I have been distro hopping for about 2 weeks now, there’s always something that doesn’t work. I thought I would stick with Debian and now I haven’t been able to make my printer work in it, I think I tried in another distro and it just worked out of the box, but there’s always something that’s broken in every distro.
I’m sorry I’m just venting, do you people think Ubuntu will work for me? I think I will try it next.
You will get tons of distro recommendations, so here is one more: OpenSUSE, then use the YAST GUI GTK application select Yast Printer it has a GUI tool for all kinds of printer setup options and will show recommended drivers based on printer type, it then installs them via that GUI. Not to be confused with the regular printer settings app you see in most distros.
How long ago? Everyone has an opinion and preference, but SUSE and RHEL are the only two certifed distros for corporate/ enterprise use of Teamcenter PLM and NX CAD…so it cannot be as “badly” built as you feel it is because it has to perform everyday with the least amount of issues.
I honestly believe Red Hat has a policy that everything should pull in Gnome. I have had headless RHEL installs and half the CLI tools require Gnome Keyring (even if they don't deal with secrets or store any). Back in RHEL 7, Kate the KDE based Text Editor pulled in a bunch of GTK dependencies somehow.
Certification is really someone paid to go through a process and so its designed so they pass.
Think about the people you know who are Agile/Cloud/whatever certified and how all it means is they have learnt the basic examples.
Its no different when a business gets certified.
The only reason people care is because they can point to the cert if it all goes wrong
I wrote a long reply but looks like posting it glitched. I’ll try shortening. I should have noted that the Certification on SUSE and RHEL, is also a certification compatibility matrix. distro ver to software ver, and Siemens needs stable Windows, SUSE, RHEL releases to code to. Trying to install/running on other distros fails in many areas (even with an experiences guru trying fixes). They have a symbiotic relationahip with those curated distros to ensure it doesnt give downtime to a large enterprise. It is not just a piece of paper saying yes we tested the software install here is your signoff. Personally I did get it running on OpenSUSE for obvious reasons.
Limiting support of software to specific software configurations makes sense.
Its stuff like Debian might be using Python 3.8 Ubuntu Python 3.9, OpenSuse Python 3.9, etc.. Your application might use a Python 3.9 requiring library and act odd on 3.8 but fine on 3.7, etc.. so only supporting X distributions let you make the test/QA process sane.
This is also why Docker/Flatpack exist since you can define all of this.
However the normal mix is RHEL/Suse/Ubuntu because those target businesses and your target market will most likely be running one.
Yeah it is a Known Known and those 3 distros have tried and true reliability. The term certified is what they call it “Certified to run on X” and “Compatibility CertifIcation” it was in response to OP asking if linux is used in corporate world. It is, and for larger operations it is the 3 you mention. Personally I think Ubuntu hasn’t made it into the Corporate Desktop apps like SUSE/REL because you install it and have a hairy hippo or faceted cougar head as the backdrop, just doesn’t sit well with CEO stuffed shirt types when looking for a professional software.
Why would you use Debian, it has the oldest packages and kernel of all distros. I would maybe run that on a server, but probably just use Ubuntu LTS instead.
For desktop you should try Pop OS. Really good distro from System 76.
Stay away from Ubuntu, it’s very buggy for desktop. I tried it six months ago, fresh install, and the console app wouldn’t even open on a fresh install. No error message, just didn’t open. Great impression…
Care to explain how you come to your harsh judgment of Debian? I’m not a fan of using it as a desktop OS either, but every other day you hear people talking about Debian having newer packages than Arch on occasion. If anything, Debian, Arch, Fedora and derivatives should give you the most recent packages.
I don’t know which people you are listening to, but Debian does not have newer packages than arch. It has older packages than almost all other distros. You can see this on distrowatch for yourself also.
The idea of Debian is that old = stable, which I don’t agree with personally. As an example, users of Debian are reporting tons of KDE Plasma bugs that was already fixed, but because they are running an ancient version, they still have the bugs.
But it depends. It’s correct that new versions of plasma had new bugs, that was fixed in the coming weeks or months.
