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downdaemon, in But Windows 11 is so good!!11!1!
@downdaemon@lemmy.ml avatar

people who insist on using windows should just run it in a VM, it has suprisingly low overhead these days, you can even game with it if you insist, but i’m hearing wine/proton is getting good enough that it doesn’t even matter

Jumuta, (edited )

windows’ ram overhead is insane though, it’s not like I can’t run it but I wouldn’t want to daily drive it

Vendetta9076,
@Vendetta9076@sh.itjust.works avatar

Youre entirely correct about proton unless your kid wants to play fortnite

JPAKx4,

Literally the only reason I haven’t switched to a Linux distro. I hate anti cheats so much.

Grass,

To date I have not found any degree of enjoyment in any games with a windows only anti-cheat.

miss_brainfart,
@miss_brainfart@lemmy.ml avatar

I was going to say Siege, but they removed the ability to play as a team of exclusively shield recruits, I’ve heard.

aBundleOfFerrets,

Siege is honestly awful these days (not complaining about the sci-fi ops, reality is lame as shit why not spruce it up a bit) but what they have done to the UI and the queues (bring unranked back please) is honestly unforgivable and makes the game hard to play. (It isn’t all bad, but more bad than good)

JPAKx4,

I’m unlucky, I play Fortnite with my cousin in friends.

moon_matter,
@moon_matter@kbin.social avatar

You're still stuck when it comes to anti-cheat in multiplayer games. Some do allow it to work on Linux, but a significant number don't. Hopefully the tides slowly start to change thanks to the Steam Deck.

Pantherina,

I mean I do that currently and it is okay, but file transfer is still not working. The rest is, and I think it even was pretty much ootb, but the SPICE drivers are a real hassle to get installed, while it could be a one click solution?

(This “insert spice CD” thing has no option to download the driver ISO, right?)

Also windows11 is a bit bloated. Bulk crap uninstaller and ChrisTituses Winutil really help making it less fancy but more performant, or just usable.

But yes, VM is way better than hardware. If your Laptop supports that.

flashgnash,

There is an ISO somewhere, I always struggle to find it

After that you can just download from within the VM, mount from within windows and run the installer exe

Pantherina,

Yup did that, but this needs to go automatically, like its their stuff why cant they download it themselves?

flashgnash,

Who is they? There are many tools to run VMs on Linux not maintained by rhel

Pantherina,

Idk the devs of virt-manager I guess. Not sure if its a RHEL project

pineapplelover,

I need the stability and reliability of it not running in a vm because it’s for schoolwork

lntl, (edited ) in But Windows 11 is so good!!11!1!

OSHA would say having a Windows install is a potential hazard because it can become dangerous if activated. To remedy, you must remove the hazard.

Safety is no accident.

virtualbriefcase, in Gamepad not communicating with Game

Is it wireless? If so, and the controller supports it, try using it in wired mode. Sounds pointless, but have had issues with wireless controllers that worked fine when connected via USB.

milkjug, (edited ) in Just install EndeavorOS lol

Ex arch btw user here. I noped out and wiped after thinking I had it all nailed down, then I tried to connect my Bluetooth headphones and I came to a grand awakening. I am too old for this shit.

Installed Tumbleweed and been happy ever since.

interceder270,

I am too old for this shit.

You don’t even have to be old; just wise.

yum13241,

Tumbleweed is great, but I prefer EndeavorOS myself.

Agent641, (edited )

Starbucks coffee is great, but I prefer vicious, unrelenting cock and ball torture myself.

milkjug,

Hahaha this had me chuckling. Take my upvote you rascal.

yum13241,
  1. Stop supporting genocide (Starbucks supports Israel)
  2. EndeavorOS ain’t CBT.
al177,

Tumbleweed is boring, and that’s why it’s wonderful.

