Framework vs Macbook laptop?

I apologise if this is the wrong community to post this in, I wasn’t sure which one was ideal.

I’m suffering a difficult decision of choosing between a Framework laptop or a Macbook Air (M1, 2020). I really like the ethical principles of Framework, i.e. you actually own it and can repair it any time, leading to an increased longevity. At the same time, I have heard people claim Macbook is superior in almost all aspects (especially battery life).

I know both Apple and Microsoft are greedy CorpGiants, but seeing as I have an iPhone, I figure it would be easier using a Mac? But then again, the prices really are not worth it, especially considering it costs a lot to repair them. I have 0 experience with Linux, and this computer will be used at school, so I suppose it stands between macOS and Windows.

I guess I just want some advice? Or some guidance and comparisons. Is 8GB enough for a Framework laptop? The 16GB version costs nearly as much as the Mac I’m looking at, hence my hesitance. If anybody has some experience using Framework and / or Macbook, I would love to hear about it. What are some pros and cons? Which people are better off with FW and Mac respectively?

Thank you!

*Edit, forgot to mention: I need a Swedish keyboard on the computer, and Framework apparently only offers English. This is the largest obstacle preventing me from leaning towards FW.

Soulfulginger,

I am not very familiar with framework but I did switch from macbooks to a dell gaming laptop years ago and I am so glad I did.

The macs are ridiculously expensive, and even if you break just the charger it costs a lot to replace. My laptop now I was able to get for nearly half the price and it runs games and programs that I used in college better than the mac ever could.

Every mac I ever owned completely died in 4-6 years of purchase. They’re basically guaranteed to not last a long time. My guess is you’re better off with getting a framework

NightAuthor,

There are plenty of reasons not to like apple products, but the 4-6 years for macbooks is unheard of. There’s a reason I was able to sell my 2015 macbook for 60% of its purchase price in 2020. They keep chugging along, built physically strong, with great battery management that means it doesn’t degrade much over time. And with launch of apple silicon, the performance of them is even better. They won’t game, but for a certain type of person they are a good choice. And for other people they’re a bad choice, that they’ll make just for the sake of social status or whatever.

  • Not a apple fanboy, see my other comment.
Vanth, (edited )
@Vanth@reddthat.com avatar

What do you do on your laptop? For example, engineering students and STEM hobbyists probably want Windows, maybe Linux depending on their interests, specced out to run CAD or whatever simulation software their major will dictate. Graphic artists and photographer hobbyists might want Mac.

Framework laptops can ship with Windows already installed. You can also install Windows or Linux yourself, but Linux is not required.

You mention you don’t know Linux, but how comfortable are you with hardware? Can you open your current laptop and add memory? Are you interested in upgrading your laptop hardware periodically or is it going to be a chore you avoid?

Your question on 8 vs 16GB memory should be driven by your use. Personally, 8gb isn’t enough for me anymore, it locks out a lot of newer games and programs that I want to use. Does your school recommend OS and specs for your major? Make sure those are met at a minimum.

clark,
@clark@midwest.social avatar

I will be studying cyber security and network infrastructure with some limited script programming. I understand it is far easier to use Windows if you study in engineering.

I am interested in Linux, but seeing as Microsoft is very closed-off (cannot use installed versions of Microsoft365), I am a bit unsure if I want to fully commit to it. I am absolutely willing to try running it and getting a feel of it, though.

What does the process look like when you install Windows on your own? Is it difficult / costly?

Vanth,
@Vanth@reddthat.com avatar

If you think Microsoft has closed off Windows, what until you learn about Apple/Mac…

clark,
@clark@midwest.social avatar

I am aware of that, I was just saying.

Vanth,
@Vanth@reddthat.com avatar

No offense, but I don’t get why you’re looking at MAC OR FRAMEWORK.

You don’t need either, you’re not an Apple fanboy and you aren’t into graphic design or video editing type jobs/hobbies… Mac isn’t for you.

You aren’t into hardware or Linux, you don’t even have strong knowledge on how much memory you would need or what keeping it upgraded would entail. Framework isn’t for you.