I guess a better way of describing Debian is that it has old bugs instead of new ones, since it stays on older versions.
Debian has an effective Rolling distribution through testing than can get ahead of Arch.
At some point they freeze the software versions in testing and look for Release Critical and Major bugs. Once they have shaken everything and submitted fixes where possible. It then becomes stable.
The idea is people have tested a set baseline of software and there are no known major bugs.
For the 4-5 releases Debian has released every 2 years (Similar to Ubuntu LTS). Debian tends to align its release with LTS Kernel and Mesa releases so there have been times the latest stable is running newer versions than Ubuntu and the newest software crown switches between Ubuntu LTS and Debian each year.
For some the priority to run software that won't have major bugs, that is what Debian, Ubuntu LTS and RHEL offer.
Debian has an effective Rolling distribution through testing than can get ahead of Arch.
I wouldn’t call a distro “branch” where maintainers say “don’t use this, it’s not officially supported and may even be insecure” an “effective” distribution. I’d consider it a test bed.
Debian tends to align its release with LTS Kernel and Mesa releases so there have been times the latest stable is running newer versions than Ubuntu
Ubuntu LTS.
Ubuntu’s regular channel releases every 6 months, similar to Fedora or NixOS. That in itself is already a “stable” distro, just not long-time stable (LTS).
So Debian can for a short span of time after release be about as fresh as stable distros which is …kinda obvious? I would not consider a month or so every 2 years to be significant to even mention though, especially if you consider that Debian users aren’t the kind to jump onto a new release early on.
For some the priority to run software that won’t have major bugs, that is what Debian, Ubuntu LTS and RHEL offer.
That’s not the point of those distros at all. The point is to have the same features aswell as bugs for longer periods of time. This is because some functionality the user wants could depend on such bugs/unintended behaviour to be present.
The fact that huge regressions have to be weeded out more carefully before release in LTS is obvious if you know that it’d be expected for those “bugs” to remain present throughout the release’s support window.
As an example, users of Debian are reporting tons of KDE Plasma bugs that was already fixed, but because they are running an ancient version, they still have the bugs.
The idea is that those bug fixes would be backported as patches; old feature version + new security/bug fixes.
In practice, that’s really expensive to do, so often times bug fixes simply aren’t backported and I don’t even want to know the story of security fixes though I’d hope they do better there.
Yeah, Ubuntu works well for me. Ubuntu is operated by the Canonical corporation, which some people don’t like. If you would prefer a community-run Ubuntu-like OS, Mint is just as good as Ubuntu. Fedora is also one of the best community-run distros that always just works, especially when running the Gnome desktop environment.
I will say that until last month when I upgraded to Ubuntu version 23.10 (technically Xubuntu), Ubuntu always just worked with all of my hardware. But for some reason this last upgrade broke my wake-from-suspend function. This is the first problem I have had with it in many, many years, so I might actually switch to Mint or Fedora myself. EDIT: I figured out that the problem was being caused by the power manager daemon, I worked around this problem by disabling display power management (dims the display if you don’t use it for a while) in the Xfce settings manager, “Power Manager” panel, “Display” tab, switching the “Display power management” switch off.
There is not a single distro where everything works out of the box. I would be very surprised if even Windows or MacOS work exactly like you expect, the second you boot into them the first time.
I like Arch / EndeavourOS, but you will definitely need quiet some configuration for them. If you want more user-friendly or more up-to-date Debian, try Sparky Linux. It’s honestly quite good. Instead of Ubuntu you might want to give Mint a try. Many fancy it as a more open and less corpo alternative.
Ubuntu itself is alright, but it’s being criticised for pushing anti-consumer moves lately (i.e. forcing Snaps and telemetry onto them). Also, updates on Ubuntu are extremely slow in my experience. Maybe that has changed, but in some areas I doubt it.
That is absolutely not true, Ubuntu has been a lot more out of the box experience for almost 2 decades. Thing is people are already familiar on how to do things on Windows, and most laptops already come with windows and drivers pre installed. Windows 10 was the first version to have a driver manager that could find the correct drivers for you, still you need to waste a few hours and reboots to get all of the drivers and updates.
