I love how a country is allowed to just get away with killing children and UN workers and doctors and journalists but we condemn countries that do the same thing like Russia. It makes no sense that Israel should get a free pass, all it does is expose a huge double standard
If Ukraine had initially launched an attack on Russia and killed 1,200 mainlycivilians, taken 200+ hostages and thrown in a bit of organised gang rape, I doubt Ukraine would be receiving its current level of support, and there may even have been some support for retaliatory action by Russia.
That’s not to say that Israel’s current appalling treatment of Palestinian civilians is justified
Let’s ignore how many people israel has killed, they need to kill more, and let’s also go ahead an label everyone who says “too much” a hamas supporter
Then you go here and it’s again 90%
Let’s not even call hamas terrorist, more like freedom-fighters with some friendly rape and friendly fire thrown in.
Here in the fediverse there are many people with opinions similar to mine, i.e we are on the side of civillians, not any of the belligerents in this hellscape of war crimes.
Ah, so only beehaw prohibits downvotes, not other Lemmy instances. TIL.
I guess even what I showed you may have gone negative if downvotes were allowed. The person I was arguing with wasn’t being nasty about it, just incredibly obstinate.
I worry about a return to Nazi style anti-semitism (though I hate Likud) which the polarized discussions are leading us towards. It is arrogant to think it could never happen again.
Some Lemmy instances have downvotes, some don’t. It varies by instance. I think most instances have/allow downvotes. Beehaw & Blahaj are two bigger ones that don’t that I can think of off of the top of my head.
Also agreed with your last bit. I’m nervous about it, too. I wish people would just be decent and… not suck, lol.
If it makes you feel any better, I got banned for my first and only comment there (not even a post) which was a link and an explanation of the high credentials of the author. Like this…
Hersh first gained recognition in 1969 for exposing the My Lai Massacre and its cover-up during the Vietnam War, for which he received the 1970 Pulitzer Prize for International Reporting.
Except it wasn’t Palestine that attacked, it was a group disassociated with the Palestinian Authority, that Israel itself funds so it can justify the “war” to favor the arms dealers and distract the constituents of the terrible administration they’re receiving.
The two conflicts are not even remotely comparable.
Given that I was replying to a message drawing equivalence, you'll see that I was saying that they weren't really equivalent, in that Ukraine hadn't mounted an attack on Russian civilians. Hope that helps.
Isreal’s main exports are cutting-edge technology found nowhere else in the world. Russia’s main export is oil. Western and European Union countries were fine getting their oil elsewhere, but they absolutely do not want to give up advanced tech. Especially since there will always be other countries that don’t care and will continue trading anyway.
Israel sells billions worth of weapons a year, sometimes to repressive regimes like the Myanmar junta.
It also innovates quite heavily in that space.
I have been noticing a number of doctors mentioning a new kind of burn on children in Gaza. Israel routinely deploys new weapons there, and this may well be a new example of testing experimental weapons in Gaza
It's security software - firewalls, VPNs, that sort of thing. It's not that it's not available anywhere else, but the Israeli stuff was always considered among the best before this conflict kicked off.
Russia bombed Kiev for the hell of it, not even pretending there was a military objective. Russia also is conscripting Ukrainians to fight against their fellow countrymen as cannon-fodder on the front line. It is kidnapping children into Russia.
IDF are the good guys, just like the Ukrainian army is. That doesn’t mean that every single individual in either army are angels or that every operation is virtuous, just that their overall intentions are just.
An important question: What would the world look like if these guys won versus if they lost?
The whole point of the article is Biden criticizing Israel for going too far in their mission to eradicate Hamas. He even criticized US for invading Afghanistan.
Bit of a tangent, but I find it insane that the US spent over 2000 billion to fight the war in Afghanistan, but congress is unwilling to authorise giving the Ukrainians 60 billion. A relatively small amount, that means Ukrainians can keep fighting Russia, decreasing the likelihood of American troops ever having to get involved in a war in Europe.
I once did the sums to calculate that USA could have afforded a run a gun buyback scheme (like Australia) rather than invade Iraq, you know… to cut down on Americans killing Americans.
Ah, but from where I sit (a long way from the US), it looks more like a pissing contest between the Republicans to see who can be the most terrible human being in government, than it does look like any sort of actual policy or principal.
It's not about helping Ukraine, or avoiding the mistakes of Afghanistan - it's about trying to make Biden (and/or 'The Dems' in general) look bad, even if that involves civilian deaths.
Are they evil, Russian agents or just absolute clowns? It doesn't really matter, does it. The end result is the same.
From someone in the US, smack dab in the middle of very dense Republican land (Oklahoma,) I want you to know that you’ve nailed it! You’re spot on. I wish you were exaggerating, lol.
He criticizes their war crimes with one hand but with the other hand he gives them billions of dollars to help them commit more.
Netanyahu said in a statement on Tuesday that Israel had received "full backing" from the U.S. for its ground incursion into Gaza and that Washington had blocked "international pressure to stop the war."