KISSmyOS, (edited )

My “I don’t have time for this” moment came when I tried to set up Nextcloud on Arch:
wiki.archlinux.org/title/Nextcloud

Meanwhile on Slackware:


<span style="color:#323232;">Configuration
</span><span style="color:#323232;">
</span><span style="color:#323232;">(1) Add the following in /etc/httpd/httpd.conf
</span><span style="color:#323232;">
</span><span style="color:#323232;">  Alias /nextcloud "/srv/httpd/htdocs/nextcloud/"
</span><span style="color:#323232;">  
</span><span style="color:#323232;">      Options +FollowSymlinks
</span><span style="color:#323232;">      AllowOverride All
</span><span style="color:#323232;">      
</span><span style="color:#323232;">        Dav off
</span><span style="color:#323232;">      
</span><span style="color:#323232;">      SetEnv HOME      "/srv/httpd/htdocs/nextcloud"
</span><span style="color:#323232;">      SetEnv HTTP_HOME "/srv/httpd/htdocs/nextcloud"
</span><span style="color:#323232;">  
</span><span style="color:#323232;">
</span><span style="color:#323232;">(2) In /etc/httpd/httpd.conf, enable mod_rewrite and PHP by uncommenting
</span><span style="color:#323232;">"LoadModule rewrite_module ..." and "Include /etc/httpd/mod_php.conf",
</span><span style="color:#323232;">then restart httpd.
</span>
milkjug,

ngl, I love how “I don’t give a fuck” the slackware authors are, they didn’t even bother with https on their official website.

KISSmyOS, (edited )

I love how their official “support” page links to a website that includes this:
www.steubentech.com/~talon/desktop/

cygnus,
@cygnus@lemmy.ca avatar

lmao this is exactly the image that would pop into my head if I imagine a Slackware user in 2023.

interceder270,

You don’t need SSL if you’re not exchanging sensitive information.

If they aren’t exchanging sensitive information, then it’s less not giving a fuck and more not using technologies ‘just because’ everyone else is.

It’s a smart move.

Chobbes,

I mean… I would consider anywhere that you might download software from sensitive. This isn’t really a smart move. And sure, the mirror’s page they link to uses https, but if the regular site doesn’t a man-in-the-middle could change the url and serve an official looking malicious version… I wouldn’t consider putting your users at an elevated risk when it’s relatively easy to set up TLS “a smart move”.

interceder270,

but if the regular site doesn’t a man-in-the-middle could change the url and serve an official looking malicious version

What do you think is stopping someone from doing this?

Chobbes,

Who says it hasn’t happened? :P

If it hasn’t I would just assume that Slackware isn’t a big enough target and that anybody in the position to man-in-the-middle a large number of people would have better targets. I mean, to be clear TLS is not a silver bullet either, but it goes a long way for ensuring the integrity of the data you receive over the internet in addition to hiding the contents.

Distros usually sign their ISOs with PGP as well (Slackware does this), so it’s a good idea to verify those signatures as it’s a second channel that you can use to double check the validity of the ISO (but I’m not sure many people actually do this). Of course, anybody can make PGP keys so you have to find out which key is actually supposed to be signing the iso, otherwise an attacker can just make a bogus key and tell you that that’s the Slackware signing key (on the official website too, because it doesn’t use tls!). The web of trust arguably helps some (though this can be faked as well unless you actually participate in key signing parties or something), and you can hope that the Slackware public key is mirrored in several places that you trust so you can compare them… but at the end of the day for most people all trust in the distribution comes from the domain name, and if you don’t have TLS certificates you’re kind of setting up a weak foundation of trust… Maybe it will be fine because you’re not a big enough target for somebody to bother, but in this day and age it’s pretty much trivial to set up TLS certificates and that gets you a far better foundation… why take the risk? Why is it smart to unnecessarily expose your users to more risk than necessary?

boomzilla,

I just installed Nextcloud on Arch and the official packages caused the most headaches I ever had within my 3 years of arch. In contrast I installed the official Jellyfin and Prometheus Server packages and they ran OOTB.

I ended up with not using the official packages but extracting the tar.bz2 into /var/www/nextcloud and slightly modifying the nginx config from their site. I had to move the inclusion of the MIME-Types file to a different block for nextcloud to deliver its CSS, SVGs and images. It wasn’t exactly straight-forward too considering permissions. I found it a beast compared to many other server software.

