Maybe this is why I’ve been so ready to fully embrace Lemmy for my internetting. It’s the opposite of enshittified, as FOSS often is.
I’ll admit though, I pay for YouTube and get more bang for the buck than any other money I spend on entertainment. I’ve had it for a while though, and did not sign up because of their renewed war on ad blocking. Plus it’s nice that the creators get paid from my view, even though it’s not much.
I pay for YouTube as well, it’s worth it bc of YouTube music which I like better than Spotify, I just need podcasts to get on board and we will be good to go. I will add YouTube is the only media I pay for (other than peacock for 1 month a year to watch tour de France)
I’ve not had good luck with Firefox on mobile, I use duckduckgo. I’m not forcing anyone to do what I do. YouTube is my main source of media for the most part. I use it on my smarts TV’s in my house - and I haven’t set up computers on all TV’s yet… So it is what it is and it works for me.
Edit: down voting my personal opinion and what I choose to spend my money on for my own convenience isn’t going to change my mind… Just saying
That’s one of the big values for me, the effortless smart device support. Sure I know tech shit and I block ads in every browser I use, but it’s nice when members of my family can just use the YouTube app, full featured, on whatever TV/phone/tablet they have access to at the moment. It’s not a matter of whether I can watch YouTube for free without seeing ads, it’s a question of whether the convenience and creator support are worth the cost of a drive thru meal per month. Add in YouTube music and I don’t even think about it any more.
It’s an ease of use thing, kind of like how Steam ended PC game piracy for many people.
Oh I think I know what you mean. DDG + Firefox has some weird behavior on YouTube. I can watch the videos but if I wanna properly load the page it gives me a request failure.
It’s kind of frustrating on mobile. Have you tried loading through a different search engine? It’s not a big issue for me but it’s something I experience too as I’m a DDG user
Direct revenue is logically a better model for creators, but I don’t like that the share of youtube premium revenue is determined by a black box. If it’s distributed according to my total monthly watch time, how can anyone say for sure whether the direct revenue split for a given channel >= potential advertising revenue had I watched without premium or adblock? I don’t think even creators could tell you based on the analytics available to them via Youtube.
I canceled and set up memberships on a few channels instead. That way I actually get something out of it (member perks), and I know that at least my favourite creators get 70% of those amounts. Also, sponsorblock
Thing is, most people don’t want to pay for services that to them seemed to be free since forever. And this creates collective social pressure to follow suit. Nothing a big company offers is ever free. You’re just paying in alternate currency.
It’s gross though. Say you started to pay, they would still force ads into their product because they’re greedy and demanding more money. We’re seeing this with streaming sites now.
The funny thing is with youtube, for example, I am a premium user. I deactivated all tracking of my habits on there. Now I am greeted, as a homepage, with nothing else than a call to action to reactivate said tracking. As a paying customer I see less (as in none at all) content on the homepage than an anonymous user would. I am subbed to 170+ channels. Yet they tell me they cannot come up with suggestions unless they can track my every step on their platform. sus. And when saying funny I mean extremely aggravating.
I’ve seen you a bit on a few of these posts, always defending these companies’ behavior. I tend to disagree with your stance. While I do understand that the infrastructure behind the sites I use is not free (trust me, I run some sites myself and my pitiful little things are expensive), I also do not think punishing users for adblock is justified. Neither is scraping as much data as can be gathered for further sale. Advertising can be very intrusive anymore and data collection from sites is no different. It’s not that the sites want to make money; it’s their insistence that the user is the product. Just pay walling the service would be much less scummy and unjustifiable than this nonsense.
It’s like they’re trying to show you a party that’s going on in some private location, but you don’t get in, because you don’t have an account. Well then, they say, if the account is free and you still don’t make it, it’s not our fault. So they close you out.
You telling them to “just copy and paste the content” is like telling them to send you a photo/video of the party. It’s not the same as being there.
Yep, whenever people text me an Instagram or TikTok URL, I just scroll past it. I don’t even bother to find out what it’s supposed to be about, it’s completely inconsequential to me.
I definitely think there’s room to invent some other social websites like Lemmy; things that can A) Monetize themselves in some way other than ads, B) Formulate the way users use them so that they’re resistant to bots, C) Promote well-thought discussion points instead of just regurgitation.
