averyminya

@averyminya@beehaw.org

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averyminya,

So rather than fixing the issue they just removed it entirely.

That’s kind of a joke from a “privacy” based browser.

How much does a creator's worldview influence whether you use their tech or consume their media?

Watching the drama around kagi unfold and it has me wondering how much you take into consideration a creator’s view on things like homophobia, sexism, racism, etc. when deciding to use a product. I think most of us have a bar somewhere (I would imagine very few on this website would ever consider registering on an altright...

averyminya,

You raise a really good perspective about the relevance of the artist among our culture. Older cultural influences have some significance but not the same as current artists in society. The relevance of problematic Greeks/Romans/Catholics just don’t have the same weight because we know they come from a different time and their art is a reflection of that time. If anything, it’s a sociological study of people from that time - we can still say the same for people today except for the fact that our consumption of their work can effect their estate.

Compared to current artists of today who are problematic - the likes of Roman Polanski, Chris Brown, Kevin Spacey, Johnathon Majors, Roald Dahl, these artists are much more in line with J.K.R. than someone like Picasso (or {insert problematic writer from 1850-1950}, because their works are more immediately relevant to our current culture. I also think the intent of consumption matters based on how it is then talked about - is someone is consuming the media to get an understanding of the cultural feelings at the time, something that highlights aspects of society, or are they trying to live vicariously through this character and thus perpetuating it.

As someone mentioned as well, second-hand is a way to still consume the media without directly supporting the artist. I don’t think consumption of media is inherently supportive of the ideology nor does it have to monetarily support them, though I do understand that there is a high likelihood of sharing thoughts about something leading to others possibly purchasing and supporting them.

What these conversations always come down to me is how effective is blacklisting an artist? As in, does consumption of problematic works inherently perpetuate those problematic ideas or is it able to be discussed while highlighting them? I myself am conflicted here, as one of my favorite movie has 2 problematic actors in it, but Baby Driver is so damn good and having it on my Plex server doesn’t actively support the problematic people (then, nor does it support the good workers). So it comes down to how willing or how able I am to separate the art from the artist, and how I choose to engage with said media when talking about it with others.

Someone mentioned Joss Whedon who is another great (or, awful rather) example where his actions make it harder to consume his media. But Buffy is still and always will be a classic, and The Avengers is still a big moment. Those also happen to have a lot more people than just him working on them. But the same could be said for Roman Polanski, but I am on the side of the user who said his works should effectively be dismissed. The only case for something to that extent would be for film and social studies in an academic setting where all of the knowledge surrounding it becomes part of the conversation - as an example akin to this I think it’s important to be aware of and study American Cinema. Unfortunately by nature American Comedy has deeply rooted racism ranging from creating stereotypes that still are perpetuated today, to poor treatment of actors. And yet it’s essential that we study these else we lack the historical contexts that led to change. I think the same will be said a few decades from now regarding Polanski, where we aren’t studying his work his actions but rather studying the changes in society as a result of them.

We can study without them, but we will miss important contexts that are important dynamics. Without knowing about how trains influenced filmography the impact of travel films like Thelma and Louise are less impactful than they could be. Without knowing about how awful sex scenes in film used to be, the impact of modern sex scenes led by Intimacy Coordinators can seem frivolous. Without knowing the history of blackslpoitation films contemporary ones (like Black Dynamite) made in its image may not have the same weight. They can be viewed and understood without that contextual knowledge, but the impact from viewing the media with the knowledge is very different. Which of course the whole discussion, is exactly what it’s like to consume media with someone problematic - exactly how able, or worthwhile, is separating the art from the artist? Does their intent even matter all that much if how it is consumed is completely antithetical to their position? If someone hateful has a work that everyone consumes and the socially perpetuated message is from love and kindness, does it matter if the artist is problematic? Or does their work become a slap in the face to themselves, so long as the consumers aren’t supportive of the artist but the positive message behind the work - as mentioned this could be as simple as buying the book second hand or pirating it. I don’t remotely have definitive answers to these, but I do think that the discussions surrounding problematic works can be more important than trying to sweep them under the rug in many cases. That of course also isn’t something that’s guaranteed. I’m also not trying to say that there is a definitive answer for any of these, moreso that it almost comes to be a case-by-case basis, per person.

