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HStone32, in big deal

Why do you guys insist on calling it GNU/Linux? It’d be like if you called your car a V8, and some weirdo insists you call it “transmission/V8”

HStone32, in alias 2024='echo "YEAR OF THE DESKTOP"'

How is money an issue? I can run down to the contracted office-supply refurbisher 2 miles away, buy a 2-year old lenovo mini PC for $160, and slap Debian on it for no additional licence fee.

cm0002, in Wayland vs X11 be like

Not sure where the current wave of FHFIF memes are coming from, but I’m here for it lmao

bjoern_tantau,
@bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de avatar

What show is this?

roflo1,
Oxnvat,
@Oxnvat@lemmy.world avatar

I’m an adamant believer in its untapped meme potential

Flaky,
@Flaky@iusearchlinux.fyi avatar

should watch some of it again tbh, watched it as a kid and I loved Wander Over Yonder, one of McCracken’s other shows.

HouseWolf, (edited ) in Wayland vs X11 be like

As a Linux newcomer the Wayland/X11 thing has been the most confusing thing I’ve witnessed.

Surely the average person will just use what works best on their system at that time? I don’t get people wishing to throw Wayland in the trash or the people who take issue with people still using X11.

Kinda just seems like arguing because you have nothing better to do.

Pantherina,

Just use a Distro that has it preset. Ubuntu, Fedora, I dont know what else.

jasondj, (edited )

Ubuntu LTS and 23.x are both Xorg. Latest has Wayland. If 24.04 is to be LTS though, I don’t think they’d release it with Wayland as default. I’d think they’d switch to Wayland on 24.10 so there’s 3 more releases to get good before the next LTS build.

Pantherina,

Damn… so StudioOne on their “Linux info page” was wrong. They only support Ubuntu (sigh…) but also only Wayland.

A good start for a Flatpak? Maybe if it wasnt proprietary…

jasondj,

Possible I’m wrong? I was going against the Distrowatch details since I was just looking at them a couple hours before I replied: distrowatch.com/table-mobile.php?distribution=ubu…

I don’t usually “trust” vendor support for Linux though…Linux is usually a second-class citizen and “support” means there is either a single grey-beard or an intern that’s answering emails about it. Idk about StudioOne, but unfortunately it’s usually expected to not have feature parity or complete documentation for commercial software on Linux. IME, YMMV, etc.

Pantherina,

They dont support it at all currently but have an experimental version. As if that was too much, with their software costing 200€+

dewritoninja,

I’m pretty sure 22.04 and newer are Wayland.

dewritoninja,

Ubuntu 21.04 uses Wayland by default canonical.com/blog/ubuntu-21-04-is-here

jasondj,

My mistake, then. I haven’t really used Ubuntu much since focal. I was going off the package list in distrowatch.

A7thStone, (edited )

It’s an age old Linux tradition. We argue about window managers, init systems, sound systems, and anything else we can. Often it’s because people have built a hacked together system based on what used to work for them. Relevant XKCD

Pantherina,

Hahaha that damn spacebar heating in KDE 4.2 was really lit

rottingleaf,

And it’s fine when it’s about a roughly equal choice. But Wayland is vastly superior in support and X11 vastly superior in functionality, so I don’t get this argument.

If I could find a compositor for Wayland (and a simple terminal emulator like urxvt, no opengl for acceleration please) as easy and quick to set up as cwm for X11 (with something like dzen2) or fvwm - the issue wouldn’t exist for me personally.

Vilian,

i started using linux 3 years ago because i literally didn’t have nothing better todo ‘-’

TimeSquirrel,
@TimeSquirrel@kbin.social avatar

Kinda just seems like arguing because you have nothing better to do.

When we don't have Windows or Mac users to feel superior against, we will invent issues amongst ourselves.

cybersandwich,

Kinda just seems like arguing because you have nothing better to do.

You don’t seem confused at all. You summed it up nicely.

humdrumgentleman,

And, here me out here: this is a good thing. Nay, a beautiful thing. There are no better things to do because these people care and have a voice. We argue about things for years and make slow progress as people agree or capitulate, and there will always be a fork to avoid those changes people care to enough. No one can just buy the Linux ecosystem and make unpopular changes without broad support. I’m pretty sure a negligible number of people have genuine hatred or prejudice for those using a technology they don’t like. The arguing of Linux and Open Source is a reflection of the most successful form of worldwide democracy ever implemented by mankind.

Flaky, (edited )
@Flaky@iusearchlinux.fyi avatar

Welcome to the Linux community!

