GET https://kbin.spritesserver.nl/index.php/u/@davel@lemmy.ml/newest/2024-01-07::2024-01-07

Response
200 OK
IP
216.73.216.90
Profiled on
Token
a28dbc

Security

Token

There is no security token.

Firewall

main Name
Security enabled
Stateless

Configuration

Key Value
provider security.user.provider.concrete.app_user_provider
context main
entry_point App\Security\KbinAuthenticator
user_checker App\Security\UserChecker
access_denied_handler (none)
access_denied_url (none)
authenticators 
[
  "two_factor"
  "remember_me"
  "App\Security\KbinAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\FacebookAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GoogleAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\GithubAuthenticator"
  "App\Security\KeycloakAuthenticator"
]

Listeners

Listener Duration Response 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ChannelListener {#723
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -httpPort: 80
  -httpsPort: 443
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\ContextListener {#706
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\TokenStorage {#1017 …}
  -sessionKey: "_security_main"
  -logger: Monolog\Logger {#783 …}
  -userProviders: Symfony\Component\DependencyInjection\Argument\RewindableGenerator {#705 …}
  -dispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
  -registered: false
  -trustResolver: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authentication\AuthenticationTrustResolver {#780 …}
  -sessionTrackerEnabler: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage::enableUsageTracking(): void {#703 …}
}
 10.77 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AuthenticatorManagerListener {#584
  -authenticatorManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Authentication\AuthenticatorManager {#595 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Http\Firewall\TwoFactorAccessListener {#582
  -twoFactorFirewallConfig: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\TwoFactor\TwoFactorFirewallConfig {#842 …}
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -twoFactorAccessDecider: Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\TwoFactorAccessDecider {#581 …}
}
 0.05 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\AccessListener {#579
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -accessDecisionManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\TraceableAccessDecisionManager {#937 …}
  -map: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\AccessMap {#722 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none) 
Symfony\Component\Security\Http\Firewall\LogoutListener {#786
  -tokenStorage: Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authentication\Token\Storage\UsageTrackingTokenStorage {#1018 …}
  -options: [
    "csrf_parameter" => "_csrf_token"
    "csrf_token_id" => "logout"
    "logout_path" => "app_logout"
  ]
  -httpUtils: Symfony\Component\Security\Http\HttpUtils {#841 …}
  -csrfTokenManager: Symfony\Component\Security\Csrf\CsrfTokenManager {#1015 …}
  -eventDispatcher: Symfony\Component\EventDispatcher\Debug\TraceableEventDispatcher {#747 …}
}
 0.00 ms (none)

Authenticators

No authenticators have been recorded. Check previous profiles on your authentication endpoint.

Access Decision

affirmative Strategy
# Voter class
1 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\AuthenticatedVoter"
2 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
3 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
4 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\ExpressionVoter"
5 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
6 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
7 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
8 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
9 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
10 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
11 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
12 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
13 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
14 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"