I think it comes down to a mix of the intent of consumption, whether it’s perpetuating or highlighting, as well as the consumers worldview affecting their perspective - like how the movie Idiocracy is received across all demographics. You’d think the conservative mindset would write this movie off, but somehow there is a narrative that fits into their worldview that affects how they perceive and interact with the media.

I’m also not condoning any problematic artists. I grew up with Harry Potter but I haven’t interacted with the IP since the final movie (not the new series), and my interactions since have been through my Plex server, so no direct support. I was interested in the game as a concept and there are people that aren’t her who worked on it, but I’m also neither invested enough in the IP nor interested in supporting her - were I ever to try to play it I would pirate it outright, and I think it would mostly be so that I was able to have a full understanding of the game, its mechanics, seeing the specific problems as they’re presented in game. But that’s me consuming the media with this knowledge in mind, almost inherently creating a dialogue between myself, the property, and society. With that in mind, is my playing that game problematic? Some might still think so, others might think not. I think the same could be said for video games that get called “woke”, such as The Last of Us 2 being poorly received upon release - from an outsiders perspective many critiques were almost entirely comprised of misogyny. Any actual shortcomings of the game were eclipsed by things that just were not an issue, but some consumers decided it was. The reality for that game seems simple; people wanted more Joel and they didn’t get that. Our cultural shortcoming of respecting women have heavily affected any media that represents them, calling them things like Mary Sues or just using woke as a blanket term.

averyminya,

(cont) Finally, there are so many people and examples that I also don’t explicitly fault anyone for liking a problematic artists work, within reason. Someone can love the A-Team and have no idea Crazy Murdock is certifiably insane, or Dilbert strips etc. Consumption with ignorance isn’t ideal but it’s okay within reason. I also think that people can be allowed to have an exception. I don’t support deforestation for Palm Oil but I fucking love Nutella and I’m sorry but I won’t give that up as it’s been the one thing that has kept me going at times of despair. I’m allowed to have that and I can feel okay rationalizing it because of how I carry myself for other products, even if my consumption of it isn’t inherently ethical. Whether or not purchasing Nutella negates my convictions (like boycotting Nestle and trying to avoid non-sustainable practices) becomes irrelevant because it comes down to my happiness. I feel the same way for AI art for general consumers - I personally think that it’s people like little Timmy and overworked Jane who are just using Midjourney to make fun photos to make themselves happy. These are people who likely wouldn’t be commissioning art anyway, and their happiness is allowed to exist. For production of other things someone mentioned shoes as another example, which I personally try very hard to find ethical ones but in practice I always end up with PUMA’s because they fit my feet and have lasted longer. It’s something I wish I could change, but I’m stuck between values and blistered feet and buying another pair far more quickly than usual (just for this one example I bought shoes from Thousandfell and I had to get a new pair within 6 months from basic work wear) just to have to break them in again.

I think media from the perspective of ethical consumption is only a skipping stone away from corporate consumption, with the main difference being that the former you have a little more freedom of choice to decide with a much wider range of acceptability - is the author someone you want to support or do they just have an idea worth talking about, but you need to be informed first? Compared to which handbag/pair of shoes I should by because of how other people perceive my social status.

The former may have problematic elements but they can be discussed and support isn’t as outright. It’s more likely to highlight the issue, even if you’re consuming the work of someone problematic. The latter is a byproduct of societies problematic elements, it is hard to not perpetuate the issues unless you are specifically going out of your way to correct them, if you can buy second-hand or whatever else. Anyway, I realize I scoped this out a bit wider than the original question, but only because I think they are closely related, the main difference simply being that it’s not necessarily inherently ethical to consume a problematic artists works, while general consumption is just so difficult to avoid problematic business.

averyminya,

It’s been weirdly windy by me as well, normally the nights are pretty still even if it’s raining but the last couple nights have been pushing me around!

averyminya,

Users deleted comments was the only power we really had. How is reddit worth anything when all the people who shared information now lead to deleted comments?