I’m seriously considering something like say, a site that requires users to record a short webcam video introducing themselves before they can post. Obviously, that wouldn’t be a good venue for anyone very privacy-focused, but perhaps you get the idea.
Monetizing through ads isn’t the problem: The problem is that the companies keep getting greedier and seeing the new ways they can exploit the userbase.
Greed isn’t the problem, per se – it’s that outside of the biggest sites, which could hoover up ad targeting data of hundreds of millions to billions and sell that data through their own internal ad platform – the model was never viable to begin with. Notice that the enshittification really took off all soon as interest rates jumped? Tech startups have all been floating along on easy money, but now that loans aren’t basically free, VC dollars are drying up. Companies that could previously offset their capital burn with yet another round of investment now suddenly need to make money on their own merit, and are finding that they have to cut service to the bone and monetize the bejeezus out of what’s left if they have any chance of survival.
Remember when ads were just those animated gif boxes on either side of the content you actually consumed? Pepperidge Farms remembers.
Then they became annoying popups, to the point that EVERY browser ships with popups blocked by default. Now it’s all javascript occupying your screen everywhere. Plus all those invasive “Notifications”
I miss forums. Not that they disappeared completely but that used to be the go-to for good info. Still is maybe, cause I’ve read through a lot of garbage trying to learn about something pretty simple and then hit a forum post that’s like “well it depends if it’s early- or late-season blight”. What? The twenty garden blog posts I studied never mention such a distinction. But there’s Jimmy in Mt Carmel Indiana breaking it down.
One thing that’s actually better for all that’s worse is the Discord means one login for everything. Back then you had to register to every forum even if you only needed one file and never came back again.
And this is exactly why we won’t actually get any new special projects, because anything which can’t be easily monetized will be treated as competition and ruined deliberately, and anything which can be easily monetized will be purchased and worn like a skin suit by greedy corpos the way the current Internet is being used.
Man, what are you talking about? YouTube has always been slow. It got even worse when they forced everyone to use dash playback, and that was over a decade ago.
Listen here my dude my brain is still stuck to the time when YouTube allowed you to make a fancy fully customized channel page which was later culled go make way for the bland mobile friendly interface ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ
I’m not internet god, but I have a possible first step forward with a protocol and working implementation ;
Decentralized websites, encrypted and takedown safe. Free, FOSS and based on reciprocal sharing. Nothing very complicated, you need to forward a port and run a program.
I’m just a geek though, not a manager or marketing person so I’d love some people checking it out.
So true. I’d like to add that also because of ads, social media and other websites are full of nonsense clickbait content, and every part of the user experience is designed to keep you scrolling through said content. Even with an adblocker, it’s like wading through a swamp to find anything actually worth looking for. (Of course, there are still websites with no ads, and even the ones with ads aren’t always horrible. But generally, shit sucks.)
I believe you’re referring to “the algorithm”. Which is usually just code for “a bunch of people that view and engage with the content you have viewed/engaged with also viewed/engaged with this”
I understand what they’re doing and I understand why, but sometimes, I just want a reverse chronological feed of my friends activities, so I can keep up to date with their most recent life events.
I fear that part of the reason is that it isn’t big enough yet for AstroTurf interest groups to care enough to invest into it. Although maybe AstroTurfing isn’t included in the enshittification label?
For social media to work in the future I think there needs to be additional safeguards that keep enshittification at bay. But picking them will be a delicate art.
Speaking of AstroTurf, they certainly are the leaders of synthetic turf. Their artificial turf is not only aesthetically appealing, but is designed to withstand the demands of the game.
between lemmy, mastodon and my own nerd projects, I’m having more fun on the internet than I have since the 90’s. so, while I hate the enshittification, the side effect has been me rediscovering what was so fun in these tubes…
And you know what would fix it? Building your own website that doesn’t do those things and making the people around you engage with it instead of you capitulating to them, but why put effort into anything when you can sit around and complain about it and do nothing about it?
