Trying to install VPN and these are the instructions Mullvad is giving me. This is ridiculous. There must be a more simple way. I know how to follow the instructions but I have no idea what I’m doing here. Can’t I just download a file and install it? I’m on Ubuntu.
That is simple. About as simple as it gets. The more complex method involves figuring out what VPN software Mullvad really uses, figuring out your keying material, fighting with NetworkManager…
For better or for worse, the widespread methods are not at all similar to the methods sometimes used in Linux. It’s just a fact that most people are accustomed to different ways
And if you read a few paragraphs more, there’s a Download and install the app section too, rather than add their repos. Which is what the OP wanted anyway…
It’s not difficult. I’ve installed several apps that way already. I just don’t like blindly following instructions while having zero understanding of what I’m actually doing here. Also, in this case the instructions are unhelpful because nowhere it tells me to install curl first and because of me not having it the first command just comes back with an error.
The way to solve that problem is to read the commands and look up what they do. The installation method they describe is pretty standard and inoffensive. And provides automatic updates. The commands used aren’t complicated and they’re some of the system fundamentals for Debian/Ubuntu systems so it’s a good idea being familiar with them.
In the time it took you to write this shit post and respond to all the comments you could have spent a couple of minutes reading and educating yourself on the process. It’s legit pretty simple especially if you’re willing to do a little research.
cURL is a very commonly used program to download individual files from the command line and worth installing to have it around in the future.
sudo apt update
sudo apt install curl
The first command tells your package manager to update its list so you ask for the latest version. You can skip it if you’ve already updated today. The second command tells your package manager to install cURL.
This will happen every now and then, especially when building a package from source. You won’t have some common utility that the documentation writer assumed you had, and you will need to find what package provides it and install the package.
Yes people would assume you have curl. Curl is often used to install programs. And curl is definitely one of the things that can do malicius things this way. So you are right to be hesitant to use commands that you don’t understand. Most Linux users have forgotten how hard it is to learn the first stuff with no preaquired knowledge.
If you have googled “what is curl and how is it used” you may have found some relevant info.
I have given up on Linux because installing was hard in the past
There are some tools that make installing software easier. Like “appimage” files that are single files that (after you make executable) are completely self contained.
Flatpacks and snaps have an “store” like experience.
.deb files are also sometimes simple (also need to be made executable) (depends on the distro)
I think if you read through this you have pretty much everything you asked about. As for understanding what these sorts of commands do in the future I think ChatGPT is actually really useful for stuff like this with good documentation. Just ask what the commands do and it is usually quite helpful. Someone already said it but you have to want to learn this. If you want something easy to use and you don’t have to learn buy a Mac, you want great software compatibility buy a windows pc. If you want something that is more private and a community effort use Linux but unless you are using steam os on a steam deck it is not even close to being as user friendly as the others. I hope this changes but the current goals and mindsets of people in this community will prevent Linux from becoming easy to use and in the case of steam os you just need lots of money to make it an easy experience. There are a million other reasons that Linux’s current state is this way but this is the gist.
If you want something easy to use and you don’t have to learn buy a Mac, you want great software compatibility buy a windows pc.
That is very bad advice, as that may well not be a solution. There are people who want to use their computers without the ads, data mining and forced program defaults windows is doing.
That’s true that if people switch OS, they’ll need to learn a lot of new things. But don’t forget that not only sysadmins and adventurous people use Linux.
That being said, there are distros that give you a decent GUI frontend to the package manager, for example openSUSE
Well what you said is true but this depends on the person you are recommending it. I didn’t know the op and generally can’t determine how interested they are in computers. I have friends who are just so use to their current understanding of using a computer with windows they wouldn’t be willing to learn anything else at all. They didn’t find yast easy to use because yes you have a gui for installing things but they don’t know all the things they need to install and it isn’t the most simplistic gui. Again you aren’t wrong it’s just that I’m hesitant to recommend people to use it unless they want the benefits of using Linux and are willing to learn.