I deleted a lot of my guides because of reddit. I still have them, but they’re no longer online due. Reddit is even kind enough to say that my account which I deleted no longer exists, maybe because it was banned. So that’s nice, all of us who deleted it in protest have been labeled as banned users.

I’ve had to use search “reddit” a couple times for various niche things but I stopped after multiple “answers” were just directing to deleted comments.

averyminya,

I think that’s a great description, in part it’s what drew me here with the idea that the discussions and topics are always from a kind and informational perspective, without the common “sneer tone” that can so often overtake conversations on the internet.

Personally my experience with users on Beehaw has been entirely kind, thoughtful, and full of knowledgeable people, whatever the topic may be. The few poor experiences I have had here were from outside instances, it’s true, and I can’t imagine just how much of that you all must have to deal with. But I have also had just as many incredibly thoughtful interactions from some federated instances as well, generally the (seemingly) smaller instances. I feel like maybe every 1 in 10 comments through the posts I go to read in All might have be negative or purposeful troll, but all the rest are at least coming from a perspective that I can understand even if I may not agree - but it’s always worth engaging because it drives good thoughtful conversation.

I have an account on slrpnk that is federated with lemmy.world and it can be unbearable to use sometimes - the slrpnk community itself is wonderful, but lemmy.world dominates the All feed, and lemmy.world comments… it’s a mix of dismissive and instigative. I feel like every 1 in 10 comments might be coming from a kind and thoughtful perspective. Comments are immediately downvoted, often times there’s comments no more than a sentence long through a whole thread. Except for moderators, but there’s just a tone that I can’t quite place among reading the interactions that feels… maybe not entirely welcoming? However I also understand they have a lot going on there, and certainly some history I’m missing.

Anyway, that’s a long way of saying I really, really value both the Beehaw community & mods and our set of instances, even if there may be a few that still have problems that I don’t get to see as a regular user. But I do know that I value all of your comments enough to see what you have to say and get to know my internet friends - Chris, your determination for community is inspiring and you’ve got some cool hobbies! And the few times I have seen moderator intervention and extended discussion, I’ve yet to come across an example where I think any of you handled it poorly. (All of you) Your contributions here are more than mod team leaders when you need to be, you feel like community members through and through - which unfortunately feels rare for a mod team!


Regarding federation and instances - maybe the family analogy is something that can be adapted? Here on local we are the immediate family but the instances that I appreciate the most I still feel are cousins. I think many of them appreciate us as well. Unfortunately, I think the negative users overall will not be prevented from their bad habit by a sidebar and our philosophy. With that in mind I think federation with servers that focus on sharing knowledge is the most important.

From the recent post made on I think lemmy.ml regarding Beehaw’s federation - the reception was terrible. It felt terrible to read. But looking through the comments, I would say over 80% of them at least had to be lemmy.world users who have never even interacted here - or if they did were soon defederated from and clearly salty about it, all of those getting ~30-50 upvotes. It was a literal circlejerk about our instance coming from a flawed or probably just intentionally wrong perspective. Information like a game of telephone. If it weren’t so inflammatory it would have been funny, given my actual experiences here.

However, the rest of the comments though were from a wide, wide array of instances saying they would miss our presence, with it being about a 50/50 split from lemmy.ml itself. And each instance I happened to see that felt positively about us, I likewise had only ever had good interactions from members of those instances as well.

Luckily, I had already seen just how awful lemmy.world can really be, as I mentioned I’d created my slrpnk account just a few weeks ago which is actually where I saw that post, maybe just last week or so? Suffice to say, the reception from them was not surprising in the least because to me it seems clear the intent is to tear down, not lift up. You cannot share knowledge in a tear down community because no matter what, somehow your knowledge is wrong.