Access decision log

# Result Attributes Object
1 DENIED ROLE_USER 
null
 
"Scheb\TwoFactorBundle\Security\Authorization\Voter\TwoFactorInProgressVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"Symfony\Component\Security\Core\Authorization\Voter\RoleHierarchyVoter"
 ACCESS DENIED 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\EntryVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MagazineVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageThreadVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\MessageVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\NotificationVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\OAuth2UserConsentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostCommentVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
"App\Security\Voter\UserVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN
Show voter details
2 DENIED moderate 
Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1576
  +user: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\User {#2133 …}
  +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1567 …}
  +image: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Image {#2332 …}
  +domain: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Domain {#2336 …}
  +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
  +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
  +url: "https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/889f6f52-79f6-4bb0-8fe3-e9a7d10aa1a1.jpeg"
  +body: null
  +type: "image"
  +lang: "en"
  +isOc: false
  +hasEmbed: true
  +commentCount: 30
  +favouriteCount: 501
  +score: 0
  +isAdult: false
  +sticky: false
  +lastActive: DateTime @1723532064 {#2330
    date: 2024-08-13 08:54:24.0 +02:00
  }
  +ip: null
  +adaAmount: 0
  +tags: null
  +mentions: null
  +comments: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2343 …}
  +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2342 …}
  +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2334 …}
  +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2050 …}
  +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2046 …}
  +badges: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#2108 …}
  +children: [
    4 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#1641
      +user: App\Entity\User {#264 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1576 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1567 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1589 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1593 …}
      +body: """
        No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
        \n
        Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 15
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1704599881 {#1696
        date: 2024-01-07 04:58:01.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1592 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1552 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1663 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1661 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1562 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1548 …}
      -id: 287665
      -bodyTs: "'/wiki/class_consciousness),':35 '/wiki/dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie)':67 '/wiki/dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).':76 '/wiki/dual_power),':55 '/wiki/general_union)':41 '/wiki/red_scare)':124 '/wiki/strike_action),':48 'action':45 'ballot':10 'bourgeoisi':64 'box':11 'class':29,31 'cold':127 'communist':81 'conscious':32 'develop':30,50 'dictatorship':61,70 'done':24 'dual':51 'eight':92 'elect':101 'elector':13 'en.prolewiki.org':34 'en.prolewiki.org/wiki/class_consciousness),':33 'en.wikipedia.org':40,47,54,66,75,123 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie)':65 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).':74 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/dual_power),':53 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/general_union)':39 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/red_scare)':122 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/strike_action),':46 'ever':5 'help':26,85 'hole':117 'hour':93 'interim':20 'labor':37,44,104 'memori':116 'memory-hol':115 'milit':43,105 'most':23 'organ':38 'peopl':78 'power':52 'proletariat':73 'purg':113 'red':120 'rememb':79,109 'replac':59 'scare':121 'socialist':2,84 'state':3 'tactic':16 'though':12 'two':119 'ultim':58 'us':86 'use':17 'war':128 'weekend':89 'weren':97 'win':87 'won':7,99 'work':28 'workday':94"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/7146717"
      +editedAt: null
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1704599881 {#1606
        date: 2024-01-07 04:58:01.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 287665
    }
    3 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#1604
      +user: App\Entity\User {#264 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1576 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1567 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1621 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1593 …}
      +body: """
        [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
        \n
        The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
        \n
        Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 4
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1704650000 {#1526
        date: 2024-01-07 18:53:20.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1620 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1701 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1687 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1689 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1691 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1795 …}
      -id: 289445
      -bodyTs: "'/wiki/actually_existing_socialism):':7 '/wiki/newspeak).':116 '/wiki/nordic_model)':27 '/wiki/social_democracy)':34 '/wiki/socialism)':69 '20th':100 'actual':1,70 'ae':4,12 'american':62,84,92 'away':55 'berni':48 'call':57 'capitalist':41 'centuri':101 'china':15 'claim':50 'cuba':16 'democrat':31 'en.prolewiki.org':6 'en.prolewiki.org/wiki/actually_existing_socialism):':5 'en.wikipedia.org':26,33,68,115 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/newspeak).':114 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/nordic_model)':25 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/social_democracy)':32 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/socialism)':67 'even':104 'exist':2 'fashion':113 'five':9 'forgotten':64,86 'fundament':39 'get':54 'korea':21 'lao':17 'like':47 'lost':110 'mean':71,76,89 'model':24 'nordic':23 'north':20 'obscur':97 'one':35,42 'oppos':80 'orwellian':112 'ownership':73,83 'persecut':95 'predomin':10 'privat':82 'product':78 'recogn':11 'sander':49,53 'social':3,30,66,72,88,108 'socialist':60,93 'someon':46 'state':13 'still':38 'vietnam':18 'vocabulari':106 'want':52"
      +ranking: 0
      +commentCount: 0
      +upVotes: 0
      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/7156393"
      +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1719066276 {#1596
        date: 2024-06-22 16:24:36.0 +02:00
      }
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1704650000 {#1619
        date: 2024-01-07 18:53:20.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 289445
    }
    2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#1598
      +user: App\Entity\User {#264 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1576 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1567 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1630 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1593 …}
      +body: """
        I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
        \n