I made this thread because I try to learn/understand
I have a Macbook, it’s what I use the most. I used to have Win7 on my gaming rig but Steam dropped their support for it so my options was either to go with a newer Windows or try Linux. As all of the games I play seemed to work on Linux with just minor tweaks I thought I’d give it a try. So far I’m really happy with how to OS works once it’s set up but it’s the setting up part that’s really confusing to me.
The instructions on that page make it so that every time you run a system update, mullvad automatically updates as well. If you’re happy doing the updating yourself, you can download the deb file from here: github.com/mullvad/mullvadvpn-app/releases
I just don’t get why on windows and mac I can download the app from their site, install it and it just works but on Linux I have to do everything thru terminal. It’s not that I can’t get it done but it just seems insane to me that it has to be this difficult.
You don’t have to do everything through terminal. You can use synaptic for example. What you have to do is to learn new concepts. If you want to do everything like in windows, use windows.
When you got your first smart phone, be it android or iOS, you didn’t know where anything was, so there was a learning curve.
But, in the same way as phones, there are built in “stores”. Those stores are called repositories, and they’re accessible in more than one way. You don’t actually have to use the terminal, it’s just usually faster since you really don’t type much more than you would entering a search in whatever GUI interface comes with your distro. Indeed, you can actually set up the commands in a notepad, change the package name each time, and copy/paste the commands, and you’re only a couple of seconds slower than opening the package manager, searching, scrolling to find what you want, clicking to install… See what I’m getting at?
Windows isn’t really faster than that. You have to go to a site, download, find the exe or msi in your download folder, then click in the various pop-up windows. And you can find .deb files that do the same thing as an exe or msi, just not for every program, because they’re an unnecessary pain in the ass. It’s extra steps.
I promise you, comparing the way Linux works now, and the learning curve it takes to the learning curve on windows back when it was a new experience (and I’m talking windows 95, the previous msdos shells were worse than that), Linux is way easier. And don’t even get me started on how shitty a user experience DOS was. Jfc, I’m dyslexic, and it was a nightmare. Windows 95 wasn’t a big jump better in dyslexia land, but it was at least better than DOS.
If you were used to something like mac only, and had never used windows, the transition would be similarly annoying. And, for me at least, dealing with installs on windows is more of a pain in the ass now that I’m used to package managers.
I did a clean install of Windows 7 on my media PC (and yes, you valiant security friends, it’s air gapped) maybe two years ago. From start to finish, including programs, took me about five hours.
My laptop that I run Linux mint on? An hour, start to finish. The only differences in the programs installed are in specifics, not in types. I plugged in my live drive, hit install, and was ready to start installing programs in maybe twenty minutes. My media pc is an old gaming PC, btw. Tons of ram, ssd, etc. The laptop is an old thinkpad. So it wasn’t like the laptop was better hardware lol.
Which seems tangential, but it’s pointing to the underlying ease of use once you’re used to the system. I’ve being doing windows installs since the nineties (and a little before, but only in classes), so it isn’t like I’m not experienced. I’ve only been doing Linux installs since about 2015.
Hell, my very first Linux install was Ubuntu on my dad’s old computer just to make sure I didn’t screw a box up that was in use. Even that, going from Ubuntu being ready to go, and having the programs set up to use was only maybe two hours, and that was mostly looking up the very process that’s been described by others in this thread and copy/pasting things in for each program.
So don’t get discouraged. If you end up really not liking it once you get past the learning curve, that’s okay, windows will still be there. You can go back to it. But, if you’re like me at all, once that learning curve is past, you won’t enjoy the extra hassles windows puts in the way.
I think a better way for the other user to have stated this, is learning Linux, while difficult at times, should be a fun and rewarding experience. I’m about a year in, and this is all easy stuff to me. One year ago? I would have been as frustrated as you are. But I persevered, I learned, and I got a sense of accomplishment out of becoming competent. I don’t really need to ask too many questions now, because the more I figure things out, the easier it gets to figure things out.
If you’re not into that, Linux might not be for you. But I hope it is, I hope you persevere and keep learning and find the same satisfaction from it that I have.
Welcome to the community. As you can see, there are some that are quite helpful and others that are … less so.
I agree with you that there should be a better way to do that. It’s been a while, but I’m pretty sure the Chrome deb file handled all of that for you. I’ve always been confused why every company that sets up their own PPA didn’t do that.