Users here just have a completely different intention and way of using and interacting with the internet. Users on other smaller instances feel like that intention is there too. We share knowledge with the intent of further gaining and growing our ideas and abilities and because it helps another member of our community. That is becoming more and more rare on the web and I really value our presence in the fediverse and I believe that there are others that do too.

Whatever the future may hold for our instance, I’ll likely migrate with and keep it as part of my sites, but I do worry about the continued level of engagement over time. On the other hand, I realize I don’t like the wider fediverse as much as I thought I did after my last month or so looking around on other accounts. (I definitely need to curate better, though). Anyway, I saw this post 14 minutes in and I only got distracted once so… Happy new year to all and I look forward to our next interaction!

averyminya,

Wait lol are people posting that to their comments to use it as claimed ownership? I did not realize that was the intent there

averyminya,

How about this perspective? You are being tracked regardless. Do you have friends? Do they have your number? You have a tracking ID. Have you ever used the Internet at home not on a VPN and not on a fingerprint-preventing browser (i.e. JavaScript off)? You have a tracking ID.

This tracking ID is surrounded by data it gathers from your interactions with others, regardless of whether you want it to or not. Your lack of presence here is far more telling than actually existing. Unless you literally live off the grid no contact, there’s no getting away from it.

On the bright side, guess what? These tracking IDs are practically solely for advertising metrics. The chances of any of this data being meaningful beyond “vestmoria likes vintage cheeses after” is pretty much nil. I would even go so far as to say by having a presence in this space you are likely to be less targeted by prying eyes that actually matter, as opposed to right now where you are a clearly visible dark spot in a sea of lit beacons.

To put it another way - privacy now is through obfuscation, not lack of existence. Google solved the dumb-phone problem in 2013 and they have had advertising IDs on these from the moment they get used. They have had your data already for a long, long time now. Your advertising ID is better used clicking on every ad you come across using AdNauseam than it is trying to de-google a smartphone or avoid carrier data. Make the data on you inaccurate and worthless.

If you really want to avoid using tracking aspects of a smartphone, your best bet is convincing your people to download signal or matrix and use them exclusively, with notifications turned off on the phone. You’ll want to run a VPN you trust. Others suggested custom ROMs to get away from Google, though I’m personally no fan of MicroG either.

I think it’s worth considering accepting that unless you are very specific in how you use it, there is no real feasible way to not be tracked. Even if you take all precautions, even then, you are still being tracked by other peoples phones. With that in mind, your mental health should be put at ease knowing that rather than trying to avoid it, there are ways of feeding it dirty data to make you look like everyone else.

Using Linux you probably already are aware of quite a bit of this, but I’ve always felt that being off the grid or off the radar of adver-govs is a false hope and while there may be measures against it there’s nothing that actually prevents it in full and it’s so much more effort than allowing it to happen but lying about yourself. So what if they have data on you if it’s irrelevant! On top of that, what does it matter if your calls have data on them (date/length). The content of the calls is a different story of course, I don’t have a solution for that.

Maybe you can fake phone calls by spoofing phone models and locations and having their conversations spoken via AI.

averyminya,

Friendly reminder the Mayans had a highway

Is linux good for someone tech illererate.

Now i’ve been considering moving to linux. I don’t have much of a history using a computer and find it tougher to use than my phone. But I also really appreciate the foss movement. I’ve currently got an old laptop running windows 11 I think and it would prolly speed up with linux too. But I’m afraid I’d fuck smth up...

averyminya,

Can you remember a password?

I tried helping someone with their steam deck and they got stuck because they didn’t know what they set their password to.

That aside, start with running Linux on a liveboot USB. It is very easy. See how it is for yourself and decide from there

averyminya,

Honestly, the smaller truck looks like it might have a larger truck bed.

I feel like the Steam Deck is the best proof of Gabe Newell's quote that "piracy is a service issue."