Seriously, though. Just use what you want (as long as it’s working and supported, of course). Don’t let anyone here pressure you.

PlexSheep, in Wayland vs X11 be like

I just switched from fedora 39 plasma to green debian, it’s been very pleasant to have “it just works os” take care of things, including X11 just doing it’s regular old thing.

But if course, Wayland is the future and I will happily use it by the time it becomes stable enough for a debian release. Go Wayland!

AnUnusualRelic,
@AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world avatar

This is the way.

Tau,

land

Fal,
@Fal@yiffit.net avatar

Kde plasma 5.27 works great on wayland

NoisyFlake,

Sadly not on NVIDIA hardware :/

PotatoesFall,

what’s green debian? debian with cinnamon?

wfh,

Probably LMDE?

PlexSheep,

Yup, lmde

Pantherina,

So a small tip, dont use Cinnamon XD but everyone uses what they prefer

PlexSheep,

The whole point of using Linux is the freedom that we can use what we want. Don’t play down other DEs you might not like, because the variety is what makes our environment amazing.

Pantherina,

You can use what you want. I just say X11 is not developed anymore really, since years. It is decades old and insecure by design. Wayland just works, if not supported XWayland is chosen automatically.

If you use MacOS or Windows today, you will see that Linux has no permission system at all. This is simply insecure.

wfh,

Debian has had Wayland for ages tho. It’s the default for Gnome since 2019.

PlexSheep,

You’re right, I didn’t think of that. Cinnamon sadly is X11 for now.

pewgar_seemsimandroid, in big deal

calm down before it becomes rocky linux

LainOfTheWired, in Wayland vs X11 be like
@LainOfTheWired@lemy.lol avatar

I would switch if all my DWM patches worked on DWL, but till they write the same patches for DWL I’m sticking with X11

superminerJG,

if all my DWM patches were on DWL

Nothing stops you from making it yourself.

doofy77,

Not everyone has the skill and time to just make it themselves, mate.

LainOfTheWired, (edited )
@LainOfTheWired@lemy.lol avatar

I do have a long term goal of learning C and making an actually good sixel patch, but that’s for ST. Like sure Wayland gets rid of the screen tearing I occasionally get on my old Intel GPU in my laptop, but why would I spend so much time porting patches when X11 when that’s my only gripe with it.

platypus_plumba, in I don't need a declarative operating system for my home server... but it would be fun...

This idea has crossed my mind many times. Thankfully, I’m too lazy to do anything about it.

WeLoveCastingSpellz, in Wayland vs X11 be like

There is no one devoloping for x11 anymore, it is abandonware and dead (even if still usefully sometimes) wayland isn’t the new shiny thing but it has been getting devoloped so so slowly and getting little support, because the focus on x11. Death of x11 is better for everyone

naeap,
@naeap@sopuli.xyz avatar

Is something like barrier/synergy already working with wayland?
I wanted to try it so badly, but controlling multiple computers with one set of keyboard & mouse is quite essential to my workflow.

Also, does X forwarding over ssh work in some way?
Like, can I open remote GUI programs over ssh on my wayland, like on X11? And less important for me, but still, also the other way round?

Thanks upfront!
I have some FOMO here, but last time I checked wayland couldn’t provide me those things, I need for work :⁠-⁠(

jimmycrackcrack, in Steve Balmer quotes

On an old coloured plastic iMac too.

makingStuffForFun,
@makingStuffForFun@lemmy.ml avatar

Herecy

HardNut,

Heracles

Mistrrhappy,

Heresy

makingStuffForFun,
@makingStuffForFun@lemmy.ml avatar

Hear say

jaybone,

Hennessy

Zehzin,
@Zehzin@lemmy.world avatar

Hershey

FuglyDuck,
@FuglyDuck@lemmy.world avatar

Those things were so hideous… and I actually thought they were cool at the time… well. Except OS9 sucked balls.

The power mac versions with the pull-to-open side were cooler. Mostly because there was a space above the PSU had just enough space to accommodate a tub of cottage cheese.

Pop it in on a Friday…. You’d be having class…. Elsewhere on Monday…

slipperydippery, in Steve Balmer quotes

This is great, where are the rest?

BeefPiano,

This is a photoshop, the original from Modern Humorist said something like “when you download MP3s, you’re downloading communism” and it was attributed to the RIAA instead of Microsoft.

Source: I owned the print of this a couple decades ago, and you can probably find Modern Humorist on archive.org

slipperydippery,

Thanks!