Pantherina,

Its probably just one package. I guess for example pacman -S plasma-desktop plasma-meta flatpak fish plasma-wayland-session sddm sddm-kcm &amp;&amp; systemctl enable --now sddm does the trick.

Archinstall with the entire plasma desktop is probably also nice, or just EndeavorOS which will be preconfigured

milkjug,

I actually did the whole KDE shebang with archinstall. I never really expected that Arch btw deigned it too opinionated to just provide an audio and Bluetooth interface. Instead I have to choose between pulse audio and pipewire and bluez and a bunch of others. I just didn’t have the patience nor time to look into what and why these options are presented, and this was after I already wasted days figuring how to get my pc to boot with my 12th gen Intel and Nvidia gpu combination.

Turns out there’s a bunch of kernel finagling you absolutely have to do first before it even decides to boot from the gpu and not the igpu. Oh well.

BetaDoggo_, in The Linux Kernel Preparing To Drop Infrastructure For Old &amp; Obsolete Graphics Drivers - Phoronix

Dropping support after only 25 years? I can’t believe Linux is contributing to planned obsolescence.

virtualbriefcase, in Mandrake Linux 10.0, from 2004. They still work too. Had to buy them on disc, slow dialup internet in those days.

Bringing back memories of my own. Mandrake in 2004 was a but before my time, but I’m sure I’ve still got my Ubuntu discs I downloaded at the local library and burned myself almost a decade after this Mandrake disk.

Skyhighatrist, in Window snapping

If i3 was a bit too involved for you but you generally like the idea of a tiling window manager you might prefer AwesomeWM.

NaoPb, in The Linux Kernel Preparing To Drop Infrastructure For Old &amp; Obsolete Graphics Drivers - Phoronix

What do you mean obsolete. I still use 'em.

joyjoy,

Maybe you’re obsolete!

NaoPb,

Damnit you may be right!

Objects, in The Linux Kernel Preparing To Drop Infrastructure For Old &amp; Obsolete Graphics Drivers - Phoronix

Damn I’m old. I had at least two of those cards

subignition,
@subignition@kbin.social avatar

I thought I was old, but I've only even heard of the 3dfx 😳

aard,
@aard@kyu.de avatar

I’m still angry at nvidia for buying their remains, and not doing anything useful with it.

3dfx had multi GPU support back then, it took quite a while afterwards until somebody else tried that.

EmbeddedEntropy, (edited )

I must be ancient then. I recognized, and I think used, all of those cards/chips.

Some personally. Some at work. At work I used to maintain and MS-DOS / early Windows graphics program. I had to test the program’s compatibility with a stack of graphics cards.

aard,
@aard@kyu.de avatar

I’ve been using (or, in some cases, trying to use) that when it was brand new. Kernel side was relatively easy - but there was a lot of compiling custom versions of XFree86 trying to get acceleration working properly.

On the one hand a bit sad to see that kind of history I’ve experienced myself go - on the other hand, it’s probably been a decade since I’ve last used something without KMS, and the ease of use of modern KMS drivers is way ahead of all the older stuff.

damium,

I’ve had a system in the late 90s with a 3dfx voodoo card. Also had a laptop with a SIS card from the early 2000 era.

The voodoo card was THE card to have it it’s day (mine was an older second hand system though). The SIS card… for some reason they decided that standard VESA mode probing wasn’t a thing they supported and would hardware crash when that API was used. I eventually got it working in Linux after patching xfree86 to not attempt probing when loading the VESA driver.

rattking,
@rattking@lemmy.ml avatar

I had a SIS card back in the day as well. I never got it working with Xfree86 itself but I did find a proprietary xserver called Accelerated-X that supported it.

damium,

I think I remember running into that as well but for whatever reason I couldn’t get accelerated-x working with the opengl libraries I was using for school. Likely the issue was just a lack of understanding on my part as I don’t think I had a good grasp of the Linux library loader until well after I graduated.