They could have easily crammed the Steam Deck full of stuff to make it hard to use for piracy - locking down everything, making it usable only to play games you legitimately own, force you to go through who knows what hoops in order to play games on it. That’s what Nintendo or Apple or most other companies do....

averyminya,

This seems pretty whack dude. Proton has been heavily contributed to via Valve, if at least only by paying people to work on it. Without Valve proton would be in a much more dire state than it is now. Seriously, just look at its progress just 6 months before the Steam Deck and after its announcement. It’s a night and day difference.

“some games don’t even work” I’m not sure what you’re trying to say here. With a library of 1.2k trying to see games that don’t work when they’re “unsupported” I’ve yet to come across any. I’m sure there are but, again, what’s your point? That gaming on Linux still has some games that don’t work?

They don’t officially support piracy. What company does? And does Valve do anything to prevent your cracked Non-Steam game from running? So… Their “lack” of piracy support means nothing because you can still do whatever you want. Ok.

“Didn’t make games easier to buy because you have to create an account”. Alright, have fun redownloading things you’ve purchased with no record. Even indie stores have you make an account dude.

“You will get banned if a key is illegal” lmao, what the fuck is an illegal steam key?? You bought games from a stolen credit card or a region resell and had the key revoked? They don’t ban you. And if you’re talking about being region locked, congratulations, Valve is complying with that government. And if you’re talking about being in the U.S. trying to buy keys from other regions, that is hurting people in the region it’s priced for and you’re a jerk for that.

What the fuck are you talking about?

averyminya,

Seeing and taking advantage of services and being happy with it when there is consistency is not brand loyalty. Honestly, always putting these messages behind coy insults just detracts from the actual important part of what you’re trying to say, which is to be wary of where you put your trust. That’s a very valid point of view. It’s true, I am probably trading off these services for the potential longevity of my games.

Proton development was going very slowly before it was in Valve’s interest change that for their benefit. That language make you happy? You can tell me to research all you want but that is the truth. Proton development sped up exponentially after 2020. What am I defending? I literally said if only in paying people to work on it. The reality is, Proton is where it is today because it benefits the Steam Deck. The end result is the same for Linux gamers. It’s ridiculous to say that Valve offered nothing to Proton when graphed out there is a very clear rise in development after Valve got more involved.

Stealing patent game controllers, so you side with Corsair and Scuff, notorious patent trolls hoarding designs and actively preventing small controller makers? Awesome, great showing us where you stand there, that’s extremely telling. If you’re talking about other examples - my mistake. Corsair can rot in hell, they have destroyed so many awesome concept controllers with C&Ds. Oh by the way - newest crime? That was in 2015, 8 years ago lmao.

Risking their entire existence to support an ideal place for games to steal is just a way to get sued by every company.

I’m not really sure what you are trying to say. Every company doesn’t support piracy but many go through extreme measures to prevent it. Opt-in developer Steam DRM is laughably trivial and literally is only to suggest buying it to avoid going through the hassle of cloning one git repository. Again, you are saying illegal keys but you’re not saying what that is. I did mention being banned can happen in extremely rare cases, but most examples when you actually look online are the fault of the user for working around pretty obvious things. Such as buying grey market or working around region locks to buy keys at a cheaper price.

Somebody only using Steamless to crack games and putting them in Steam via Non-Steam is at far less risk of getting their account banned than someone working around region locks and buying grey market is, since you are actively feeding into harmful business. Going around region locks hurts those players and grey market risks laundering/stolen credit card keys both of which affect the developers.

Valve isn’t perfect, I never implied they were. It’s taken a lawsuit (funnily enough, also in 2015) to make them more consumer friendly and yet one suit in Australia affected how they do business worldwide allowing refunds everywhere. Looking to Apple in the EU as an example where one country affects how it does business worldwide I am doubting they will do the same given that they’ve yet to do so for any cases so far.

Look - I don’t disagree that it’s dangerous to put all your eggs in one basket. The idea of Steam Servers going down would be devastating to many and it’s silly to trust a company at face value when they promise you’ll keep access to it if/when that happens. I have Steamless and keep the really important installers backed up for a reason, it’s smart to have just in case. It’s interesting that I’m able to do this at all on Steam, I have not been able to crack my own games for Ubisoft/EA so I can play them offline and without an account.