        North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
        \n
        China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
        \n
        It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
      +favouriteCount: 1
      +score: 0
      +lastActive: DateTime @1704655998 {#1711
        date: 2024-01-07 20:33:18.0 +01:00
      }
      +ip: null
      +tags: null
      +mentions: [
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
        "@themelm@sh.itjust.works"
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
        "@themelm@sh.itjust.works"
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
        "@themelm@sh.itjust.works"
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
        "@themelm@sh.itjust.works"
        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
        "@themelm@sh.itjust.works"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1629 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1626 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1618 …}
      +reports: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1597 …}
      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1731 …}
      +notifications: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1723 …}
      -id: 289768
      -bodyTs: "'/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations)':87 '/unclesam01/),':44 '/wiki/atlanticism)':16 '/wiki/cia_assassination_attempts_on_fidel_castro)':60 '/wiki/reform_and_opening_up)':162 '/wiki/united_states_embargo_against_cuba).':72 '/wiki/utopian_socialism).':277 'act':121 'answer':25 'assassin':52 'atlantacist':13 'attempt':82 'becom':184 'brought':193 'burgerland':106 'capit':140,247 'capitalist':183,206,216 'castro':54 'chang':84 'china':135 'chomsky.info':43 'chomsky.info/unclesam01/),':42 'cia':49 'clear':112 'control':189,236 'corpor':20 'correct':149 'countri':94,265 'criticalresist.substack.com':86 'criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations)':85 'cuba':63 'delight':220 'difficult':103 'dismay':214 'dynasti':119 'embargo':69 'en.prolewiki.org':161 'en.prolewiki.org/wiki/reform_and_opening_up)':160 'en.wikipedia.org':15,59,71,276 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/atlanticism)':14 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/cia_assassination_attempts_on_fidel_castro)':58 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/united_states_embargo_against_cuba).':70 'en.wikipedia.org/wiki/utopian_socialism).':275 'enough':186 'entir':248 'especi':102,268 'estat':208 'everywher':217 'exampl':41 'fair':167 'fidel':53 'figurehead':125 'get':23,110 'given':269 'go':141 'good':6,24,40 'govern':17,202 'haven':128,233 'heel':211 'help':173 'hope':116 'hundr':55,194 'idea':134 'ignor':168 'imagin':175 'investig':130 'kim':118 'korea':100 'labor':97 'larg':120 'like':32,107 'limit':139 'live':228 'long':240 'long-term':239 'lost':235 'marxist':255,271 'media':21 'million':196 'natur':95 'never':80 'north':99 'note':252 'one':75 'ongo':155 'open':158 'p.o.v':169 'paint':260 'part':152 'peopl':222 'phase':245 'pictur':113 'place':226 'plan':242 'poverti':199 'profess':238 'project':163,191 'propaganda':18 'question':7 'real':207 'reason':78,90 'recent':203 'reform':156 'regim':83 'reject':272 'reli':11 'resourc':98 'right':143 'risk':177 'salt':258 'seem':231 'social':274 'socialist':264 'specul':209 'state':124 'steal':93 'still':65,166 'stop':81 'strategi':180 'strong':185 'term':241 'think':2 'though':200 'threat':37 'time':57 'took':204 'trade':68 'tri':50 'understand':148 'unfortun':28 'utopia':267 'utopian':273 'want':224 'worth':251,256 'wrest':188"
      +ranking: 0
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      +downVotes: 0
      +visibility: "visible             "
      +apId: "https://lemmy.ml/comment/7158475"
      +editedAt: DateTimeImmutable @1719078004 {#1616
        date: 2024-06-22 19:40:04.0 +02:00
      }
      +createdAt: DateTimeImmutable @1704655998 {#1611
        date: 2024-01-07 20:33:18.0 +01:00
      }
      +"title": 289768
    }
    1 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#1728
      +user: App\Entity\User {#264 …}
      +entry: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Entry {#1576 …2}
      +magazine: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\Magazine {#1567 …}
      +image: null
      +parent: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1736 …}
      +root: Proxies\__CG__\App\Entity\EntryComment {#1593 …}
      +body: """
        > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
        \n
        Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
        \n
        > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
        \n
        I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
        \n
        > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
        \n
        Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
        """
      +lang: "en"
      +isAdult: false
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      +lastActive: DateTime @1704662951 {#1721
        date: 2024-01-07 22:29:11.0 +01:00
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        "@Grayox@lemmy.ml"
        "@davel@lemmy.ml"
        "@agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works"
        "@bartolomeo@suppo.fi"
        "@themelm@sh.itjust.works"
      ]
      +children: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1730 …}
      +nested: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1734 …}
      +votes: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1727 …}
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      +favourites: Doctrine\ORM\PersistentCollection {#1724 …}
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      +body: """
        A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
        \n
        Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
        """
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  +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
  +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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      +body: """
        No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
        \n
        Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
        """
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        [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
        \n
        The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
        \n
        Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
        """
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    2 => App\Entity\EntryComment {#1598
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      +body: """
        I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
        \n
        North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
        \n
        China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
        \n
        It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
        """
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        > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
        \n
        Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
        \n
        > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
        \n
        I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
        \n
        > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
        \n
        Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
        """
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      +body: """
        A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
        \n
        Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
        """
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  +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