As a very casual user, I can say that windows has intuitive solutions to issues that may arise. At least there are some things users can try by just using logic.
In Linux, solving issues requires you to type in the Romanian national anthem backwards, speperated by ; and the ocational “sudo” and “apt get”
If you tried to stumble your way around the UI on Linux you’ll probably find very similar UI paths to solve any issue. The thing is that Linux has several different UIs so when you ask in a forum it’s easier to give you the UI-agnostic solution. Let’s take a common issue with an apparent arcane solution, e.g. change your screen positions. On windows you do this by going start > settings > system > display and adjust them there, on Linux you’ll get given an xrandr command like xrandr --output HDMI-0 --left-of DP-2, but on KDE you go start > system settings > display and monitor and adjust them there, but because you might be using Gnome, Lxde, XFCE, Mate, etc (all of which have a very similarly intuitive path to adjust this) it’s easier to give you a command that does it.
For the first several years I used Linux I almost didn’t touched the terminal, and that was a long time ago so it’s not that it’s not possible or recent, it’s just that because windows has only a single graphical interface you get answers for it, but if you ask things on generic Linux forums you’ll get generic Linux responses, if you had to do things without asking anyone online they’re very much the same.
There is not a single distro where everything works out of the box.
On the other hand, if hardware manufacturers or software developers test their products with one Linux distribution, it will be Ubuntu. So that’s generally the safest bet - and that’s coming from someone who doesn’t use Ubuntu.
Inform us on which distros you’ve tried. If possible, for each one of them list the following:
What exactly didn’t work?
Did you try any troubleshooting?
On a more general note, you shouldn’t feel the need to switch distros even if other distros might offer more convenient solutions.
Story timeWhen I was new to Linux, I wanted to rely on the Chromium browser for cloud gaming through Nvidia GeForce NOW’s web platform. For some reason, I just wasn’t able to get this to work on Fedora. Somehow, while still being mostly a newbie, I stumbled upon Distrobox and decided to give it a go in hopes of allowing me to overcome the earlier challenge by benefiting of the ArchWiki and the AUR through an Arch distrobox. And voila; -without too much effort- it just worked. More recently, after I’ve become slightly more knowledgeable on Linux, I just rely on a flatpak to get the same work done.
Moral of the story would be that there are a lot of different ways that enable one to overcome challenges like these. And unless you feel the need to go with a system that’s (mostly) managed for you (à la uBlue)^[1]^, you will face issues every now and then. And the only way to deal with them would be to either setup^[2]^ (GRUB-)Btrfs+Timeshift/Snapper (or similar solutions) such that it automatically snapshots a working state that you might rollback to whenever something unfortunate befalls your system or to simply become ever so better equipped in troubleshooting them yourself.
But therefore demands from you to engage with the system in a specific (mostly unique) way.
(Looks at laptop I’m using to reply to this that’s running Debian)
Server OS? Debian? Yes it is, but it’s also a Desktop and Laptop OS and many other things. Everything on this HP laptop just worked, including the function buttons. There’s a reason it’s such a well used distro, and it’s not just because it’s good for servers.
I never said it can’t work, but try using MX for a bit and tell me it doesn’t make Debian much better as a workstation. MX tools are enough of a reason for me to always pick it over Debian in that scenario.
There’s a reason it’s such a well used distro, and it’s not just because it’s good for servers.
What are some workstation specific reasons it’s well used?
I’m pretty sure stuff like function keys are just DE defaults. I’ve installed default gnome and they worked.
The main reason people use Debian, no matter what they use it for, is stability. While it’s great that nothing ever breaks, you’re also receiving nonessential updates every ~2 years.
That’s not an issue on a server that’s running mysql released 7 years ago, but you probably need to use flatpak and guix to keep specific tools relatively up to date. You’re less likely going to need those tools when using a workstation focused distro like Fedora, that’s released on a fixed 6 month cycle.
On top of that, workstation focused distros also integrate flatpak. Since synaptic only knows about apt, MX improves on it by only requiring you to enable flathub as a source to get a unified search/install/update.