Who do you trust instead? Do you only pirate to make sure you’ve got the installer forever? Only GOG/itch for DRM free?

Personally I use Steam because I’m under the assumption that if Valve goes under it’s probably because the world is ending and our computers will be useless. Semi-/s

In the meantime what matters to me is being able to play remotely with friends. It has been huge for our friend group and as far as I know, there is no group remote play alternative available? Anywhere? Streaming my games to the living room or on my phone while on the bus - I know moonlight can do this but it never worked well for me. Controller input with SteamAPI also is a massive improvement and for the games I use it with, my Steam Controller is invaluable having mixed mouse and controller inputs. Cloud saves are pretty standard, but including per-game notes is unique and is now. essential. I don’t want to have to set syncthing to every single folder a game decides is a suitable location for saves, and using .txts or my phone notes was annoying. I only manage my emulation saves now.

Don’t even get me started on SteamVR compared to WMR. Great teams at working WMR, very friendly and communicative - very frustrating to actually play in. The quest is a joke.

I use these monthly at minimum, most of them daily. I’m not a fanboy so much as someone who uses a service that isn’t offered elsewhere. I’d be happy to jump ship from Valve if there was something. The main marketed competition is much more awful than Valve and actually has influence on the entire gaming market with Unreal Engine and they very quickly showed how little they care about the user. The other VR options on the market I tried, the Reverb G2 would have been okay if 1) WMR wasn’t a requirement, 2) inside-out camera tracking sucks and 3) inconsistent hardware makes them fragile. Half of what made the VR experience so good was that I was using the Index Knuckles. Got the Index a bit later and despite the lower res it was just such a better experience because I didn’t have to fiddle and tweak to make things work. I got the Steam link (because it was $5) because I was constantly annoyed with moonlight giving me issues - lo and behold the steam link just worked with no issues.

Until there’s a good alternative, I’m happy with my Steam Deck and Index. I’m content risking my library of games if it means that right now I’m able to play Overcooked with my friend in Indonesia, or end my game on PC and pick up where I left off downstairs either via Steam Link or these days the Deck. These are things that I could not do, either at all or as easily, without Steam.

Show me an alternative that has a smidge of what I use from Steam and I’ll start switching over. Playnight and GOG Galaxy aren’t it by a longshot. None from what I can tell exist except for a single self-hosted option that just came to fruition this year, and that’s solely for installers and a very barebones launcher (it was called Crack I think, hilarious, but I think the project has been renamed since then). But go on, keep saying it’s blind brand loyalty, ignore the litany of services that get used that make people see it as a worthwhile option.

averyminya,

I’ve had similar issues/experiences with Jellyfin as well.

averyminya,

Don’t torrent over tor, its nodes should be used for more important things than piracy

averyminya,

Wow, that’s awesome. I’ve been thinking a lot about the scale of the universe and how cyclical it is.

Take a scaled out view of our solar system and then compare it to a molecules composition (the atom or group of atoms surrounded by protons and neutrons) and the similarities are just uncanny.

Like this image, what’s to say that we aren’t just part of a molecule making up the chemical composition of something far larger than ourselves. An ant has no concept of the vast empty space between the United States and Europe, we know that is the case between solar systems but our actual understanding of our relationship in space is limited.

P.S. look at the patterns of discharge of electricity in wood/paper/stone and then look at the patterns of the Grand Canyon. They’re the same! And the Grand Canyon is the only formation we have that exhibits this quality, which makes it extra interesting.

averyminya,

Not really over a 5 year period, especially if you talk about more than a single subscription service. If you mean by preserve as keeping a full 3-2-1 backup, then yeah sure, but most people don’t need that. Double backup the truly important/rare content, everything else can be redownloaded in case of tragedy.