You should try Linux because you want to and find it interesting to learn. If you are doing it because other people told you to, you are going to have a bad time.
Linux isn't Windows with different branding. Things work differently, and if you take the time to understand why you'll usually see the logic eventually, even if you may not to agree with it. I think folks are bristling a bit at your implication that things are hard on purpose somehow. Many experienced users find the terminal easier to use and more efficient; it shouldn't shock anyone (including you) that it's going to feel awkward when you don't understand it yet.
Howtos tend to use the terminal because it's likely to work the same for everyone regardless of what other choices they've made with desktop environment, etc.
You can do nearly everything with a GUI if you choose.
One reason is that different distributions of linux do things slightly different. Would it be better if there was only one linux os? For some devs of third party software, probably, but diversity and freedom to fork software has been good to linux, and no one could decide what everyone else should use anyway.
So, each distribution takes the available software and package it to fit their distro specifics, and those packages go into their repositories. The benefit of using official repositories is that someone has gone through the trouble of making sure it will work on your system safely. There’s accountability and hopefully a bug tracker etc. When you download from a random website you have to trust them instead. Then… you have companies working outside of this model, usually they provide a flatpak or their own third-party repositories. Then you get all these extra steps, but it’s not how most distros prefer to handle software.
I can totally understand why the terminal seems confusing and scary right now, but it’s actually awesome for this kind of stuff because you can just copy and paste commands to do pretty much anything to your computer. Using a GUI often means having a bunch of screenshots that you have to follow manually to do something that a single command can do. Once you’re used to the terminal for these kinds of things GUIs can seem barbaric. Of course it seems scary before you know much about it because it seems like the fucking matrix, and you should only run commands from sources you trust (because they can do anything)… But it’s worth giving a chance, I think.
For this particular instance… often you can just download an application on Linux from a website and run it, but this is almost never the preferred way of doing things. Usually you install applications from your package manager, which is kind of like an App Store (but free), and the advantage of this is that 1) you don’t have to hunt down sketchy executables on the internet, you have a vetted source of safe packages from your distribution, and 2) you can easily update all of your packages. Having a one stop shop for all of your applications (or at least most) is really great, but it can be a little annoying when something you want isn’t in the official repos (like this), though it’s usually a fairly rare occurrence.
What annoys me the most with installing apps this way is that I have already installed several and while having been succesful I still have no clue what any of this does. What is sudo? What is apt-get? What is repositorie? What is package? I just don’t know what any of this does and blindly following instructions isn’t teaching me anything. When I try to looks for explanations or tutorial videos I’m just met with more jargon that I don’t undestand. GUI is really intuitive for me as it helps me to visualize what’s actually happening but playing around with terminal is really abstract and confusing. If I’m met with an error I’m completely stuck then. Only troubleshooting I can do is to make sure I typed the command correctly.
If you stick with it you’ll eventually start to understand what all the jargon means.
sudo is kind of like “run as admin” in windows. It runs whatever command as root(admin) instead of as your user. To use it you just add sudo in front of the command. Ex. “apt-get update” becomes “sudo apt-get update”
apt-get is the command that controls your Ubuntu Repository. “apt-get update” basically checks for updates for everything on your computer. Then “apt-get upgrade” downloads and installs all those updates. And “apt-get install <app/package name>” is how you install apps that are in your distros Repository.
A Repository is basically an app store for your distribution. Each Linux distribution usually has their own. And they have different software(apps) available in them. If a app you want is not in your repo there are different options to install it. That was probably the hardest part for me to understand when I started. But now days the easiest option is to use snap or flatpak to install something that’s not in your distros Repository.
As far as I understand, a package is just another way of saying app or software program. There might be a technical difference. But when you download a package you’re basically just downloading the program/software/app.
There are also package dependencies which is the other software that is required to run the software you’re trying to install. When you run “sudo apt-get install <package name>”. You will see a list of packages that will be installed. This includes all the dependency packages. Which are the packages that are needed to run the one that you’re trying to install.