  +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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      +body: """
        No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
        \n
        Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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        [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
        \n
        The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
        \n
        Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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      +body: """
        I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
        \n
        North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
        \n
        China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
        \n
        It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
        """
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        > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
        \n
        Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
        \n
        > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
        \n
        I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
        \n
        > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
        \n
        Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
        """
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        A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
        \n
        Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
        """
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    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
    \n
    Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
    """
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    +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
    \n
    Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
    """
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8 DENIED moderate 
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    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
    \n
    Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
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          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          date: 2024-01-07 04:58:01.0 +01:00
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        +body: """
          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
    \n
    The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
    \n
    Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
    """
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
    \n
    The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
    \n
    Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
    """
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"App\Security\Voter\PostVoter"
 ACCESS ABSTAIN 
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Show voter details
12 DENIED moderate 
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    +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
    \n
    The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
    \n
    Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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    +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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  +body: """
    I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
    \n
    North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
    \n
    China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
    \n
    It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
    """
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Show voter details
15 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1598
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    +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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        +body: """
          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
          """
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
          """
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        +body: """
          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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        +body: """
          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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     …2
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    I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
    \n
    North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
    \n
    China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
    \n
    It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
    """
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16 DENIED moderate 
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    +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
          """
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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        +body: """
          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
    \n
    North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
    \n
    China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
    \n
    It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
    """
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App\Entity\EntryComment {#1728
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    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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  +body: """
    > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
    \n
    Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
    \n
    > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
    \n
    I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
    \n
    > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
    \n
    Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
    """
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19 DENIED edit 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1728
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    +slug: "Crony-Capitalism-is-Libertarian-cope"
    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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  +body: """
    > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
    \n
    Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
    \n
    > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
    \n
    I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
    \n
    > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
    \n
    Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
    """
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20 DENIED moderate 
App\Entity\EntryComment {#1728
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    +title: ""Crony Capitalism" is Libertarian cope"
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
          \n
          Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
          """
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    > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
    \n
    Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
    \n
    > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
    \n
    I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
    \n
    > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
    \n
    Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
    """
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
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        +body: """
          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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    A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