Why not a normal Windows laptop where you aren’t paying a premium for branding? Unless the brand is what’s most important to you, in which case that’s totally your personal call. Want to be an Apple-vibe person or a Framework-vibe person?

Nibodhika,

I think the framework one is better because you can get a cheaper version now and upgrade it in time. I don’t know the specific specs of both laptops, but Apple products are usually overpriced, so look at all specs, the same price might not be the same specs, e.g. CPU might be weaker or no dedicated GPU.

That being said I understand where the love for Apple comes from, their products are very slick and because they control both hardware and software they can get some heavy optimisations.

Finally if you care about privacy enough to question getting a Mac, you should give Linux a try, it’s not hard, most people suffer for trying to do things the windows way, but you would already have suffered that if you went with a Mac.

mundane,

8GB is not enough memory these days. But you can always add memory later.

betz24,

Not for the MacBook, it’s soldered in. So he will have to upgrade the whole thing. The M1 is one of the best laptops I’ve used (for work), but you have to choose the right specs at the beginning, otherwise you will be in a pickle.

mundane,

You are correct, I was thinking of the framework, but I didn’t mention that in my comment.

EffortlessEffluvium,

It’s more than soldered in—it’s in the actual processor. It’s why you can’t desolder the RAM and replace it, even if you were that talented. It’s the downside to SOC. I hope that the new RAM technology called CAMM works out and becomes popular enough to fix the SOC trend.

some_guy,

True on Framework (add more later), not on MacBook Air. But even though my main machine now has 64GB, I found my first-gen MacBook Air (2020) was great with 16GB. However, depends what you need to throw at it.

Damage,

Are they comparable in price? What is it that you actually do with your computer?

clark,
@clark@midwest.social avatar

I will be studying cyber security where we will do some script programming (but no heavy programming at all), otherwise I use it to stream movies online and watch Youtube. That’s pretty much what I do with my current school-prescribed computer.

scytale,

Just a note that virtualization is not available on Apple silicon (M1+) yet, so if you plan on running VMs like Kali, it won’t be possible.

aesc,
@aesc@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

Sure it will, just get Kali for ARM. www.kali.org/docs/arm/

skozzii,

Get a refurb thinkpad(x1 carbon gen7 ish maybe) and run Linux if your in to cybersecurity.

aesc,
@aesc@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

Oh, you want to study cybersecurity? Yeah forget what I said before, get a Framework, and if you don’t put Linux on it at least put WSL on it. Learn all you can.

WeLoveCastingSpellz,

cybersecurity really poibts to framework + linux

hackeryarn, (edited )

I’ve worked on dev tooling in a fairly large company. Especially for cyber security, do not get a Mac. A lot of the tools are just different enough on a Mac that they will make your life much harder.

mipadaitu,

You can always upgrade the memory, and storage of the framework laptop, so you can start with the 8GB and then pick up more pretty cheap later.

One of the best things about the framework is that you don’t have to pay for a package upgrade of parts if all you need is just one thing to upgrade.

Also, when you do need to update something, you can just get a new motherboard and memory, and not have to buy a whole new laptop.

Honestly, just get the framework, unless there’s a real reason you need a Mac.

fox2263,

You can also update the processor when they release new parts.

And you don’t have to run Windows, put a nice flavour of Linux on it for that fast feeling. Or rip everything out of Windows with something like the AME wizard.

clark,
@clark@midwest.social avatar

Thanks for this comment! Everybody on Reddit says to get Macbook instead of Framework, so it’s nice to have some differing opinions.

Rooki,
@Rooki@lemmy.world avatar

If you want to be the “cool guy” then macbook is your choice, it will cost more and repair is risky to be done by anyone except apple himself.

If you want to have a laptop, that is easy to repair,upgrade and is cheap but powerfull then Framework laptop.

On macbook you are locked into apple, you cant upgrade, you can only get support by apple and most of the time third party stuff doesnt work right on macbook. On Framework laptop you are more open to do anything, like upgrading, switching OS if windows isnt right for you. Framework is a lot more open and listens to the community.

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