For posterity, 1 year of HBO Max or Disney+ is $150. Over 5 years that’s $750. If you are someone who knows you annually rewatch content, then that’s likely a guaranteed expense. Btw, if you pay month to month unless it’s less than 8 months of the year, monthly is more expensive, so I’m being generous here. No managing monthly subscriptions is also a major benefit.

That price nets you at least six 8TB HDD’s at $109 each, which 48TB is far more storage than most people would ever need so some of that cost can go to a power efficient Optiplex and some to spare for a VPN leaving you with at least 32TB.

As mentioned, each additional streaming service is going to exponentially increase that cost, further justifying your investment, and the peace of mind that whatever service hasn’t removed it.

Technically you use your time to pay for “setting up and maintaining it” but… That’s some BS honestly. Plex/Jellyfin are set up once and forget about them. Us nerds put in time to curate and go the extra mile, but most people can very easily have a simple low power server running. If they can set up the *arrs (not really very hard) then good automation for them, if not manually searching for what you want as you want it is one more step than a subscription. More steps if you need to sign up for the first time ;)

Granted - a streaming service doesn’t charge you $325 for the initial server+storage, however streaming services also don’t give you a lot of things for 2.10 years of streaming so I’d say it’s worth the investment. And it definitely does not cost more to preserve your media if you subscribe to more than 1 service. If you subscribe to only one and cancel monthly and spend your time managing that then maybe. (but if you don’t need 4k and consume that little content, you may still be better off with a Pi-like and a hard drive…)

averyminya, (edited )

Because the uploaders are doing it for free and it’s been working the way it currently has been, free for 20 years.

If YT had made it their monetization scheme to charge users for an account - by all means. They did not, they set up the expectation of their product that it is free*.

  • with ads, which they show on repeat and do nothing but waste the users time. There’s no reason why we can’t use an adblock. If the uploader or YT wants compensation, they have ways of obtaining that, either via donations, patronship, or premium accounts.

There is no reason that YouTube should suddenly be for pay or forced ads to use it. If they wanted that, they should have started out like that. If they wanted to not run at a loss, they should have planned for that. They did not, and it’s not on the users to suddenly make up for that shortsightedness.

Tl;Dr, while you can set up a foundation and decide to change it decades later doesn’t mean anything. The expectation from the users has already been set.

averyminya,

This reads eerily similar, so basically the same parallel that the U.S. and Australia have been struggling with together for the last 20 years (and assuredly before then).

averyminya,

I more just didn’t want to list more than 3 companies, hence “whoever else”. You’re right that Google and Facebook are closer to the tendrils of Tencent than MS or Apple, or well, Apple at least.

averyminya, (edited )

This is an important difference that always gets left out in these articles.

Of course people will be anti-China when the CCP is making the movies (edit, I meant “moves” but movies works too haha). It’s one thing to ask for companies to make a version of media specifically for your country, but using your weight to make that the version? That is an insanely big red flag when Tencent has roots in everything and also goes by the whim of the party.

On the flip side, my friend from college moved to China a couple years after we graduated and he’s been doing really, really well. He loves it there. Ironically he ended up getting a job with Tencent and is a pretty big part of their last released Synced. So I’m glad he’s doing well, but it’s also been weird talking about certain topics with him. It was also weird when I was asking about how he was talking with me and he’s like “oh I just have to get on a VPN and etc so I that’s why I’m not around much, but it’s cool lol.” Kinda freaky when I also just see the articles about a company getting fined for using a VPN. I’m sure he’ll be fine but it’s still slightly worrying.

Which ultimately kind of sums up the situation. My friend loved his experience in China so much so that he moved back there seemingly permanently and set himself up with a nice life with the culture seeming to be a big part of that. And then there’s the actions of the government. Many of the same criticisms can absolutely be held toward the U.S. regarding housing and towards a not-so-small portion our political actions, however it seems the difference is that we don’t have a knitted corporate government quite yet. I dunno, the sway of Apple, MS, whoever else just doesn’t have the same weight as the CCP and Tencent. That generally seems to be peoples issue

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