    \n
    Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
    """
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
          """
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        +body: """
          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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    A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
    \n
    Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
    """
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          No socialist State has ever been won at the ballot box, though electoralism has its tactical uses in the interim. It’s mostly done through helping the working class develop [class consciousness](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Class_consciousness), through [labor organizing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_union) and [militant labor action](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strike_action), through developing [dual power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_power), and then ultimately replacing the [dictatorship of the bourgeoisie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_bourgeoisie) with the [dictatorship of the proletariat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletariat).\n
          \n
          Few people remember that Communists and other socialists helped us win the weekend and the eight hour workday, and these weren’t won through elections but through labor militancy. They don’t remember because we were purged and memory-holed by [two red scares](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare) and a cold war.
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          [Actually Existing Socialisms (AES)](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Actually_Existing_Socialism): *The five predominantly recognized AES states are China, Cuba, Laos, Vietnam, and, [North] Korea*.\n
          \n
          The [Nordic model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model) is a [social democratic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy) one, which is still fundamentally a capitalist one. This is what someone like Bernie Sanders claims to want.\n
          \n
          Sanders gets away with calling himself a socialist because Americans have forgotten what [*socialism*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) actually means: “social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership.” Americans have forgotten what *socialism* means because the American socialists were persecuted into obscurity in the 20th century. So now even the *vocabulary* for socialism is lost in [Orwellian fashion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak).
          """
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          I think these are very good questions. You can’t rely on [Atlantacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanticism) government propaganda or corporate media to get good answers to them, unfortunately. The don’t like there to be any [threats of a good example](https://chomsky.info/unclesam01/), which is why [the CIA tried to assassinate Fidel Castro hundreds of times](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) and why [Cuba is still under a trade embargo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba). It’s one of the reasons they never stop [attempting regime changes](https://criticalresist.substack.com/p/the-blueprint-of-regime-change-operations) (the other reason being to steal countries’ natural and labor resources).\n
          \n
          North Korea is especially difficult for a Burgerlander like me to get a clear picture of. I hope the Kim dynasty largely acts as a state figurehead, but I haven’t investigated and have no idea.\n
          \n
          China does have a limited capitalism going on right now, which, if I understand correctly, is a part of the ongoing [Reform and Opening Up](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Reform_and_Opening_Up) project. From my (still fairly ignorant) P.O.V., I can’t help but imagine a risk to this strategy, where the capitalists become strong enough to wrest control. The project has brought hundreds of millions out of poverty, though. The government recently took the capitalist real estate speculators to heel (to the dismay of capitalists everywhere and the delight of people just wanting a place to live), so it seems they haven’t lost control. Their professed long-term plan is to phase out capitalism entirely.\n
          \n
          It’s worth noting that no Marxist worth their salt will paint any of these socialist countries as utopias, especially given that Marxists reject [utopian socialisms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_socialism).
          """
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          > But they engage in massive censorship among other issues and I just can’t see how there can be a democracy (which I consider the most important component to make something socialist) with that degree of control\n
          \n
          Maybe they do, maybe that’s mostly the propaganda we’re fed. I’m sure that at least some of the “censorship” is the Chinese State keeping foreign capitalist enterprises from dominating China’s indigenous internet.\n
          \n
          > The state has control over all the means of production in the country and I believe it uses it for its own benefit.\n
          \n
          I do think that is predominant (though there are also worker co-ops & individual projects). If China is a [democratic socialist state](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Democratic_socialism), then the “it” in “its own benefit” is largely the working class. This is in contrast with a [bourgeois democracy](https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Bourgeois_democracy) like the US, where the “it” is largely the capitalist class. Our votes are somewhat effective when they don’t conflict with the capitalists, but otherwise not so much. We get fed a lot of propaganda about socialist states having an authoritarian “ruling class,” analogous to our capitalist class, living high on the hog at the expense of the people, but is that really so, or is it projection?\n
          \n
          > I guess I’m just an anti-authoritarian first […] I’ve always been more inspired by anarchist philosophy and go by Libertarian-socialist if forced to pick a name.\n
          \n
          Quite understandable: I came from that place. It took a lot of convincing, because my heels were pretty dug in to a Noam Chomsky/[Mark Fisher](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fisher) position. I think one of the quicker/easier ways to seeing arguments on why this position has never and can never succeed, and why the “authoritarianism” of communism has succeeded and is a necessary step on the path to socialism, is Michael Parenti’s [Blackshirts and Reds](https://www.michael-parenti.org/book-blackshirts-and-reds). It’s a short book and as such doesn’t—on its own—provide a whole lot of backing evidence; it’s a jumping-off point for further inquiry.
          """
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  +body: """
    A few capitalist tech companies started a brutal [996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system) system, which from what I’ve heard was illegal, and the state has since been cracking down on it. I agree that we shouldn’t assume what China has done to be the best possible path, nor should we directly imitate it, because our material conditions are very different from theirs.\n
    \n
    Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
    """
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