Some linux distribution try to give you a GUI for everything. But its definitely worth learning how to do stuff in the terminal. Once you learn it you’ll realize why it is so much better than a GUI.
A “package” goes beyond library or app, basically by being part of a package management system:
I has a version number in a standardized format, which package managers can use to reason about dependencies
It declares its own dependencies, with version constraints. It will have entries like “In order to run I need a copy of jsonReader version at least 0.12.1”
I think that might be it.
Just in the same way both rice and bread come in a package at the grocery store, and both of their packaging has nutrition info, UPC barcode, and net weight printed on it. The packaging itself allows these goods to be distributed through a particular system.
The barcode is part of the packaging standard, and then the “package management” processes of retail use that barcode for their own inventory management, checkout, etc.
I realized there’s quite a bit more metadata that a package provides to its package management system. Here’s an example package definition, in the programming language Ruby: github.com/thoughtbot/…/factory_bot.gemspec
Oh good, you wrote basically the exact response I was going to give!
The only other thing I would mention is… if you don’t know what a command is, you can and should look it up! You can use the internet, but you can also try “man sudo” or “info sudo” and do a bit of reading. It might not make sense at first, but you’ll start building up a vocabulary really quickly.
And if you’re a real human, I have a recommendation: buy a dictionary. Once you can read simple words, move to coffee maker manuals. From there to children’s books. And so, maybe one day, you will be able to figure out how to read a basic “getting started with ubuntu” article or something. You just switched to a complete different operating system and act so entitled as in “where is the start menu, this OS is so confusing”.
The Linux community isn’t toxic, it’s the average non-linux user being as dumb as rock. And on top of that is also lazy.
You can, it’s up to the software vendor to make it simple.
Most of the software are FOSS and can be installed directly from your package manager. That works like the iOS app store/Android Play Store except it existed 10 years before mobile stores.
Google Chrome is an example of proprietary software (so not in distributions repos) that is as easy to install on Linux than Windows. Because Google managed to get a deb that will also update your repos.
Bottom line, most of the time it’s way easier to install software on Linux than Windows (as easy as on iOS) but occasionally it’s slightly more complex.
I don’t understand. If I go to their site at mullvad.net the obvious choice to download their software is to click at ‘Downloads’ at the top of the page. It already autodetected I am running Linux and has me on the Linux tab.
Sure there are two download options but the first one says it works on Ubuntu and the second says it works on Fedora. You get a file you can just double click and install. Windows installation works the same way. You download a file and double click it.
You don’t have to use the terminal you don’t really have to know more about sudo than you need about Windows UAC, you don’t have to know what a package or .deb is anymore than what a win32 executable or an Windows’ .msi file is.
People giving you more complicated answers either did not check the website (because they presumed you did) or if they did they think you want more features such as auto-updating which in Windows also requires a more complex install than downloading a file and opening it.
Because it’s an asinine practice from which windows is moving away through winget, and which made the open source community to write a package manager for mac from scratch – homebrew.
And if you think about it for a second, you will realize that it doesn’t exist on Android and iOS at all. E.g. 99% of users only install from a centralized repository called “appstore” and nobody is ever downloading an executable installer.
Basically, you’re uninformed, and blatantly defending your uneducated way of installing software.
Homebrew is extremely insecure. It doesn’t verify package signatures, so its just as bad as the “just donloaf some sketchy untrusted binary off a website” approach
I don’t know about Mac, but on Windows the Mullvad app doesn’t auto update. If you want to do it Windows style you can look for deb files (which are like installers) or AppImages (which are like standalone executables).
Most pieces of software give terminal instructions for Linux because different people might use different package manager frontends, but literally every Linux user has a terminal. It might seem daunting at first, but giving users commands to run in their terminal is a lot more simple than trying to walk them through repo management through the GUI, or just telling them to figure it out themselves.
On Windows and Mac, you are doing a number of things implicitly that you don’t realize.
When you download from their site, you are expected to verify the integrity and validity of the install file yourself. You also have to take ownership of installing any dependencies yourself.
With the instructions mulvad is providing you, you are connecting to a repo and apt does all that for you.
Some installs don’t require dependencies, but some do. Long term, this style of install tends to be a lot simpler, you just have to learn it.
