FastAndBulbous

@FastAndBulbous@lemmy.world

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FastAndBulbous,

You make the patents too easy to get and it fucks the little guy over as the big corps hoover up all the ideas. You make them difficult or impossible to get then that also benefits the big guys over the little guys as they will just steal people’s ideas and produce them for cheaper with their existing infrastructure which creates an even bigger monopoly.

There is a sweet spot that society is trying to reach. It’s imperfect like any system but it’s far far better than having no system.

You’ve not even considered that in order to get a patent granted you have to disclose your invention to the public which stops big corporations hoarding too many trade secrets.

All in all, the idea that patents shouldn’t exist benefits nobody except the large corporations. Say goodbye to start ups growing in size if that is the case.

FastAndBulbous,

I would argue that Wikipedia is wrong or misguided. There is no serious debate about whether or not dark matter exists. I also think you’ve completely missed the point of my argument regarding the EM field just being only one way to detect the existence of things.

FastAndBulbous, (edited )

But it is visible, it’s visible in terms of gravitational effects. We can “see” the effects of dark matter. That is evidence specifically for dark matter, i.e. matter that is very hard or impossible to detect via the electromagnetic spectrum but is observable through gravity.

Dark matter is the explanation, the question is more what form does it take.

It just takes a bit of acknowledgement that actually the EM spectrum is not the only way to view the universe. In fact it’s just one of four (maybe five) fundamental forces. We’re just used to that being the default for seeing because it’s how we physically see. It’s an anthropocentric bias to say something doesn’t exist because we can’t view it via EM radiation despite the fact gravity is clearly showing it to us.

You could use your logic to argue against the existence of black holes. We don’t see them by definition but they are most certainly there.

FastAndBulbous,

We don’t have solutions for starvation at all on a global scale and we do try to feed everyone in developed nations that’s why countries have welfare. I agree the welfare safety net should be stronger generally, but I don’t think people starving to death is a widespread issue in developed nations. The homeless are much more likely to die due to lack of shelter or drug issues.

FastAndBulbous,

Yes because seeds are the only resource people fight over…

FastAndBulbous,

Geopolitical, as in a combination of political, cultural and geographical.

I don’t think noting the problem is partially political is enough to say it’s easily solveable.

I think we’re coming at this from a different philosophy, you see politics as something that is easily changeable, I see it as a product of environmental and cultural positions. Changing the entire world’s politics is a nigh on impossible task.

You see geopolitics as a variable, I see it as a constraint on the actual variables.

FastAndBulbous,

I agree the word raid was the wrong word to use there

They don’t just find land and build a fence around it though in the modern era, that’s extremely reductionist. They pay for the privilege to work the land. Society as a whole agree the land is his because of this.

How do you parse how much belongs to the farmer and how much belongs to the community? I would argue we already have an arrangement like that. Who oversees this and what do they get out of if?

Most importantly where is the incentive to maximise yield if people are just growing personal crops? What if you want to eat but don’t want to work the land?

FastAndBulbous,

I think there is only so much humans can change. We aren’t beings of infinite moral potential and there will always be points of conflict.

FastAndBulbous,

There is thinking there are no logistics problems we can’t solve and then there is actually solving them taking into account real geopolitics.

FastAndBulbous,

Do you have anything to contribute? I’m trying to have an actual discussion about policy.

I think the profit incentive is important in maximising yield, do you have anything to add to this as to why I may be wrong? Or are you just going to signal me as an other so that others just switch off and get defensive.

I think it’s kind of ironic that some claim to want the world to see things from their point of view but then immediately attack those who question their views or try to understand. This just suggests to me you’re more about signalling to your in group than growth in ideas and discussion.

FastAndBulbous,

You need to define what you mean by not working.

Of course discussion is needed. How else do you expand your mind and thoughts without discussing things? I don’t take your views as being inherently true in much the same way you don’t take mine, that’s healthy and normal.

FastAndBulbous,

I invented a hypothetical scenario for a thought experiment yes. I don’t think it’s implausible as a scenario in a communal situation. If there is no private farmland property there is nothing to stop people just straight up taking things and abusing the goodwill of the farmer.

FastAndBulbous,

I would argue the primary cause of all of these problems is that we live in a world of finite resources. I think all of those things would still be problems under any political system we tried to implement. If there was plenty of resources for everyone we would just multiply until that wasn’t the case any more.

I reject the notion that we could rid the world of these things, the entirety of human history provides empirical evidence that backs me up on this. I think it’s fantastical to think we could rid the world of these things, all we can do is try to reduce the impact as best we can in the limited ways that we can as individuals and as a society.

FastAndBulbous,

Why does investment entitle people to live off said thing? That’s because there are agreements between the parties involved. If I want to start a business and need seed money I willingly enter a contract with investors just as they willingly risk their investment capital.

Of course they are more efficient, nobody sets up co operatives. If they were a more efficient way of running a business more people would do it.

FastAndBulbous,

Not really, I’m just trying to understand their position. It’s not combative to ask pertinent questions.

FastAndBulbous,

It’s clearly because we haven’t had a socialist revolution. That would sort all logistical and societal problems out forever.

FastAndBulbous,

I’ve already admitted the word raid was the incorrect one. I was just questioning the idea that farmers should produce food for no compensation and that anybody should be free to work their land.

FastAndBulbous,

But the crucial thing is, people are already allowed to form co-operatives, there is nothing stopping you doing it for example. But outside of a select few niche industries they are generally less efficient and get outcompeted by traditional top down companies.

FastAndBulbous,

I’m aware that’s not how the modern world works,but evidently there are many in this thread who thinks that’s how it should work. I don’t think I’m engaging in bad faith whatsoever, I’m trying to actively address your points.

Why should workers own the means of production? What is incentivising them to even create the means of production without profit motive?

If workers own the means of production, what would stop them from deciding they’d rather sell said means to a capitalist for a profit?

Does every worker have an equal ownership? Does someone who has been working there for 10 years have the same rights as someone who is new? How do you decide this and who is overseeing this? What mechanisms exist to stop the primary shareholders from just assuming control and deciding to pay wages to people instead?

FastAndBulbous,

Probably starve to death after I ran out of tinned food.

FastAndBulbous,

So you think human beings should change their basic hardwired nature? Obviously humans have a tendency to care for the people closest to them over complete strangers. Humans always will come into conflicts of interest. What you’re asking for is for humanity to basically act perfectly all the time.

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