Lulzagna, in Just install EndeavorOS lol

Use endeavour if you’re new

authed, in But Windows 11 is so good!!11!1!

wish you could install only security updates

LUHG_HANI,
@LUHG_HANI@lemmy.world avatar

Long term service branch exists on 10.

maccentric,

Only for Enterprise tho

EmperorHenry,
@EmperorHenry@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

You can delay all other updates with the group policy editor. You can disable preview builds and you and delay quality updates by 30 days and delay feature updates by 365 days. The bugs are always worked out by then.

Holzkohlen,

OR they could stop shipping broken updates for their $100 ad-infested operating system. Just a a thought.

Karyoplasma,

My tinfoil hat theory is that they ship broken updates on purpose to feign how fast and hard they work on fixing them. See, customers, we really care!

authed,

thats good but Im also worried about the useless changes that they make… so after 365 days I would start getting constant useless updates anyways

EmperorHenry,
@EmperorHenry@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

Feature updates are necessary after a while. There’s SOME important stuff in there. And if you wait a whole year before installing the new one, all the bugs will be fixed by then

carpelbridgesyndrome, in Just install EndeavorOS lol

I will not stand slander of the arch wiki.

Also start with Linux Mint XFCE (unless they’ve fixed the stability problems with cinnamon)

chicken,

When I started using LM I had a lot of problems, but switching to XFCE fixed most of them

db2, (edited ) in The Linux Kernel Preparing To Drop Infrastructure For Old &amp; Obsolete Graphics Drivers - Phoronix

so any remaining users have a few more years to get a new graphics card.

Anyone running a Voodoo is doing so because they want to. Dropping support is bullshit.

NaoPb,

I agree.

conciselyverbose,

Then pay someone to do the work.

Supporting obscure trash isn't worth development time.

Nougat,

Voodoo cards are worth money to the right people. They're used in a bunch of coin-op arcade games.

ra1d3n,

And these machines are going to upgrade to kernel 6.8?

jackpot,
@jackpot@lemmy.ml avatar

why on earth do arcade machines need kernel updates? the feds gonna hack into the highscores lmfao

snaptastic,

Do those arcades run Linux?

Nougat,

I bet you're fun at parties.

snaptastic,

Seems like you’re annoyed that I pointed out that what you were saying was irrelevant? And so you reply with more irrelevant crap (on a very nerdy, not-fun-at-parties internet forum for Linux discussion)? Let me know if I got that wrong.

Nougat, (edited )

Somebody mentioned Voodoo cards, I had a bit of information that related to that. That's how discussions work; they kind of go where they go.

But I'll make absolutely sure to get your permission before I comment again.

falsem,

Volunteer to maintain the code?

DrRatso, (edited )

So just don’t upgrade the kernel

db2,

Then 0-day can become known vulnerability. Yay?

ICastFist,
@ICastFist@programming.dev avatar

What are you doing that is so crucial to keep a 20+ year old piece of consumer hardware connected to the internet? Honest question

db2,

To answer the question as given:

lyonsden.net/getting-an-amiga-a1200-online-part-1…

hackaday.com/…/apple-ii-web-server-written-in-bas…

Because. The answer is because.

And if you have a machine that is more capable than those by default then the OS software artificially disabling its use is pretty fucked up.

fuckwit_mcbumcrumble,

If you’re doing it for the memes then you don’t really need to worry about malware. Your machine is probably too old for anything that’s still floating out there to even work on it.

ICastFist,
@ICastFist@programming.dev avatar

So, there’s nothing actually crucial, it’s for tinkering. I doubt either the Apple II or the Amiga you linked are going to be secure.

yianiris,
@yianiris@kafeneio.social avatar

Many people browse 4-5 pages a day, see a few emails, print a few pdfs, and a core2duo, or x4, for 40#/$/Eu a box run flawlessly with linux and xfce/lxde for example.
Even video-conferencing works fine.

Why not?