But more importantly and as others have stated. Linux is different. If you aren’t interested in learning a new workflow, you should stick with something familiar. That’s a choice you should make not because others said it but because you want it.
Not one more repository to add, sign, reload at each update. And can get compromised.
Not one more piece of software to run that may, or may not, run properly (looking at you ProtonVPN)
Just download the wireguard or openvpn configs to some desired exit points, load them into NetworkManager as described, and BINGO you have an integrated way of switching desired location, a visual icon in the taskbar confirming your status, and no extra hassle.
Did you know that qbittorrent can be told to only work if the VPN is on? There are places where it matters.
And to answer your question, no, that is not normal. If a piece of software isn’t available for your distribution, then consider finding another. Like, here, using NetworkManager to do the job!
And click the “download .deb” button (It says underneath “Works on Ubuntu 20.04+, Debian 11+ (64bit only)”. As long as your Ubuntu is up-to-date, this will work fine)
you get a file (“MullvadVPN-2023.6_amd64.deb”) you can run just like on Windows (similar to MullvadVPN-2023.6.exe)
opening the file should open a GUI for installing the file
Keep in mind, to update Mullvad VPN, you would need to download a newer .deb file (after an update is released). It shows the latest version above the download buttons, below the “Mullvad VPN for Linux text” This is the same as how it is on Windows
Edit: This is not intended as good advice, just a simple way to install Mullvad VPN. The smartest solution would be to add the repo.
2nd Edit: While this is how Mullvad provides their software, it is never ideal to install random .deb packages or add third party repos without being sure that the ones who provided the package/repo is trustworthy.
It might not be good advice, but that was not what OP asked for.
My comment was meant as a beginner-friendly way to install Mullvad VPN on Ubuntu, and not unsolicited advice telling them to learn something that should not be needed for daily computer usage. And while adding the repo might be the better solution, that would require the use of the terminal, and as multiple people have proven to me, that wouldn’t be a friendly way to introduce Linux to someone just starting out.
You don’t teach someone to swim, by dropping them in the middle of the pacific.
People seem to be making this a more difficult job than it needs to be. Yeah I get we’re powerusers but can’t we drop that for 2 minutes while giving advice so a new user can actually get a job done quickly? Windows EXEs don’t automatically update either. Sure it might not be the best way to do it but it’s fast and not confusing. (EDIT: Apparently this specific program actually has it’s own auto updater)
Things take time to learn. Throwing all of the existing knowledge of repo management at a new user at once does not work.
It’s funny how quickly Lemmy turns on a dime between “Linux is easier than Windows” in threads about adopting Linux to “spend some time learning the terminal” when presented with a question that should be a single click (installing an app).
Before the hate train starts, I’ve been using Linux off and on for 30 years now. And I still struggle with making distros do things that shouldn’t be that hard because they aren’t hard in Windows.
Also note that Mullvad has a pretty technical user base and target audience, and thus their documentation is likely geared towards them. You could also consider using Mozilla VPN, which offers pretty much the same advantages (they use Mullvad’s servers), at the same price if you pay annually, and is easier to use.
Oh actually, looking at the Ubuntu installation docs, that doesn’t really seem to be much easier - that’s a disappointment :/
Although if you don’t mind running one terminal command (specifically, sudo add-apt-repository ppa:mozillacorp/mozillavpn), I think after that you should just be able to use the Ubuntu App Center to install software - which usually is the way to install software in Ubuntu, and works similar to app stores on phones.
it’s just a fuckin step by step guide on how to add their repo to the sources.list
What’s so technical about it? It’s how you install everything on Ubuntu.
No knowing how apt works, is equivalent to not understanding why grandma_pics.zip.exe is probably a virus. If you’re that uninformed, we can’t help you.
As a side note, dealing with adding repos and keys and all that is something I will never miss from apt. I use Arch and installing things is usually as simple as… well let me check.
<span style="color:#323232;">$ yay mullvad
</span><span style="color:#323232;">...