WaxedWookie, in Steve Balmer quotes

Based.

sebinspace, in Steve Balmer quotes

Hey Microsoft, your GitHub is showing

Artyom,

If github is still showing, you must be logged in.

diemartin,

github.com/rnicrosoft

(At some point that username existed: don’t know when it was killed)

RoyaltyInTraining, in Steve Balmer quotes
@RoyaltyInTraining@lemmy.world avatar

Anyone know how I can program Anarchism?

wheelie,

Open a git repo.

squaresinger,

dd if=/dev/random of=anarchism bs=1024 count=1024;chmod 755 anarchism;./anarchism

malijaffri,

Holy hell, I need to try this in a vm sometime!

0x4E4F, (edited )

The output is not valid, it won’t do anything… maybe write to a file “anarchism” in the dir in which the terminal was opened.

squaresinger,

I think that emulates anarchism pretty well.

0x4E4F,

Well, not exactly. Anarchism is pretty close to what Socialism is, in terms of distributing labour.

PotatoesFall,

work on decentralized technology like lemmy

Cowbee,

The same way, generally. Work on decentralized, open source software. It’s modern Mutual Aid.

crispy_kilt,

Anarchists are just people who think Stalinism is communism and haven’t read Marx yet

ThePhantomGM,

Allow all code merges automatically

oce,
@oce@jlai.lu avatar

Anarchy is not absence of rules, it’s absence of hierarchy. So you could still collectively agree to certain rules for merges.

uis,
@uis@lemmy.world avatar

Basicaly democracy on steroids

aksdb,

So we could use a blockchain… (/s)

mcmoor,

But then one person disagree with those rules and we’re back to no rules

oce,
@oce@jlai.lu avatar

You can have a majority vote system.

rottingleaf,

Which is not a collective agreement and not anarchism, if it imposes rules on those who voted against.

oce,
@oce@jlai.lu avatar

Is it not possible for the people to all agree to respect the result of the majority vote even if they voted against the motion?

rottingleaf,

Which requires a consensus.

oce,
@oce@jlai.lu avatar

An initial one.

rottingleaf,

Which can be broken at any moment, and no infant is bound by it until they accept it, and they have the choice of not accepting it.

Expecting some aliens to bring us the end of scarcity is similar to this in terms of probabilities.

Norgur,

Open a GitHub repo with a hello world script and accept each and every commit

M500, in Steve Balmer quotes

I was just thinking about why many things on Linux are better. Like the install process on Linux is years ahead of windows.

Then it occurred to me that windows only improves things that can make them money. If you need to install windows, then you can deal with the crappy installer.

Linux devs improve the parts they think need to be better. The decisions are not guided by money and can be made without bias.

cuibono,

This realization somehow amazes and depresses me at the same time

Lmaydev,

The install process on windows is clicking a few buttons.

For the vast majority of users it’s a way better experience.

MonkderZweite,

The install process on windows is clicking a few buttons.

That’s the default tracking experience, if you fall for all the dark patterns. Was a while ago, hunh?

scarilog,

There’s that one screen where you disable telemetry, which I’ve always consider a part of the install process, but is there anything malicious other than that? The process as a whole is quite straightforward in my experience.

Lmaydev,

Again the vast vast majority of users don’t care. And that’s their target audience.

RandomVideos,

From my experience(installing windows 10, 11, linux mint and nobara), installing linux is way easier than installing windows

crispy_kilt,

Linux devs improve the parts they think need to be better. The decisions are not guided by money and can be made without bias.

Sounds pretty communist

avidamoeba, (edited )
@avidamoeba@lemmy.ca avatar

Sounds like the decisions about what to make, how to make it and for whom to make it are done by the people doing the work. 🤔🫢

danc4498,

Most people don’t install windows. It comes pre installed on something they bought. Microsoft probably puts more time into automating the process.

Also, last time I installed windows it was a breeze. I haven’t installed Linux in at least a decade, so I can’t speak for that.

kaboom36,

Try installing debian some time, the installer makes windows’ installer feel like its for a piece of software you got of a sketchy site that wants to install 16 other things not even related to it

hackris,

I mean, sounds exactly like the Windows installer to me

kaboom36,

We must be using different installers then, because between the amount of telemetry you have to turn off, the dark patterns, and the insistence on using a Microsoft account the whole experience reminds me of installing one of those “driver updaters” when I was a kid and before I learned that was a very bad idea

captain_oni,

I trust Bonzi Buddy more than anything made by microsoft at this point.

exocortex, (edited )

Now that you’ve got the idea apply it to everything in capitalist society. Especially if something is owned by shareholders.

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