I was expecting Isreal to brush off the ICJ charges in contempt and ignore the process entirely like the US always has and would help them to do as well. It’s interesting to see how their PR has shifted recently from " It’s not a genocide when we do it" to “We’re not doing what we’ve been saying we’ve been doing for many decades.”
Yes, the US news media has a fairly long complete-since-the-founding-of-the-US history of dehumanizing people of color in their language. No surprise it’s kicked into overdrive with this “conflict” in particular.
This is a really good article, and I like that they made their data public and put a link to it right in the article.
Also, I knew it was bad, but looking at these numbers it’s even worse than I thought. I recommend reading this one.
Like, this part:
Asymmetry in how children are covered is qualitative as well as quantitative. On October 13, the Los Angeles Times ran an Associated Press report Opens in a new tabthat said, “The Gaza Health Ministry said Friday that 1,799 people have been killed in the territory, including more than 580 under the age of 18 and 351 women. Hamas’s assault last Saturday killed more than 1,300 people in Israel, including women, children and young music festivalgoers.” Notice that young Israelis are referred to as children while young Palestinians are described as people under 18.
During discussions around the prisoner exchanges, this frequent refusal to refer to Palestinians as children was even more stark, with the New York Times referring in one case to “Israeli women and children” being exchanged for “Palestinian women and minors.” (Palestinian children are referred to as “children” later in the report, when summarizing a human rights groups’ findings.)
A Washington Post report from November 21 announcing the truce deal erased Palestinian women and children altogether: “President Biden said in a statement Tuesday night that a deal to release 50 women and children held hostage by Hamas in Gaza, in exchange for 150 Palestinian prisoners detained by Israel.” The brief did not mention Palestinian women and children at all.
That is so fucked up. And there are a bunch of other examples like it re. the disparity in the language these newspapers use.
Tangentially, and though this is a whole can of worms and rather beside the point we should be focusing on at the moment: I am also disturbed that it’s apparently still common practice to bundle women together with children like this - if they just mean “noncombatants” or “caregivers” then they should say that, just saying “women and children” like this demeans female combatants and male caregivers alike. I can sort of understand an argument for it in certain contexts where women are subjugated and denied a lot of rights, but this language is used regardless of social contexts.
Cross-posting this from /c/socialism because I think it’s a quality analysis.
This is also a reminder that you’re on Beehaw and our one rule is to bee nice. We’ve seen a lot of comment threads on this conflict turn into cursing matches, lets not do that again please 💜
The lesson we Westerners can learn from this and some action we can take right now is not to support the establishment and proliferation of far right-wing extremist religious organizations anymore. The action we should not take is to get involved with Afganistan’s affairs and make the problem worse than we’ve already made it.
There’s really no reason why we had to be in a war in Iraq. Afghanistan… yeah, probably not there, either, especially given how intimately we understood how well they had been trained at guerilla warfare against foreign invaders.
Although, that’s not guite accurate; there were reasons, they were just serving different, less publically recognized, purposes. Much like Netanyahu’s war.
Good thing that basically every other action you could do falls between “do nothing”, and “commit ethnic cleansing”, so they’ve got a lot to choose from!
Too bad they decided to go with the ethnic cleansing instead.
Do you not think Israel could have killed pretty much everyone in Gaza if they were interested in ethnic cleansing?
Meanwhile Hamas really did do their best to ethically cleanse, and have said they would do it again given a chance.
The reality is still pretty bad: at least 10,000 civilians killed and it seems Bibi wants to push all Gazans out of Gaza altogether in their mission to root out Hamas.
That’s why I try to be very deliberate in differentiating between “Israel”, which is a country and government, and “Israelis”, which are the people who live there.
As an American, I’m extremely mindful of this distinction:
Being anti-American is bigotry based on national origin.
Being anti-America is a moral and justified position against an Imperial, settler-colonialist state that kills millions around the globe.
OK. By the way Israel always has coalition governments so there are several parties in this coalition although the largest component is Likud. The war cabinet is only Likud and National Unity (party led by Benny Gantz).
I guess that is like trying to discuss who the trainer of the football team is with a guy in the grandstand who just wants to throw beer cans at the opposition.
This shit goes back further than people here care to investigate…
"The Antichrist will pass by this salty barren area i.e. Madinah, in a passage of a canal. Most of those who will come out to him will be women so that a man will return to his intimate wife, mother, daughter, sister or aunt to tie them up for fear that they might go out to him. Then, Allah will afflict him with Muslims who kill him and his followers and the Jews will hide behind a tree or a rock and the rock or the tree will say to the Muslim: There is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!”
This Hadith was reported by Ahmad in his Musnad. About 1200 years ago.
Well Iraq, the first time, yes. They invaded Kuwait which in my opinion did legitimise the first gulf war (though opinions may vary). Though IMO it should have happened under UN flag but of course the security council is forever locked into a stalemate.
The second war, no. Whatever it was… Made-up WMD’s, funding of military industrial complex, Dubya’s desire to finish daddy’s pet project, whatever. A real reason there was not.
Gangs are running profitable businesses inside the correctional facilities, and even have the keys to their own units. Recent rioting showed the extent of their power, posing a difficult challenge for the government of Daniel Noboa.
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