</span><span style="color:#323232;">2 aur/mullvad-vpn-bin 2023.6-1 (+86 1.36)
</span><span style="color:#323232;"> The Mullvad VPN client app for desktop
</span><span style="color:#323232;">1 aur/mullvad-vpn 2023.6-1 (+126 2.10)
</span><span style="color:#323232;"> The Mullvad VPN client app for desktop
</span><span style="color:#323232;">==> Packages to install (eg: 1 2 3, 1-3 or ^4)
</span><span style="color:#323232;">==> _
</span>
And it’s option 1. So easy. Type 1 and press enter and you’re done.
Both options will install the Mullvad client from the AUR. (If you use an arch derivative, that already tells you some things. If you don't, then you are missing some context.) The first option will install from binary, the second will compile from source. Which you choose is up to you.
If you blindly chose one over the other because you didn't know, worst case you end up being impatient if it takes awhile to compile from source.
Download the .deb from their downloads page and run it, just like you would either a .exe on Windows. Their instructions list that as an option further down on the page. Should be higher up imo
Yes, it is. You can achieve the same usung GUI of course, but this would be more difficult to describe because there are multiple GUIs and they change with new distro versions.
This is more convenient than “downloading and intalling” a file because you don’t have to track updates manually, the package manager will do this for you. You have to read something about what package manager is and how does it work. It is the main concept of all linux distros except LFS.
This is one of the hardest walls for people to jump over mentally, from scavenging the internet for binaries to using a package manager.
I think ideally one should understand what they’re doing, I think that if you did you would realise it’s not hard, just different from what you’re used to. Usually you install things using the graphical package manager, of which there are a lot, since I don’t know which one you are using nor have I used any of them in a long while, I’ll use the terminal as an example (same reason the site uses terminal commands), but all of this is almost assuredly possible via GUI.
To install things you usually do sudo apt install , this is a huge advantage on Linux, it works similar to your phone in that everything gets updated together but also it installs dependencies separately, which means that instead of having 10 copies of the same library for 10 programs that use it (like on Windows) you get a single one, which is part of the reason binaries are smaller on Linux.
The problem with this approach is that some programs are NOT listed there, the only programs there are the ones the maintainers of your distro (Ubuntu in this case) can review and approve. So you can have a lot of different solutions for this:
The first and most obvious for Windows users is to download the .deb from the website and just run that like you would a binary on windows, i.e. double-clicking it, or from the terminal you can run sudo dpkg -i . This works, but you lose the advantages of a package installed via your package manager, i.e. you would get the same experience as on windows, so it’s not ideal.
The second way is the one they’re describing, essentially you’re adding a new repository to the package manager, that the people who wrote the program are maintaining (instead of Ubuntu guys), this is a two step process, sudo curl -fsSLo /usr/share/keyrings/mullvad-keyring.asc https://repository.mullvad.net/deb/mullvad-keyring.asc that command is downloading the file https://repository.mullvad.net/deb/mullvad-keyring.asc and putting it in /usr/share/keyrings/mullvad-keyring.asc, this is needed because repositories are not trusted by default, that would be a security nightmare, you can do this via GUI if your problem is with the terminal , just download the file and copy it to that location, it’s just harder to explain than giving you a command. Then it’s adding the repository to the repository list, the command is echo “deb [signed-by=/usr/share/keyrings/mullvad-keyring.asc arch=$( dpkg --print-architecture )] https://repository.mullvad.net/deb/stable $(lsb_release -cs) main” | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/mullvad.list that command has a lot to unwrap, in essence it’s editing the file /etc/apt/sources.list.d/mullvad.list and writing a line like deb [signed-by=/usr/share/keyrings/mullvad-keyring.asc arch=amd64] https://repository.mullvad.net/deb/stable focal main" there, but because the guy who wrote this doesn’t know your architecture (e.g. amd64) nor your version (e.g. focal) he wrote a command that gets that information from your system, you can instead write the file yourself if you know those. Then install via package manager as normal.
There’s a third way which is more recent which is install via snap/flatpak which is similar to install via package manager, except you don’t add new repos.
There’s a fourth way which is manually, usually when you compile stuff you install them manually.
I know it’s a lot to take in, but I’m of the opinion that if you understand what’s happening it makes things easier.