@ICastFist @db2

bruhduh,
@bruhduh@lemmy.world avatar

Driver code is still there, you can add it back if you want, same with ide drivers and such, support was removed but code still exists, just add it and compile your own kernel, there are alot of tutorials in internet about it

db2,

Go add a 2.4 era driver to a modern kernel and see how that goes.

bruhduh,
@bruhduh@lemmy.world avatar

Then support will be until 2033 when 6.1 slts support will end

fornax,
@fornax@feddit.nl avatar

The drivers were removed in 6.3. Debian 12 is still running on 6.1. Debian 12 just came out and still has many years of support ahead of it (at least 5). You can get plenty of use out of these cards before they stop working.

db2,

But they’ll stop working due to artificial causes.

rasensprenger,

Someone needs to maintain them for them to keep working. Nobody else is willing to do that anymore, but you can still volunteer as a maintainer. If you don’t, it’s as much your fault as anyone elses.

db2,

There’s a big difference between dropping a driver and dropping the ability to have the driver. I’ve compiled plenty of drivers.

bouh,

I would suppose anyone running a computer with these relics can recompile a kernel to get these drivers back

KingThrillgore, in The Linux Kernel Preparing To Drop Infrastructure For Old &amp; Obsolete Graphics Drivers - Phoronix
@KingThrillgore@lemmy.ml avatar

Oh no, the kernel will lose a whopping 200k SLOC!

jackpot,
@jackpot@lemmy.ml avatar

SLOC?

unique_hemp,

source lines of code

pastermil,

Out of 27 million lines of code.

Killing_Spark,

Which makes it 1% total. Which is a lot for one single change

MonkderZweite,

Most of it in drivers.

You know, like the light novel with 12GB, 11.9GB of it in png.

avidamoeba, (edited ) in The Linux Kernel Preparing To Drop Infrastructure For Old &amp; Obsolete Graphics Drivers - Phoronix
@avidamoeba@lemmy.ca avatar

So much for the legendary hardware support of Linux!

Edit: Forgot “/s”, but look at this lively discussion!

Lettuceeatlettuce,
@Lettuceeatlettuce@lemmy.ml avatar

Lol you haven’t upgraded your GPU since the late 90’s?

db2,

You know there’s a whole hobby of keeping older hardware running, right?

Lettuceeatlettuce, (edited )
@Lettuceeatlettuce@lemmy.ml avatar

You know that you can use older versions of the Linux kernel, right?

db2,

You know security vulnerabilities are a thing, right?

patatahooligan,
@patatahooligan@lemmy.world avatar

Linux 6.1 will be maintained for another 10 years by the CIP. The hardware in question will be almost 40 years old at that point. I don’t have a violin small enough for users losing free support after 40 years from maintainers who most likely don’t even own the same hardware to test on…

interdimensionalmeme,

On the other hand, they were probably unchanged for decades. Did anything really change, or is this just a case of we need to remove 500k lines of code, what is most useless ? Let’s cut that.

In other words, removed because it’s a KPI to remove lines, and this makes number go up.

saigot, (edited )

So if it’s been unchanged for decades then you can just add it yourself and recompile the kernel. Elsewhere you argue that you can’t just add old drivers to a newer kernel, which implies these drivers require some nontrivial amount of maintaince. Which is it.

patatahooligan,
@patatahooligan@lemmy.world avatar

Keeping code around isn’t free. Interfaces change, regressions pop up. You have to occasionally put in work just to keep it in a working state. Usually in cases like this there are discussions on the mailing list about who is going to maintain them and nobody volunteers. You can do that if you’re so passionate about keeping these drivers around.

interdimensionalmeme,

They were fine all this time, what changed suddenly ? I bet it’s the security nerds stirring shit, making it all a liability and easier deleted than fixed.

radioactiveradio, (edited )

You know there’s nothing to gain by hacking those old systems, right?

Lettuceeatlettuce,
@Lettuceeatlettuce@lemmy.ml avatar

I know what you mean, I’m so pissed that my 1978 Space Invaders arcade machine doesn’t even support WiFi-6.

BeardedGingerWonder,

Fuckin a

Bitrot,
@Bitrot@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

If only they contributed to the kernel maintenance workload.

axum,
@axum@kbin.social avatar

You're free to use legacy kernels or run your own fork.

demonsword, (edited )
@demonsword@lemmy.world avatar

I doubt any hardware 25+ years can even run a modern vanilla linux kernel, you’d have to compile it yourself with some serious customization for it even work

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