.\n
    \n
    After all, very often authoritive figures do tell the truth, and both sides of the debate agree on general values without stating them. If someone starts questioning NASA or declares they actually want more people to live in poverty, they did infact spot very real logical fallacies in the debate, but at the same time those fallacies only exist from their point of view, and others might not care to argue without such unstated common ground.
    """
  +lang: "en"
  +isAdult: false
  +favouriteCount: 9
  +score: 0
  +lastActive: DateTime @1689693300 {#1602
    date: 2023-07-18 17:15:00.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +tags: null
  +mentions: [
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  ]
  +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1375 …}
  +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1400 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2428 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1904 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#60 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2487 …}
  -id: 21563
  -bodyTs: "'accept':86,123 'actual':223 'agre':208 'anoth':108 'argu':61,262 'assum':164 'assumpt':96,121 'authorit':196 'basi':37 'bias':143 'care':260 'chain':75 'clear':32 'cognit':142 'common':12,87,113,266 'consid':66 'constant':163 'day':46 'debat':80,207,241 'declar':221 'disagre':6 'discuss':167 'end':43 'everyday':166 'exampl':13 'exist':250 'fact':8,102 'factual':33,76 'fallaci':2,48,110,130,140,169,238,248 'feel':184 'figur':197 'focus':135 'general':210 'ground':267 'idealis':153 'identifi':160 'independ':56 'infact':116,233 'invalid':69 'knowledg':88,114 'leap':81,125,178,187 'learn':149,158 'left':98 'less':136 'like':185 'list':138 'live':228 'logic':1,83,127,148,180,189,237 'luxuri':28 'made':97 'make':152 'matter':54,173,175 'might':258 'nasa':219 'natur':147 'necessarili':5 'often':22,195 'one':103 'other':257 'peopl':226 'person':104,109 'point':253 'poverti':230 'proof':93,154 'question':218 'real':79,236 'reason':95 'rhetor':39,68,106 'right':100 'share':90,118 'side':204 'simpli':15 'someon':216 'sound':19 'spot':177,234 'start':217 'state':213 'statement':17,34,77 'support':20 'tell':199 'time':246 'tri':133 'truth':51,201 'univers':85 'unstat':265 'unsupport':16 'valid':105 'valu':211 'view':255 'want':224 'without':91,212,263 'work':30 'would':132 'yet':62"
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}
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
4 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1365
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#1371 …}
  +entry: App\Entity\Entry {#1805 …}
  +magazine: App\Entity\Magazine {#311
    +icon: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#292 …}
    +name: "asklemmy@lemmy.ml"
    +title: "asklemmy"
    +description: """
      A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions\n
      \n
      **[Search asklemmy](https://lemmy.ml/search?q=&type=Posts&listingType=All&communityId=8&page=1&sort=TopAll) 🔍**\n
      \n
      If your post meets the following criteria, it’s welcome here!\n
      \n
      1. Open-ended\n
      2. Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions\n
      3. **Not regarding using or support for Lemmy**: [context](https://lemmy.ml/post/1223478), find help in the list of support alternatives below\n
      4. Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members\n
      5. [An actual topic of discussion](https://lemmy.ml/post/1239589)\n
      \n
      Support alternatives:\n
      \n
      - [!lemmy_support@lemmy.ml](https://lemmy.ml/c/lemmy_support)\n
      - [!nostupidlemmyquestions@lemmy.dbzer0.com](https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/c/nostupidlemmyquestions)\n
      - [!selfhosted@lemmy.world](https://lemmy.world/c/selfhosted)\n
      \n
      ~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
      """
    +rules: null
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    +postCommentCount: 129
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      date: 2023-07-19 08:31:44.0 +02:00
    }
    +markedForDeletionAt: null
    +tags: null
    +moderators: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#283 …}
    +ownershipRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#279 …}
    +moderatorRequests: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#268 …}
    +entries: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#226 …}
    +posts: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#184 …}
    +subscriptions: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#246 …}
    +bans: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#163 …}
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    Logical fallacies don’t necessarily disagree with facts. While the most common examples are simply unsupported statements that sound supported, very often we don’t have the luxury of working with clearly factual statements as a basis.\n
    \n
    All rhetoric is at the end of the day a fallacy, as the truth of the matter is independent on how it is argued. Yet we don’t consider all rhetoric invalid, because we can’t just chain factual statements in real debates. Leaps of logic are universally accepted, common knowledge is shared without any proof, and reasonable assumptions made left and right.\n
    \n
    In fact one persons valid rhetoric is another persons fallacy. If the common knowledge was infact not shared, or an assumption not accepted, the leap in logic is a fallacy.\n
    \n
    I would try to focus less on lists of fallacies or cognitive biases and more on natural logic. Learn how to make idealised proofs, and through that learn to identify what is constantly assumed in everyday discussions. The fallacies itself don’t matter, what matters is spotting leaps in logic and why it feels like a leap in logic to you.\n
    \n
    After all, very often authoritive figures do tell the truth, and both sides of the debate agree on general values without stating them. If someone starts questioning NASA or declares they actually want more people to live in poverty, they did infact spot very real logical fallacies in the debate, but at the same time those fallacies only exist from their point of view, and others might not care to argue without such unstated common ground.
    """
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Show voter details
5 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\Magazine {#311
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    A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions\n
    \n
    **[Search asklemmy](https://lemmy.ml/search?q=&type=Posts&listingType=All&communityId=8&page=1&sort=TopAll) 🔍**\n
    \n
    If your post meets the following criteria, it’s welcome here!\n
    \n
    1. Open-ended\n
    2. Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions\n
    3. **Not regarding using or support for Lemmy**: [context](https://lemmy.ml/post/1223478), find help in the list of support alternatives below\n
    4. Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members\n
    5. [An actual topic of discussion](https://lemmy.ml/post/1239589)\n
    \n
    Support alternatives:\n
    \n
    - [!lemmy_support@lemmy.ml](https://lemmy.ml/c/lemmy_support)\n
    - [!nostupidlemmyquestions@lemmy.dbzer0.com](https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/c/nostupidlemmyquestions)\n
    - [!selfhosted@lemmy.world](https://lemmy.world/c/selfhosted)\n
    \n
    ~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
    """
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Show voter details