Just as an addendum to your answer. In the command writing to mullvad.list the | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/mullvad.list is using two helpful linux utilities to modify the command. The first is the | which is called a pipe and connects the text output of one program to the text input of another. The pipe is connecting the output of echo which simply prints a string, in this case composed of the outputs of several other commands to the program tee. Tee which is given admin privileges by the sudo takes an input stream and splits it between two files. In this case those are mullvad.list and since no other was provided stdout the output pipeline of the terminal running the command.
EDIT:
In the interest of further completeness. Another utility used in those commands is the command substitution operator of sh. So when the terminal is interpretting text $(some command) gets substituted out for the text output by the command in the parentheses. It is another common way of connecting commands on the shell to allow for more flexible and powerful commands.
The problem is that for most users, when their setup is completed they won’t need to play with it for a while so after that any time they need to install something new through the terminal it means losing time to find instructions again.
Nothing is learned, to the eyes of a casual users it’s just meaningless entries getting copy/pasted and it’s information getting repeated again and again and again just with slightly different entries for each program. Meanwhile “how to install a program on Windows” would basically require one page on the whole internet to cover 99% of situations: “Download the install file, double click it, follow the on screen instructions to automatically install the program”.
The problem is that for most users, when their setup is completed they won’t need to play with it for a while so after that any time they need to install something new through the terminal it means losing time to find instructions again.
Which is why it’s better to understand what you’re doing than blindly copying pasting. You won’t need to remember these since whatever you want to install if it’s not on the repos you’ll have to google it same as if you were on Windows.
Also on Windows the steps are: Download the install file, double click it, follow the on screen instructions to automatically install the program, then every week or so go back to the website, check if a new version was released, if so download it and install it again. If the configuration would be destroyed by doing this first, make a backup first, if the new version is not backwards compatible for configuration move the existing configuration changes so that you get the new default after install and can apply your changes afterwards.
That’s closer to the truth, and you need to do that weekly for every one of the dozen or hundreds of programs a person has, no wonder people don’t update their programs on Windows and become susceptible to lots of exploits over time.
Also, read my option 1, which is what most websites offer you first, i.e. download a .deb and run it which is the equivalent of Windows, with all of its downsides. For example if you go to that website that OP posted and click on downloads you can select Windows, Mac or Linux, and you can download an installer that way and be done with it. But only Linux has a better option that takes a couple more steps but saves you lots of time in the future.
then every week or so go back to the website, check if a new version was released, if so download it and install it again
Don’t know what kind of program you’re running but… No.
Also if you want adoption you need to make your product easy to use and not ask them to become experts at how things work. Do you think all bike riders know how to adjust their derailer or even care to know? No, because people have other things they care about. Same guess 6 for computers, if Linux requires users to understand how to do things manually in the terminal then the “year of the Linux computer” will never happen.
the “year of the Linux computer” will never happen.
It won’t, that’s fine. People who don’t want to lean anything about computers use iOS and Android now. And that’s fine. I never want Linux distros to become like that.
Don’t know what kind of program you’re running but… No.
My Linux has updates every week, which means that if I was on Windows to keep everything the same up to date I would need to check every website to see which app released this week, maybe this week Firefox had a new release, maybe next week it’s mullvad VPN, and next week is the NVIDIA driver, but if I hadn’t checked all of them I would not know which ones have a new release.
Also if you want adoption you need to make your product easy to use and not ask them to become experts at how things work
Agreed, but also you should have options so that power users can take advantage of it.
Do you think all bike riders know how to adjust their derailer or even care to know?
Do you think that bikes should not have gears since most people don’t know how they work? No, because even if you don’t understand the mechanics you can understand the general terms, and even if you don’t understand gears you can just not use them, same as a package manager. Options is always better.
if Linux requires users to understand how to do things manually in the terminal then the “year of the Linux computer” will never happen.
It doesn’t require it, you’re ignoring the fact that OP could have just clicked download and download an installer same as he would on Windows. But if you can use the terminal and understand package managers you can use Linux in a way that Windows is impossible, if you can’t you can still use Linux in the same way you would windows with all of the sales downsides.
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