It’s not a solution, but as a mitigation, I’m trying to push the idea of an internet right of way into the public consciousness. Here’s the thesis statement from my write-up:
I propose that if a company wants to grow by allowing open access to its services to the public, then that access should create a legal right of way. Any features that were open to users cannot then be closed off so long as the company remains operational. We need an Internet Rights of Way Act, which enforces digital footpaths. Companies shouldn’t be allowed to create little paths into their sites, only to delete them, forcing guests to pay if they wish to maintain access to the networks that they built, the posts that they wrote, or whatever else it is that they were doing there.
As I explain in the link, rights of way already exist for the physical world, so it’s easily explained to even the less technically inclined, and give us a useful legal framework for how they should work.
I agree but I think it needs to be slightly more practical. Sometimes a line of business just dries up and it would damage the company to try and keep that service going. It wouldn’t make sense to force a company into bankruptcy to keep one line going that few people use anymore.
Earlier today, though, I was thinking about sunsetting guarantees. Companies can and should decommission things when it makes business sense, but the user generated content it has gathered shouldn’t just disappear, and they shouldn’t be allowed to destroy the user experience of things people have bought.
So I would propose rules like:
If a service is being decomissioned or an entry point to that service being shut down, the content available on that service must be made available as a bulk export. Personal data, such as account data, messages, etc should be made available to users individually, while publicly accessible content should be made available publicly.
If a public service is being taken down completely, source code should be made available publicly.
If the service for a device which was physically purchased by consumers is being taken down, an update must be provided to allow users to use a local or alternative backend service. The source code for the service must be released publicly.
If features are being removed from a service which backed a physically purchased device, an update must be offered which allows users to point to a local or alternative service for either all functionality or, at minimum, the removed functionality. Looking at you, Google, keep removing features…
Yeah, as always, the devil is in the details. For now I think that we need a simple and clear articulation of the main idea. In the exceedingly unlikely event that it ever gets traction, I look forward to hammering out the many nuances.
Web 2.0 desperately clinging to life. FOSS self hosted web is the future. Internet speeds are fast enough on home networks that self hosting is perfectly viable for essentially everything, and for the few things that can’t be self hosted by just anyone, FOSS alternatives and work arounds to existing paid services exist.
Internet is becoming harder to monopolize, and increasing amounts of power and control are being handed back to the working class online. FOSS has become a movement that has grown exponentially over the last few years.
Their next recourse will be attempting to make jail time a thing for piracy. Both for hosting it and downloading it.
That would require every government worldwide to be on board. Then you’ll have a couple holdouts, and they’ll take in the dough from everyone wanting to host their content there. While there is a mile-long wishlist from the powers that be, they’re still going to chase what’s profitable.
Have you ever pirated something? If so, have you ever been sent to jail for it?
I’m not talking about hosting companies. Yes, I am aware that prosecution exists for them and has been a thing a long time. I’m saying they’re going to start pushing for end users to face jail time as well. It’s the only real recourse they have.
It’s not so simple. I’ve been trying to go the foss self-hosted way, as well as help p2p projects, and I got stuck because I’m behind a cgnat, unable to forward ports, and my shitty isp has no ipv6. I can’t afford vpns at the moment, so I got stuck. Besides, all that needed a lot of tech skills most people won’t have. This is a serious barrier of entry for a lot of people.
Ha! Recently went to breakfast with a couple of new neighbors (partners).
They were asking me what apps I enjoyed and I told them that I WAS enjoying Apollo. Told them I left Reddit. They sort looked at me. They later said they both worked at home. Their job was creating ad space for the web. One of them gave me the enshitification face. Sigh.
Recently went to breakfast with a couple of new neighbors (partners). They were asking me what apps I enjoyed and I told them that I WAS enjoying Apollo.
Lol at first I interpreted this as the waiter asking you what appetizers you wanted
For me the internet is still just about bearable but only because of the following…
Firefox + unlock origin for web browsing.
RedReader for Reddit when I occasionally need to go there.
Lemmy for the best Reddit alternative.
Revanced and NewPipe for YouTube.
Recently moved from Google podcasts to Podcast Republic after Google moved podcasts to you tube music.
Never had Twitter, Facebook, Snapchat, TikTok, Instagram.
Email is still functional and necessary so have to stick with that.
It feels like I’m swimming against a strong tide just to maintain a good experience, in no other industry do the major players want to cripple your goods and services if you don’t bend over and accept their increasingly poor goods and services 🤷🏻♂️
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