Small stuff like that is important for a beginner that’s asking for distro advice. They’ll most likely want to click through a pretty gui, and Debian is lacking on that front because it’s a server focused distro.
Yes, there is always something that won’t work. This often happens with Windows (not too often, but it happens), but most often with Macs. Linux is quite buggy in the userspace area, I usually find bugs or crashes within an hour of using any linux distro. The one with the FEWER bugs is definitely Debian. But it does that by not using hacks or beta drivers or software. This creates a rock solid architecture, but some hardware won’t work (in my case, it was the sound chip for an intel J-series cpu that required a third party patch to work and recompile the kernel – while Ubuntu ships with that patch by default, but ubuntu has way more other bugs all around).
So at the end, you will have to ask yourself if you want Linux because it’s the right thing to do and use, or you just don’t want to be bothered with ideology, and just use Windows and be done with it. I’ve asked myself that question and the answer is two fold: as a daily browser laptop, that doesn’t depend on third party hardware, I just use my Macbook Air. It’s a great laptop to have around in front of the TV, or traveling. For third party hardware dependency, and video editing, I use Windows with an nvidia card. For everything else, I use Linux. I have 8-9 computers, most run Linux. I create databases with it, I do some photo editing, financials etc.
Ubuntu actually worked for some people, who, for example, had trouble with PopOS! and getting highest refresh rate on multiple monitors. So yeah, if Ubuntu doesn’t work, try Zorin OS, and if that doesn’t work, try Manjaro, and if Manjaro doesn’t work, there so many more to try out!
Most operating systems mostly work find something that has a release cadence you like and is close to what you want then you will have to customize it to fit your needs
Linux mint I would say its the one that tends to have better support in a large amount of hardware and it was the first one that I was able to stick with
There are two more I’d reccomend as its what my family and friends have been using and have ran into literally, zero issues.
Linux mint (specifically cinnamon edition) is very stable, and customizable if you’re into that sorta thing, you can install custom kernels and get greatly improved performance out of gaming if thats your thing. It’s built off of Ubuntu (but just better) so there’s great support for it, especially with devices such as printers.
Fedora Kinoite is a solid, also well supported, immutable distribution which will either make your life easier, or more difficult.
Immutable means you can’t change anything in your root directory, so basically your “C: Drive”. You still have a regular file system and can install all your apps, but the operating system stays the same as everyone else’s and is something that by design, never breaks and “just works”, and is what I personally use.
Pop_OS is definitely another option if you have “newer” hardware and Linux Mint doesn’t work for you and you don’t like the immutability of Fedora Kinoite (you can always try regular Fedora KDE). But I’d personally reccomend just the first two. But Pop is also built off of Ubuntu, so you still get that great hardware support.
But please, avoid stock Ubuntu. Ubuntu has far gone away from being a beginner, “just works” distro.
Hope this helped! Please reply or message me if you have any issues or are confused, or you can always ask for some more help within this community as well!
Ubuntu will work, sticking to Ubuntu based system is good to have stuff just work. For Gnome UI just use Ubuntu, for KDE use Kubuntu.
If you don’t like Ubuntu as a company you can always use these instead: PopOS for Gnome and KDE Neon for KDE. Both are very stable with great support. I’ve been running KDE Neon for years now.
Hi, I tried endeavor, Linux mint, manjaro, mx Linux, and I don’t remember what else. I have a question, is Gnome really popular? For me it doesn’t make sense, it feels it was made for tablets or something like that.
Absolutely, it’s very popular. It’s pretty similar to MacOS since it comes with a global menu by default. It’s pretty popular since the design is very consistent and looks good. They also have excellent support for new features (except Wayland). Gnome is popular with people that only want to customise the most important ports and just want a standard OS that is well thought out and accessible.
I do watch a lot of content about Linux distros, but I’m not a Gnome user so I can’t give good examples of customisation and differences between KDE and Gnome.
Btw, can replicate the same layout on KDE because of the high level of customization it provides. It can all done through the UI, as all OS changes should be done.
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